How to please everyone, possible?

[Vaëyn-ravencrest (Vaëyn)]

Lots of WM complaints here and in general forum. But positive stuff too. How to please everyone?

I personally am happy with WM, love it as is. So when I see complaints, it’s an effort to see their point of view. We all pay our subs though… is it possible to make it good for everyone?

Maybe we need to think about the different types of WM player. Each type has something they want or don’t want in WM. Changes could help one type, but should not badly affect another. Which type are you? Did I miss a type out?

1. PvEer - This type wants the WM bonus and is not really interested in PvP. They have accepted the “risk” though, and presumably don’t mind an occasional fight. They don’t like being overly slowed down completing PvE content.
2. PvE/PvPer - This type wants to PvP, but also wants to get PvE done in a timely manner. Similar issue to type 1 then.
3. Arena/BG PvPer - This type does a lot of rule based PvP, and wants fair fights in WM as well. WM is not fair though, it has no rules.
4. RP WPvPer - This type likes WPvP, but incorporates their own rules into WM. For example they don’t like being ganked at an FP. They don’t like it when other players ignore their rules.
5. WPvPer - This type likes WPvP and doesn’t mind the no rules nature of WM. Might be happy with extra rewards or things to do in WM.

I used to think WM was for type 5’s, but, no, it’s for all the types.

There are lots of suggestions for improvements to WM. But how to make an improvement that satisfies all of the above types. For example, types 1 to 4 don’t like being ganked, type 5 wants to gank. Making ganking not possible or restricted = forum complaints from type 5’s.

The above complexity is why it’s not a simple thing to “fix” WM. Because a certain % don’t want it “fixed” and another % do. I suspect any changes that actually happen will be simple ones. What realistic changes might help - all the player types?

[Moothilda-aszune (Moothilda)]

I don’t have any idea what could help, as many of the problems is as diverse as the people playing it.

I am player number 2 - I never turn pvp on when I go for achivements, the guild chat is lively or I fish (I really like to fish, and hate to be disturbed while doing it ).

When I turn on PvP I really really hope that someone sees me, because I want to fight (I don’t expect to win, because I s*ck at PvP), and I don’t care if I get attacked while questing.

I don’t mind getting ganked, I can live with 40 vs 1.
But as someone stated in a post in general, I would love to see players that are a certain lvl below you turn honourless when killed - I know it won’t stop ganking the little ones, but maybe it will reduce it in some areas.

And I would love to see any buff’s or extra rewards removed, so only those who want to PvP is the one who enteres it - If raid parties is what is needed to get new PvP’ers in the game, I welcome it.

But I also think, that people just have to ajust.
There will always be complainers, those who want to have it all and no matter the change, they will see the flaws in it - we can’t make WM perfect.

[Coolgroove-defias-brotherhood (Coolgroove)]

Hmmm… So it’s Five for me, nice
But I would love PvP progression system in WPvP (and PvP overall) - conquest as a currency and PvP vendor that sells all items (not just Azerite), instead of current rewards, or in addition to them.

Back to solutions:

For a past few days I started to notice something that I didn’t see before - there is some kind of phasing at some Flight Masters and Emissary NPCs. Players in melee range of them just disappear, and appear again when they leave melee range of NPC.

I’m not into camping much, so maybe it’s happening for some time already, but last week when I landed at camped Seeker’s Vista - there wasn’t anything like that.

So far, I noticed this behavior at:

• Seeker’s vista, Flight Master
• Seeker’s vista, Tortollan Emissary NPC
• Brennadam, Stormsong Emissary NPC
• Tortollans Flight Master in Vol’dun, but only once yesterday. Today it was regular and nobody disappeared.

Nothing like that happens at Tortollan WQ - they all work like before. Nobody vanishes, all visible and attackable.

If it’s something Blizzard is working on - I think for players 1-4 it could be a good solution:

• if you’ve just landed, and not in combat, then nobody sees you and cant “kill on land”.
• if you managed to get to Emissary NPC without combat - same.
• if you leave melee zone and there are campers - it’s player’ choice to engage or run.

But only if it doesn’t touch any other part, so only improve situation with main complain - “I’m getting killed by raid on FP land / loading screen”. WQs and other areas should not have this kind of “phasing cloak”.

