Homophobia in roleplay needs to cease

While I completly understand your points and agree with quite alot of them, I wouldnt exactly call them a facist for thinking diffrently. Certainly opinions I disagree with, and seeming a little bit pretentious with the whole “It’s just -my- characters opinions”.

But I don’t think, or hope, this person in particular has any malicious believes behind this and that they’re a facist for what they wrote.

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Id hope not myself, but as to your point, I disagree, again, its a case of, if you have that stance then keep it to yourself. Its 2020 people who dislike certain things being present need to just learn to shut up and put up or go.

Justification for such behaviour is just an eeire way of protecting disturbing ideals from what they really are.

Oh, I apologise for not making myself clearer, I actually agree with this you’re saying here! While people are completly fine to have their opinions and in most cases also voice them, with this particular thing, yeah just keep it to yourself. It’s very dated. Let people love who they want!

Again, apologies for not making myself clearer and being confusing. :frowning:

The important part of writing bigotry into fiction is that you are purposefully introducing bigotry into the world by writing that story. That is something that requires two things - a damn good reason, and the responsibility to carefully tell that story in such a way that it isn’t hurting often already marginalised people.

“It’s what the character believes” is not a defense, because you made the character believe that.

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So far I’ve personally not seen any good reason. The main reason that is brought is “but why can’t I do it??? If I can’t do this, then we shouldn’t rp at all! It’s just IC!”

Nah its fine, I just worry theres alotta people trying to play the “Its a sexual issue” counter argument and that is not what the topic is about. Its also a really sinister way of trying to be soft homophobe without needing to say it outright.

I sure wish forced coitus would stop being roleplayed out or repeatedly brought up in roleplay but I’m always told that it’s absolutely integral to many characters and stories. Maybe the line could be drawn at people taking their erotic fictions outside the game.

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Yeah, I understand your concerns and they are valid!

The fact that we still need to have these discussions in 2020 at all just shows how much further there is to go, and in the last…4 years or so, it’s like a scarily large portion of the world just went “Nope, not this!” and wanted to(and in some parts has) just regressed all the years of progress.

I’ve seen people I grew up with that I thought used to be sweet get really vile and nasty and absolutley mental over just being told “Hey, I didnt like that joke. It’s kinda dated.” or something similliar. Reactions like if I insulted their family’s honour or threateend them with murder or something.

You cannot compare stories such as this to roleplay. The former is a structured creation by a single (or in a collaborative work multiple) author(s). The latter is spontaneous interaction between multiple, often unaligned individuals.

That’s an odd example since people don’t just start stories in the middle.

Even if they did however the book, even during the paragraph in question would have some indication towards the context of the situation.

Most good reasons for writing bigoted characters don’t apply to RPing, because in RP you control one character at a time. In a story I might want to introduce a racist character, to give an example, because the story I want to tell is about overcoming racism.

In RP, I’m either the racist or the target. And neither is good.

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This is a very interesting topic, not seen it been discussed before on argent dawn forums personaly.

It is also interesting too see the opinions people having or what people have to say bout it.

For some reason its a sensitive subject but hope people can be understanding and mature too have a understanding of this topic.

But certainly i see no reason too have a homophobic character, Seriously Never.
I much prefer a person that is kind and loving too be very honest!

Love is Love :blue_heart:

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This is a very good point yeah!

An author writing a piece of work about the main character going through such life experiences is IMO fine - as long as the intent is actually writing a story about how there are people (eg in countries with strong homophobia / conversion camps etc) who go through this, not a veiled attempt to live out homophobia in text.

I’m quite sure those stories actually exist - and the payoff where they realise they’ve been wrong and so on can very well be cathartic.

The difference is - the main character caves in the end and hopefully realises they’re wrong, makes amends and rights the wrongs etcetera, instead of continuing on a hateful path.

The storyline vaguely would also be known beforehand, through reviews or just synopses, so if those stories would be hitting too close to home for some people, they can avoid it while still having these kinds of stories heard.

However - these stories have no place in WoW because of already mentioned reasons. Roleplayers create a story that fits the universe. Homophobia does not fit in Azeroth.

And I’m not sure if I’d want to read such a story anyway if there’s no satisfying conclusion and instead reads like someone’s actual vitriolic homophobia. I’d also wonder why one would resort for pseudonyms. With any books - you need to read through it to make up your own opinion, and I’d feel disgusted if all that I had been reading was just full of hate and nothing else, despite how real the stories can actually be.

Bruh you never heard of a beard??? He can do his kingly duty and then get back to making puppy dog eyes at whatever guy or gal takes his fancy.

Also Baine, by the same token, “needs” to continue the Bloodhoof line. It’s not as if we know about any branch families or anything like that.

Irony for you, im a very conservative person, so for ME to legitimately tell people that such behaviour is completely stupid is pretty much a monumental testament to how far progression has come in this world.

And its exactly that reason I find this kind of behaviour abhorent, people just want to make it an issue to take away the reality that it is not an issue to rp this kinda thing.

You wanna rp a gay effeminate male character you go RIGHT ahead, its fine, its not going to hurt anyone in todays age save a few cringe offended idiots who think they see someone rping something and cant seem to fathom that… like them, they are also rping a fantasy they enjoy.

As to this argument of writing and character development being the justification, here is my counter argument:

If you wish to create your own fantasy world with rules/laws regulations about these struggles be my guest, this is a game with an interactive audience that can be upset by poor choice behaviour and will almost certainly not tolerate it.

Again, the kinda thing people are justifying as things like “My character might devleop into being gay after being in denial” is just a stupid point, no value comes from trying to argue that such things even EXIST in wow to begin with.

The light doesnt suddenly go around yelling “The homosexuals must be purged” or that nonsense and its a pretty stupid way to defend such behaviour.

Its why I dearly hope that future expansions begin breaking the boundries between racial disdain so people can shut up about this already, have some void characters that are good, light chars that are evil, fel characters that are good, titans that are evil, break convention and show us the world is more than just its steriotypes.

However, that is for them as a game developer to do, not us, and our role as rpers, yes, we can create stories, we can build worlds, we can create journies and destinations but we have NO right to gatekeep peoples right to their romantic feelings or just emotional ones to a significant other.

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It’s not that ironic as it is nice :smile: and something you got right on the nail. I also think people forget that conservative doesn’t have to mean being a racist, homophobic bigot. I have friends and family who are more conservative, yet they also support equality and LGBTQ+ rights and we can agree on things and get along fine!

And overall otherwise, your points overall are all great and you like pretty much everyone else gets a :blue_heart: since I’m out once again and kinda need to let them build up for a couple of hours.

I think SW has like a million orphans already, I’m sure they could adopt! WoW has had a a narrative before focusing on that family isn’t always blood.

I think the idea of anduin adopting is ridiculous. The whole idea is he has royal blood so he has to have a child to pass that royal blood on. Adopting doesnt do that. Keep him straight pls

Nah, it’s instead more powerful to actively show that the idea of power being passed through bloodlines (which is, shall we say, a little fash) is nonsense and adoption is good

Nope, he’s gay now sorry

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No, he doesn’t

Yes I agree, that’s why “needs” is in airquotes.

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