[H+A - RP] 💟 Galadana's proposal

Argent Dawn
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Hi RPers, I am speaking to everyone who thinks that a cross faction RP is a cool thing and it actualy makes sense.

Before reading further, please hear me out, I understand that there are a lot of unexperienced RPers and there are a lot of RPers who treat it not seriously, you can say it just by looking at their TRP profiles and actions. But there are also a lot of cool RPers and thats why I created this topic. Lets discuss some things.

I am surprised that Dalaran is not as crowded as it can be. It is a neutral territory. It has many cool spots , beautiful locations near it and Underbelly!!! Tongue potions vendor, cool hidden stuff etc
In other words everything that is needed to create some cool cross faction RP stories, plots, events and have fun.

I know that A-RP has more open world-like concept, H-RP is more/only guild based. But I also know that there are many Horde RPers who want to have some area like Stormwind, where there is always somebody to RP with. Since the majority of RPers pick alliance and there are always people in Stormwind, Duskwood, Boralus - new incomming Rpers are more willing to pick Alliance as well, cause nobody wants to RP alone, right…right?) Orgrimmar and Silvermoon are empty 99% of the time, especially if you compare it to Stormwind starting from 19:00. The Alliance capital is bustling with life.

Not all of RPers like the idea of sticking your RP just with one guild, even if it is crowded enough, it feels isolated in one way or another.

So my proposal to the community is to give Dalaran some more love I bet there are a lot of Horde Rpers who would be very fun to RP with. Yesterday I met a group of Vulpera and damn those were cool guys, I want to see more similar groups of RPers who could refresh the current RP state in Dalaran and bring some more life to it.

Just a few sketchy ideas for an example:

  • It is literally the best place for mages to study the arcane
  • Why not further developing Trading RP, there are alrady excisting markets, but why not make it more constant like everyday, black markets in Underbelly etc.
  • brawl can be organazied there too
  • Chamber of the guardian can be used as a place for the Court similar to Stormwind
  • Kirin Tor RP
  • literally a great potential for military RP here, since there can be conflicts between cross faction members that actualy MAKE SENSE!
  • Legerdemain Lounge is a perfect place for bartender and barmaides, it even has a balcony! Filthy animal is a great place to have a drink if you are a Horde member. It has a HUGE fireplace and a lot of space.
  • barbershop, cool small shops for herbalist and for tailors, pick your activity
  • shady organizations in Underbelly, sounds cool (maybe it would be cool for rogue groups to use the uncrowned secret entrance, why not? It looks cool and actualy makes sense)

It is not very hard to organize all of this. Is it bad that everybody will know that there is a place where both factions can find cool RP experience? Why not trying to work on this together?

Tell me your thoughts.

Thank for your time!

Your red haired sin’dorei,
Galadana

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Not everyone would be suited to a city environment. I lead a death knight guild and aside from going to see what the market is selling so we can secure some interesting items for our cause (as well as just have a chill day where we don’t need to talk about killing or rituals all the time), we would not fit this city day to day.

In addition, some guilds I know, both Horde and Alliance, would be bored out of their mind with the city. Its not that the city is a bad place to hang. But I really don’t see orcish war guilds coming to hang in a city that has been primarily human/elven for years.

Let alone the ‘conflict’. There is something about the people who like to dwell in cities that oppose conflict to a degree that they will become… strange about it. This isn’t me pointing fingers at any single group, this is based on experience seen in Orgrimmar and Stormwind previously.

Those who like conflict will be annoyed by those who don’t like conflict. And it often leads to strange encounters where you either have people ignoring emotes, yelling oocly, throwing temper tantrums, or god emoting.
People who dwell in cities like this have a reason they are often labelled 'Second Life roleplayers". Its not everyone’s cup of tea.

