We have the worst single target in the game, we have very lackluster AoE (even in our target cap range), we are not pressing a rotational ability (blade dance) if we aren’t specced into first blood because thats a big dps loss single target and we are no longer brought to raids for our debuff because vengeance is the top tier spec.
Couple of solutions to make us more useful (not even aiming for top tier here but trying to make our spec worth to play again).
*Reduce the fury cost of blade dance/make first blood (talent) baseline so we can actually press the button single target again when we are not talented into first blood.
*Metamorphosis from 4min cd to 3min so we can actually play m+ and have cd’s for bosses like every other god dam class in the game has.
*Fury regeneration on immolation aura baseline again like it was in bfa, god knows why u took that away from us.
*Flat damage buffs
Last and most desperate solution, add another demon hunter dps spec (ranged pls like in diablo). This one is just too garbage to play.
8 Likes
Diablo one wouldn’t make sense. Demon Hunters don’t use bows. It should just be a spec built around throwing Fel and Shadow spells while sitting in Metamorphosis.
2 expansions without another spec for dh’s is below all expectations; and i didnt even have one.
Having another caster class would be good.
An agi+int caster would be cool. so we’d still use our agi gear but could opt for int trinkets and would make dh’s a bit more fun in torghast and could do fun (remember that word, blizz?) janky builds
If blizzard fails and can’t even fix Havoc how the hell are they supposed to design a new viable spec for DH? The design team ain’t good enough for that
2 Likes
Anything will do better than havoc at this point.
Hey, just want to add that we are garbage in arena as well, since you forgot it in the title.
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Sorry I do not play arena hence the reason I’m not addressing it this topic, talking of personal experience and logs here in pve 
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I just hope blizzard wont nerf vengance so both specs can be on sam level - useless.
To be honest Im plaing havoc mainly and im having lot of fun in pvp and pve too, specially in m+. Im not that far behind in raids neithwr mainly cause almoat all of my gear is haste/versa but I do feel the differance when compared to other classes with their bis stats too. Maybe someday it will change but untill then I will focus on pvp/m+ and probably will play vengance more, its rly fun too.
He said if they nerf vengeance, we will have 2 trash specs. Read it clearly
Oh yea just noticed, sorry its late 
I do think they are going to nerf vengeance because they out dmg other tanks/ their mobility is too good/ and their mitigation some people say we can Facetank everything and thats not entirely the case but ye i am afraid that vengeance will be nerfed to the ground
Its the kyrian degree for vengeance that is making them strong in the dps area. I dont think vengeance needs a nerf but maybe that skill needs little tweaking. Though that being said as long as boomkins are keeping their ridiculous convoke the spirits no other class covenant ability should be nerfed.
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im just really curious what he means about DHs having lackluster AoE … since as kyrian DHs we have crazy high AoE bursts as Havoc and crazy high aoe bursts as Vengence 
even higher if you bothered to get anguish leggo.
Exactly what I meant, we have lackluster AoE. Blade dance resource cost is super high, eye beam dmg is nowhere near what it used to be(scales down the more targets u hit), we are target capped and havoc usually doesn’t go kyrian, we play venthyr. Vengeance AoE is bonkers.
Well if you want to do better in raids you dont go kyrian and not all of us play vengeance. Some of us havent given up on havoc yet. Im venthyr so i dont get any extra boost with my covenant ability to my aoe abilities.
Someone who has done 3 m+ saying havoc have crazy high aoe bursts lol. I’m 217 and 985 rio, we don’t have high aoe burst
I honestly like havoc a lot even now. If cycle of hatred could be changed to every third chaos strike reduces eye beam CD by 3 sec to get rid of the rng and make the “baseline” a bit less rng heavy it would flow a lot better i think.
Sometimes getting lots of resets makes getting none for 3 full fury bars feel punishing.
And please give us some light cleave like immolation aura lets chaos strike cleave to 2 more targets for 50% of the damage.
I think that and some ST buffs would make the spec already flow and feel better
Anybody thinking otherwise?
2 Likes
I honestly couldn’t care less about the Aoe/Cleave, we need single target improvements and blade dance cost needs to be lowered or it’s damage significantly increased to the point where I still want to press it single target, It’s one of havocs most iconic and cool looking abilities but we’re just not using it ever because its just too inefficient single target (would like to add without first blood talent it still feels clunky to use in aoe situations)
Another major issue with the spec is the 4 minute meta cooldown, every single spec in the game has either a way of reducing their main offensive spell’s cooldown, a shorter cooldown or multiple cooldowns to use. All we have is meta that we barely ever press because it’s on cd all the time. Let me use my cd’s like every other class in the game can. 3 minutes should already be a great start, or a way of reducing its cooldown would also be very interesting to see.
I totally disagree with you.Havoc is really useful.You have interupt,aoe stun,spell steal,darkness.I have met two realy good DHers at m14.Everything depends from the player.If the player is a garbage tear he won’t improve.
That looks more like a warlock, we already have a warlock. They should keep us as mele, with them Illidan glaives, just a 3rd dps spec which gives us options… I really dont know what were they thinking when they added nerf after neft, after nerf to dh 
Sure people will say “look at tren and mvq” yeah they are good but they are also playing with one of the best healers/dps in the world, not everyone has that hardcore groups 