Many jumped on new patch to patch cycle introduced with ToC instead of expansion cycle we had in Classic, TBC, and Wrath up to Ulduar included. Catch up mechanics are a good thing, brining players back, but it created a culture of hype wave riders and devalued gear acquired from previous tier very fast. Why try at all if the new patch brings new catch up mechanics? Later that design resulted into LFR that Brought additional playerbase instability.
And if you noticed Wrath wasn’t the most sucessful. The late Classic and early TBC was with exponential growth. Wrath had slow increase smoothly running into plateau, despite all favours made to expand gameplay horizon both towards hardcore and casual players. At the moment RDF was introduced the significant growth had almost stopped, so I wouldn’t call it a defying feature.
Lol, you missunderstand it I think. As far as I understood, it’s the opposite: You have to type something in LFG Channel, and then you will be listed in the LFG tool.
It’s basically LFG Bulletin Board.
It is also worth noting that if you count out WoW introduction is some Asian countries (beside China), the population in EU and US was actually steadily declining ever since Ulduar patch. That is a large part of the reasoning for RDF to begin with, there was lack of new players. A situation we have been in since basically month 1 of WoWC.
Many people tie the decline in popularity with RDF, and maybe they are partially correct, but it is very hard to prove really, since the plateau and decline began before RDF, stopped with Cata release and the continued more steeply in Firelands patch (that was considered good by many) than in Dragonsoul (that brought Raid finder). It is by no means clear that the instanced content automation was the main reason behind the decline, although it probably did contribute.
But that’s completely beside the point here. We have a particular set of problems with 5 men content in Classic. Those problems are largely solved by RDF, and will get worse in Wrath without it.
No the text is pretty clear. You have to be listed in the new LFG UI to be able to post in the LookingForGroup global chat channel.
Of course people will get around it by listing themselves for something irrelevant like “group quests in Stonetalon” with a note “ignore me” to be able to use the channel anyway. There will be some addon that will list you as invisible as soon as you log in or something. It’s all so tiresome how much Blizzard doesn’t understand their own game and playerbase.
In fact I’ll make a prediction now. Even before Wrath launch, in prepatch, Bulletin Board addon will get an update where it auto-lists you, and most people will just continue using it for their dungeon needs. Spamming LFG channel and all. Most levelling and heroic dungeon groups in first month of Wrath will be formed exactly as they are now, using LFG spam and Bulletin Board.
No, you can actually read it both ways. Either being listed in the LFG tool requires typing it in LFG-chat (like LFG bulletin board), or typing in the lfg chat requires you to be listed already.
If you think about, what makes sense, it’s definitely the first option, since it already exists in an addon, and the second option also doesn’t “revive an old rule” as he says in the text. I think you should just pssshhh instead acting as if you know better.
Also, the first option makes even more sense, because they probably do it this way, so a few old school people can choose to not use the LFG tool and only read the chat. This would align with their logic so far.
So why can’t Blizzard have hidden # system then. If you register as quest searcher in stone talon mountains then only one who would see your messages would be thouse in stone talon mountains zone and thouse who signed for the same category search. Instantly reduces amount of spam in /4
Yes I know it has downsides. I also would like to know when opportunity to join some heroic with my main arises, even when I am leveling an alt. Neither LFG nor RDF allows it by limiting search only to a certain level range and requering character to be logged in. Only monitoring chat does allow that.
Exactly so what will removing the RDF now change in WotLK? Nothing. The dungeons are how they are. Plus it’s only your opinion that the dungeon finder made the people less social in dungeons. TBC Classic proves you wrong. 90% of dungeon runs I’ve had in TBC Classic were without a single word written in chat. My experience is, if you or another player starts a conversation there will be a conversation, no matter if you run the dungeon with a regular group or with the RDF.
The majority of the players just doesn’t value conversations in dungeons. That’s why conversations only arise when something funny or weird happens.
But I can assure you, the absolute same thing happens with the RDF. I’ve experienced it on warmane. Even though you run with alliance players, that you probably won’t see again and even if you saw them in the world, you couldn’t even communicate with them, I’ve had great experiences and in LBRS one of my best dungeon runs ever. We wiped a lot and since nobody really knew the dungeon we got lost multiple times, but we made fun of that and I’ve never laughed so much in another dungeon run.