And finally, the current Dalaran community is a mixed bag. You have some fun people to interact with and they are wonderful to talk to. But you also have:

  • Weird ERPers who have to heavily sexualize their character to the point it becomes awkward to be near
  • Generally unpleasant people with a history of poor roleplay because of past behaviour
  • Every second shop selling a love potion or fertility items.
  • Children RPers.
  • Very, very outlandish or nonsensical character concepts just walking the streets.

This is not to tarnish the community with the same brush, yet bad apples exist there for sure.

Finally, and this is more of a personal conflict yet it should be brought up:
The community there is somewhat hostile already.

I am part of a community known as the PCU, and previously, a guild in our community went to Dalaran for a simple roleplay event for their own story. What they got was one of the community storming up to them, demanding that they leave “THEIR” shop right now (When they weren’t even in ‘their’ shop to begin with), going on an OOC tirade at them in /s and then proceeding to block the entire guild while ranting on to their community about how bad the PCU is.

There is an animosity already with the current community housed there and if Dalaran wishes to see more people come around, it would be best to simple drop the anger and simply RP.

But that won’t happen very soon. And no doubt that this will draw their ire because, like I said, they dislike the PCU vocally…

I commend your efforts to try and get the RP going. But I feel that your effort to promote RP should also be informed of the situation that is currently there.
Perhaps instead, start small?
Give reasons for people to arrive.

I believe a massive cooking festival could be a good draw. Or an eating contest. Something that can be appealing to multiple crowds.
And perhaps, maybe asking those who are a bit on the ERP side to… go away?

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First of all, awesome to see the initiative Galadana. I’ll get into the points that I personally find tricky in a second, but it’s genuinely cool of you regardless.

Not getting into “who likes and do not like city RP” in general, yet this particular snippet does make for a genuine challenge in choosing any single, shared hub.

Setting aside the outliers who would pretty much always be hard pressed to fit into everyday city RP (Death Knights, Demon Hunters, similarly unsociable types of characters), you’re still left with a broad selection of races and themes across the board. Horde warbands, militaristic knights, rugged mercenaries, elven rangers, studious mages, dark-arts practicioners, commoners and merchants, serene druids - I’m sure you get the idea.

In contrast, Dalaran is a fairly niche location on paper. It’s the city of magic, a place of higher arcane learning above all else. While you could conceivably make up reasons for most types of characters to pass through on their way to other destinations, it becomes trickier when the topic is that of a permanent RP hub for everyone. Because not everyone fits into a city to extraordinary as Dalaran, and ultimately end up doing their own character and the city itself a disservice in trying to force the matter.

This isn’t to say that Dalaran couldn’t and shouldn’t be used for any non-mage RP at all. It is currently the base of operations of a campaign if I’m not mistaken, and those are the kinds of instances where a stay in the Kirin Tor’s city would make sense to pretty much every participant.

Ultimately I see two ways one might go about this.

One is to continue the work towards a mutually shared hub for as broad a selection of RPers as possible, and choosing a location better suited to such than Dalaran. If I had a contender in mind I’d share it right here and now, but frankly, it seems a tall order so recently after the Fourth War.

The other is to accept that it would be a massive undertaking, and that drawing people to Dalaran (outside of its current, more or less permanent community), might be a matter of playing to the city’s strengths. As I mentioned earlier it is the place to go in matters related to magic; why not emphasize this with events tailored towards scholars and magi in particular? I know this is already the case to some extent at least, and it seems like a reliable RP hook to me.

Aaaand seeing as the cat is out of the bag… yeah, this should be said no matter which approach is ultimately chosen. On the few evenings I’ve hit up Dalaran on an alt during its market/tavern events, what ultimately sent me packing was the Tindr vibe several characters projected to varying degress.

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Arguably Dalaran’s most interesting feature, but also one which can be at odds with it being a cross-faction hub. The more you focus on markets and casual interactions, the more this aspect feels like its being pushed to the background when it should be Dalaran’s primary identity.

