Heroic -> M0 is too steep?

I’m 475 ilvl tank, mostly blue items from easily available sources. I farmed heroics for the last few days, and they’re extremely easy and boring. I usually get 5-8 packs of trash to aoe them down, ignoring most of mechanics. No problems, no deaths, like heroics always were since pandaria.

Today I tried to jump into M0 and it was like another world of difficulty. It’s doable, but it’s like jumping from LFR to heroic raid. I’m aware that they made old +10 to M0, but I think they gone too far with that. Don’t get me wrong, I’m all for challenge and I would genuinely enjoy that dungeon in the party of friends, but pugs just leave after first few wipes. In the previous patches, I was able playing on new toon to move from heroics to M+, it was absolutely accessible curve when you roflstomp +2 - +6, learning your class, learning dungeon mechanics, acquiring gear and gradually rise to +20. I’ll climb the current patch ladder, but I think that many people won’t.

What’s your experience with new M+? May be I was unlucky or picked particularly hard dungeon? I could imagine that for people with BiS gear from previous patch, with tier sets, good trinkets, legendaries it’s not that hard, but for new characters with mostly random gear and bad skill that feels different.


I mean you got that one right, it even drops heroic crests (:

I’ve not really experienced it but anecdotally I think you’re right.

Previously the curve was barely noticable. Do a +2 or a +5 or even a +8 and you could barely tell the difference except you probably timed things with a few minutes less.

Now a +2 (and by extension m0) if you truly screw up the mechanics you’re dead. You can’t hide or easily get carried, everybody needs to pull their weight a lot more and its very telling.

I’ve cleared up to +8’s with people around 490. I’ve also been in +2’s with people higher than that where it was a struggle.

I like the new m0 tbh, finally it makes sense tbh.

1 Like

It made me considering my life choices after ~20 heroics that do nothing to me on an off role, and not having even seen a M0 boss yet since the groups fall apart since i am not good enough for it.

Currently considering my alts will all be my main role. Heroic->M0 is too big of a gap to learn and get into a newish spec and role. I was never able to fast be on +10 keys in a season on new specs.

I agree and I’ve said the same elsewhere. I’m glad I did the current dungeons in s1 and s2 because learning mechanics for the first time with the current difficulty scaling seems punishing.

1 Like

You are 100% correct. They should have left m0 and just tweaked m+ imo. Heroics give 476 ivl, Mythics give 493, then +2 is only 496, so there is a huge gap. And honestly, it’s ruined dungeons for me =/ I used to like m0, even the occasional m+2 as they were relatively quick, nice to gear my alts and not particularly daunting. Now they take ages, half the people still think they can just blast them when they can’t and it makes the weekly quest for 4 mythics extremely time consuming to do on multiple characters.

I get that m+ people may want harder stuff or that system needed more balance etc, but they should have just altered m+. M0 should be ever so slightly below Normal raid difficulty imo…

1 Like

I did some m0 on this ~470 ilvl prot warrior and they feel about 25% harder than heroic dungeons. They pose absolutely no challenge at all.

m0 is not meant to be a proper learning curve.

proble of most people is - they just dont want to learn.

they want to just join m+ regardless of anythign and get boosted.

thats why this system will never work - because good players have 0 incentive to boost weak ones in m0 besides weeks like this - and even then they just group up and like smash ruby 0 x4 .

m+ is just to hard - they should remove any keys above like +5 or +6 and mythic raiding and move it to like "champion realmss " only for pros - and leave general game much easier like it was back in classic times.

I am not a M+ player at all (since the end of Legion), but doing “Emissary of War” was a real struggle. When in season 3, finishing 4 M0 dungeons was an hour’s time, now it’s at least 1.5h or even 2. I don’t need to spend that much time just for M0 (especially when I have several alts). The gap from heroic mode to M0 now is way too big. It can be like M5 in season 3, but like M10 makes it way too challenging for players who are not into M+ keys.

This topic was automatically closed 30 days after the last reply. New replies are no longer allowed.