[Vaëyn-ravencrest (Vaëyn)]

Ye, not so easy to please everyone. Any suggestion, for the purpose of this post, has to be acceptable to each player type. But also be something that Blizz would realistically implement. Who knows what Blizz are actually working on though, or have already done hehe.

It’s good to put ideas out there… but can they survive my types test!
Another thread was talking about raids, and to me raids seem the biggest issue. LFG is the big unbalancer in WM shards. How to deal with that.

A simple change would be when a raid is formed, move it to it’s own “RAID” shard. (Edit: 2 raids per WM zone.) Then when an opposing raid is formed, move it into that raid shard with yours. In my experience, players in a raid want a battle. That’s often why things like FP camping get started, to attract a Horde raid for a big fight. This idea could make things like FP camping less of a thing, and give those that want a big battle an efficient way to do that. As long as it’s all as seamless as possible. Pros and cons though… for example, how long to wait for opposing raid to join your raid shard. But we wait right now anyway for opposing raid to form, and often it doesn’t form. Probably could be wangled to make it all work. But keep it all seamless as possible.

I say “simple”, Blizz would probabaly say… “that’s not a simple change!” hehe!

[Coolgroove-defias-brotherhood (Coolgroove)]

Yes, balancing shards not only on overall number of players, but also by type of groups they are in and how many in raid - nice, can work.

@Vaëyn-ravencrest

I say “simple”, Blizz would probabaly say… “that’s not a simple change!” hehe!

Yeah, I don’t think it’s as simple as it seems.
Especially to make it all as seamless as possible.

[Moothilda-aszune (Moothilda)]

I could see the fun in having every raid party moved to the same spot, I just wonder what would happen when that raid shard crashes due to all of those parties - maybe some will avoid being in raids and form smaller parties and still work together.

I sometimes wonder if we have too many pvp options: We have battlegrounds, arenas and war mode.
We also have soooo many places we can lvl up an quest too.

I personally can’t see any problems with WM, but the world is too big and the opportunities are too many.
WM needs some love in the PR-department. So people will gather in WM and like the world with no rules.

[Wispr-outland (Wispr)]

Restore PVP servers, make WM only for PVE servers.
No % buff for PVP servers, we dont want that shiet.
Remove option to serverchange from PVE to PVP servers.
Remove x-realm between PVP and PVE servers.

This way the crybabies can toggle on WM and still not get attacked by opposite faction, just like they want it.

OR, u can add an additional popup warning when u toggle on WM:
Warning! u can get attacked by the other if u play WM on, if you dont want this, pls toggle off!

Also add a 1 week CD on turning WM on and off.

[Vaëyn-ravencrest (Vaëyn)]

@Moothilda

I meant one raid per faction in each WM shard zone, it would have to juggle a new raid in when opposing one disbands… but ye, some day… some day… a single WM shard for all raids in one spot. If they could get the server to handle it, that would be awesome! Never lol. MInd you, my brain can barely handle a 40 raid without getting a 1000 yard stare hehe.

@Wispr

Eh, not bad idea to restore PvP servers and have WM only on PvE. We lost some good aspects of PvP servers… like consistently seeing the same players. Gotta say tho, WM has been much more wpvp active for me than PvP realm. I’d probably stick with a PvE realm, would have to see the diff.

EDIT

Another idea…

Easy Mode!

I already posted this idea in the old forum. Maybe not a simple change for Blizz though.

Have two modes in WM, easy and hard.

Hard mode, same as current WM except no bonus.

Easy mode, incorporate all the ideas being floated by non WPvPer types.
For example; unattackable lowbies, forced faction balance phasing within x yards, no raids, no LFG, impossible to gank, protected FPs, etc. Might not need outnumbered bonus. All Blizz have to do though is read the forum, there’s a standard set of unchanging WM issues raised.

Easy mode would give the non WPvPer types the feel of risk, without the downsides of hard mode.

Hard mode, because no bonus, would make WPvPers happier without PvEers in their shard.

Ye, not simple, but doable. That could really please everyone. Problem, dividing WM into two modes lowers the pool of players available for each shard type. But Blizz would know if that would be an issue.

I don’t actually think WM needs fixed, but that’s because I’m a WPvPer type. But WM is for anyone that wants it, regardless of player type. Easy/hard mode could please everyone.