Social interactions don’t depend on how you build your group it just depends on if and how you interact. If people experienced less social interactions after the release of the RDF, it’s just because their mindset changed. Suddenly they thought they are running with strangers and stopped initiating conversations. And if nobody initiates a conversation, there will be no conversation.
Exactly. People mostly don’t complain about easy content, because they want harder content. Mostly people complain about easy content, because they want to complain or they want to feel superior.
When I tried to build groups for CoT 1&2 HC, Blood Furnace HC, and Shattered Halls HC, where were all those people demanding a challenge and complaining about easy content? Oh yes I forgot, they were running SP HC and Mecha HC, because those dungeons can be cleared with your eyes closed and one hand tied to your back.
Players don’t want challenges, they want to feel superior. Doing easy content and complaining, that it is to easy makes them feel superior. If you give them an actual challenge, that they might fail, they will complain even more that the game is broken and start to be toxic towards the other players. Because most players never reflect and ask themselves if they are the problem and if they need to improve. But this are usually the players that make the group fail.
Btw I think P2 was a great demonstration, of my point. How many guilds and raids died once they faced a real challenge?
I absolutely agree with you. In TBC Classic people saw Rogue and immediately thought I am a bad player. In fact I usually had better gear, than the people I’ve met in dungeons and I have a lot of experience with my rogue and good situational awareness. I often saved groups from wiping, by tanking the last percents of a boss with evasion or blinding, stunning and kicking and evasion tanking mobs in groups where our tank died.
I was able to carry my weight, plus I could carry 1 or 2 weaker players, depending on the dungeon.
Still people didn’t want me in the group, because I must be bad, because I am a rogue.
A chance to at least prove myself is all I ever wanted in TBC Classic.
Really? I don’t think I’ve run a single dungeon in TBC classic without some activity in chat. Last time I levelled a character from scratch in Retail was in 2017 and I did not make a single contact on my way to max level. Last May (when the TBC patch hit) I levelled from scratch in Classic and I met a lot of people on the way. It was through dungeons that I found my guild, but even as I joined a guild I still maintained contact with people from other guilds as well.
Are you trying to make the argument that people are just as social in Retail as they are in Classic? Because that is blatantly false. Just because people use repetitive jargon in order to find groups doesn’t mean the social aspect of Classic is dead.
Breath in, champ, and read it multiple times loudly. The meaning is ambivalent. It can mean both. You read the less logical meaning out of it, since it also doesn’t allign with the rest of the post/context.
As soon, as it makes click in your head, you’ll be embarrassed for acting up like that
I don’t know how the community in retail is. I didn’t really play retail since legion. I tired to play shadowlands for a week or so, but I just don’t like the new rogue. I didn’t have any community interaction in that short time of shadowlands, so I can’t say anything about the retail community.
Since the announcement of no RDF however I started to play on warmane, which does have the RDF. This and my TBC experience is what my arguments are based on.
And in my experience the changing factor, if there are social interactions or not, is just if somebody initiates them or not.
If someboby initiates a conversation in an RDF group there will be a conversation.
If nobody will initiate a conversation in a group, that was build the regular way, there won’t be a conversation.
If you had so many conversations in dungeons it’s probably, because you often initiate them. I don’t like to conversate, just to have a conversation. If something happens, that as funny or weird I talk about if nothing out of the ordinary happens I just stay quiet. But that doesn’t mean I wouldn’t participate in a conversation somebody else starts.
The main problem is the mindset of people. If you have a mindest like: “Traditional Group = Potential Friends, RDF Group = Strangers I will never see again” of course, subconsciously, you will be less likely to initiate a conversation in the RDF. And because this mindset was present for a large amount of players, the conversations started to die in RDF. Because it’s actually a self fulfilling prophecy. Because if everyone thinks it’s not worth to start a conversation in the RDF, there won’t be conversations in the RDF. And if there are no conversations in the RDF you will feel confirmed, that people in the RDF are just players you will never see again and that are not worth to start a conversation with.
The RDF isn’t to blame for it. It’s the mindest of the players. I don’t differentiate between players in a traditional group or players in an RDF group. Because there actually is no difference. In a traditional group you are unlikely to see most players again, unless you put them on the friendlist and stay in contact. And in the RDF you can also stay in contact with players from other realms if you exchange battletags.
But this way my experience doesn’t change. It’s the same good or bad in the RDF as it is with a traditional group.