The fatigue is going to be very real if this happens. The weekly market already feels incredibly samey, to the point I generally only recommend people to check it out every few weeks, there just isn’t enough new things to keep it interesting so frequently. I also think shopkeepers are going to have a burnout if they decided to do this.

The Broken Isles are not at war, so outside of the occasional campaign, why would military forces hang about in a neutral hub like Dalaran? A floating city of scholars is one of the worst places for troops to be garrisoned.

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Yeah I agree with alot of the points made, I think Dalaran’s community may have hit its peak already or not far off, for now atleast with current population, like others stated outside of mages and perhaps civvie rp’ers alot of other types dont have much reason to be there on a day to day basis, outside of course the current campaign being hosted there, alooooot of ppl rp as mercs/knights/soldiers/warband types, its a pretty huge chunk of the rp community, and those types dont have much reason to be there regularly and in all fairness alot of those types are also invested in the Horde/Alliance conflict(Even if there is meant to be a treaty, its all but ignored by most ofc, in order to ensure conflict rp is still a thing) so warband 1 could turn up and knightly order 1 could turn up and because they have previous the beautiful city of Dalaran turns into a bloodbath for the night, I’m sure the Kirin Tor wouldnt be huge fans of that.

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Even disregarding what Dalaran is, there’s the matter of what Dalaran has been.

A site of a genocide aimed at members of the Horde, a traditionally Alliance-leaning (even for a while directly ruled by an Alliance figurehead) kingdom, Human (and other Alliance races) majority, and only ever focused on the arcane thus offering nothing for the more shamanistic/spiritual faction, the Horde.

I honestly struggle to think of any reason for most any Horde member that isn’t a mage (and even then, Suramar seems a better option in every way) to go to Dalaran voluntarily.

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This. Admittedly many are aware that Dalaran just houses where the Uldum community moved to. - Without naming any names, there is a good reason why many are cautious to be around such a scene.

However- if those issues were resolved, Dalaran would make a wonderful RP hub, especially for characters focused on academia. - However right now such just sadly isn’t a viable option for many people.

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those are both things I am doing the coming days. But as mentioned by Tenasa here before, if it only ends with encountering erp’ers or people throwing an ooc tantrum because you dare to use “their” place, then it sure makes it hard to enjoy the city.

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Another great point mentioned aye, Dalaran for all its “neutrality” isnt very neutral historically, its barely neutral more a “we’ll tolerate -some- Horde on occasion, if we need to because world ending threat ect”, way more tailored toward the Alliance and high elves/humans, Orc shamans/Tauren Druids/Blood elves who remember the genocide ect dont really have all that much reason to go there anyway, Suramar is a perfect substitute for Horde aligned mages/scholars and then for spiritual types such as Druids and Shamans, well they have other spots anyhow that are waaaaay more suitable for their theme/needs, and then ofc the huge aspect already mentioned, alot of erp’ers/unsavoury types.
Edit: and to add to that, preference aswell, as mentioned already a huge portion of the rp community mostly engage in war/conflict/travelling rp and only really stop by in cities for short periods either to recruit or to engage in some short story/thingy there and then back off out into the wild/roads to carry on what they do, and with Jaina massacring a bunch of Blood Elves in Dalaran and it basically going unpunished, I cant imagine alot of Blood Elven scholars would want to go there, given Silvermoon is also a utopia of magical knowledge/learning, the Horde Elves have cities that are tailored to that, they are masters of magical knowledge/learning/scholarly pursuits themselves, most of what Dalaran knows likely came from Elven scholars, doubt they really need Dalaran to continue to advance in their learning/mastery of magic, and would no doubt have amped up on that since the Dalaran massacre/exiling of Elves.

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Dalaran is a good hub.

Yes, it has unsavory types, but still considerably less than Stormwind, Lordaeron and yes, the over and lol worthy RP policed Valley of honour in Orgrimmar…

The reason so many Horde players go there, when not magi is because the Valley of honour became so quiet (pre vulpera nonsense), and frankly, hostile. RP’ers choose the path of least resistance with maximum self enjoyment over drama and dead hubs.