If it was the other way around it would say “sending message is requiredto be listed in the ui”
Not to mention all the problems with message formating, keywords, typos… i mean just look at how massive the Bulletin Board setting tab with search patterns is, and even that gets it wrong like quarter of a time because people find new and inventive ways to mistype where their group is going.
Look, I understand I’m probably being trolled, because you can’t at the same time type reasonably well in English as you do and misunderstand a simple sentence so thoroughly.
I am not a native speaker, so I might miss some edge case in the English language here. But to me it reads just one way, no matter how much I read this sentence.
If you have another way to read it, it would be nice if you elaborate it some more, so we can understand and learn.
[…] requires being listed, as in “Going to the gym will require getting muscular.”
^You can read this sentence in 2 different ways, and one of those ways isn’t logical.
There you go. Sometimes you can say the same thing in two different ways. It’s not as precise as in german for example.
The random part of the original LFD , the crossrealm part. Where not gold transactions were possible. It is immensenly necessary today,
This new tool (i dont know how to call it) your are bringing to the game , lack all of this propeties, and judging by how players are using the game right now, it will be exploited for GDKP (heroic) farms and boosting.
Yes but if we just got the content as it was there would’ve been no reason to worry about ramifications etc. because, you know, “nochanges”. None of this would’ve been an issue until we started opening up to the idea of changes in the first place.
I mean, I don’t think the outrage from the playerbase would’ve been as intense as it was if Blizzard just said they’re delaying the introduction of RDF to be somewhat in line with its original introduction, rather than axing it in the name of “TheSpiritOfClassicTM”.
Ok, I get it, you are genuinely misunderstending it then.
The sentence you just wrote means only one thing, that is, that you need to be muscular first in order to go to the gym. In that sense, it is mostly nonsensical, except maybe as a coment on someones insecurity. As in he always thought going to the gym required one to by muscular, so as not to be laughed at.
I am telling you, as an English to Russian and Czech translator with over a decade of experience and a C2 exam in EU framework that that sentence means only one thing. That to post in LFG channel one needs to first be listed in the LFG interface.
And in my personal experience any communcation what so ever in dungeons is literally close to non-existant, and have been for a long time already.
I’d argue though, that that isn’t down to RDF per se. It’s cause of Blizzards goal of making wotlk more casualfriendly. They wanted an easier game for more players to be able to enjoy every aspect of it.
Nope. They said that to be able to use the LFG channel you have to be listed in the LFG first:
There is really one way to read that.
On the contrary. Classic players are just not talking in dungeons, just like in retail. I’d even go as high as 95% of my dungeon runs have been silent apart from an odd “mana” maybe and a “ty” at the end.
And you missed the most important part. Socialising happens not before the run, when people do not even have respect for each other as good players. Neither does in usually have place during the run, although it can happen due to accident wipe and depending on the reaction it could be negative “you are all noobs!” or constructive “allright we need to do that this time”. The social interaction happens after the run is complete. People congratulate winners of good loot, remember a clutch situation where dps saved healer with preciece CC, while tank was under multople mobs pressure kiting for his life and couldn’t help, e.t.c. Then they might wish a good evening or even add each other to friend lists. Several of such runs and social bonds are formed.
With RDF everyone forgets each other characters nicknames the moment party is disbanded. You don’t need to have friends, become a better player or even do the basic communication after the run beyond short calls made during it, because the system will find you a new group on button press that will probably carry you. And if not, if you will be kicked you forget the reason it was made for as you can join the other one, repeat same mistake and think someone will carry you through or you will overgear that content eventually.
Nice fantasy. I made literal hundreds of groups in tbc. Forming them, encouraging people, explaining rudimentary strategy, giving hints to underperforming players, congratulating winners, asking people to pass to someone who needs more etc. It’s incredibly tiresome. You know how many times this happened to me? Zero. Not once. I mean I am sure it happens to tanks all of the time, for obvious reasons. All I get is “thanks for the run”. Sometimes “what an amazing run” even. But majority of people just leave without saying a single word. And that’s it, people are then gone forever. I mean I get familiar names every now and then, and then we greet, say “wow what are the odds, same group 3 times this week” and then we are gone again.
We are literally playing in RDF level of socialisarion right now. It makes it doubly bitter that some made up fantasy is being misused to deny us the best system of WotLK.
instead acting as if you know better.