So yeah, Devils advocate. Dalaran remains a considerably more pleasant hub compared to stormwind and orgrimmar, as well as lacking the political or factional drama/hostility forced on people by some other players. I don’t care if you get silly concepts or odd cross faction team ups.

People are having fun, leave them to it. And I wish the OP luck in adding on to (not replacing) the RP there.

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I myself am trying to get more focus on the Underbelly, using old Dalaran in Northrend since it’s bigger and doesn’t have any of the draw backs of the new one.

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Stormwind and Ogrimmar arent really even comparible as hubs, I disagree on Dalaran being better than Stormwind but again, each to their own/preference ect, and I do agree that Stormwind has more unsavoury types but then again its also about three or four times as populated, and yes that is a random bs stat I made up, but fly over both at peak times n Im sure you’ll agree

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Not nearly as laggy for 1, which is a huge bonus already.

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I don’t think anyone had planned an RP Inquisition* in Dalaran, so much as adding to the hub’s already existing activity. Feel free to correct me if I missed a quote to that effect.

(Except perhaps for the wildly inappropriate stuff, to which I say good riddance.*)

This is honestly my main concern with turning Dalaran into a generic RP hub. It comes at a risk of killing what sets the city apart from pretty much everywhere else.

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Dalaran having regularly market nights is great, because for alot of people who go to market things its not even what you purchase that is the reason you go, its the rp, its the bartering/haggling, the lil deals you may get, random convos inbetween with either other customers or traders ect, Dalaran has a cool theme for those into that sort of stuff and I agree it shouldnt change to much, maybe a few weirdos could do with leaving but you get that in any hub, its likely never going to be a huge hub without a few weirdos, is what it is, but yeah everyone who’s into that kinda stuff goes there already as is, its just huge military type groups that tend to avoid it for the most part, for the reasons already given.

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More in reference to how some stated the citys primary focus should be arcane and scholar focused. Which is fine, that’s what Dalaran is.

But it gives off the silent suggestion “anything else should not be in Dalaran”.

If those non kirin-tor people upped and moved, the hub would shrivel and die, as they form the majority. Perhaps its really just a matter of mages hosting more magic oriented initiatives to balance things out, adding to rather than removing :man_shrugging: :mage:

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Well yeah, anytime you get a load of civvies hosting civvie related stuff like markets/shops/taverns ect it adds alot more life to the scene, that stuff never has to cease or go, even if its not something some people may be into, it adds to the immersion when wandering a city anyhow.

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I think the problem with that comparison is that Dalaran is noticeably smaller. You can get from any part of Dalaran to any other part within a two minute RP walk (or much less if you’re running), Stormwind covers a much larger space and the unsavoury sorts are typically relegated to the docks or the trade district where most other RPers hang out. I’ll personally admit that when I see certain individuals hanging about Dalaran it’s fully put me off of the idea of playing there, despite having an apprentice/novice mage character who is very much suited for the floating magical DnD city.

Still, anything that lessens the amount of faux-Arabic/Turkish speaking RP or vulperan child RP in Dalaran is an initiative I can get behind, and if things move away from the stuff I personally find uncomfortable and some more ‘normal’ RP happens then you’ll most likely catch me there!

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And I in turn think that a poor comparisson. One or two individuals as you put it, is a far, far cry from two (and my opinion a whole city) entire districts being arguably if not entirely overrun with deeply disturbing activities. Orgrimmar is a flip side to the coin, it has no quality rp to compare to as nobody is left there (though do correct me if untrue I’ve not looked in some weeks now).

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Everyone knows to ignore the thirsty TRPs in Stormwind though, those lot in Dalaran unfortunately have quite a bit of sway/pull to them. You can see it with their near-constant presence on the events tab on the Argent Archives - which in turn is actually why I stopped using that website as nothing they run is of interest to me given some of the questionable content I’ve seen present from them in the past.

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