How to solve the tank and healer problem

Community General Discussion
41

Are there lack of tanks though? I feel like recently there are more tanks than before.

1 Like
42

I honestly rarely ever see DPS overaggro mid-pull due to lucky procs. Even when the DPS is pushing out 20M+ DPS, this doesn’t happen. Tanks themselves can also push out several M in DPS in those cases, that’s more than fine.

Tanks already do quite a bit DPS. That’s not the problem. Just give the tank 2 seconds to gather the mobs, and they’re usually golden. Without this, it doesn’t matter how much DPS they do, it won’t help


43

The problem is not that tanking is hard.
We have enough versatility in the classes themselves to meet various play styles and options.

The problem largely is as described above.
When a new tank tries a dungeon and gets told off for not knowing anything, do you honestly believe that person is going to try again?

They will just isolate themselves to friends/guild/community and the pug scene has succeeded in scaring off another one and is whining on the forums about the shortage.

Tanking in itself isn’t hard.
Healing is probably a lot more demanding st this point

1 Like
44

Only in bad groups (or very high keys), otherwise it’s arguably the least impactful role currently.

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45

Big time. Especially in high keys

46

Likely, yes. It would be the only tank that is played, but if the path of least resistance turns into tanking instead of dpsing, then peopöe would probably tank a lot more.

It risks killing the game for a lot of people though.

47

I don’t think so.
Because then the focus will shift to being “Pull more! omg you are playing an afk tank and you are still bad??? omg!!”

I main disc priest, and if we brick a key on another healer I still get the occasional “yeah you must be so proud getting that rio with braindead disc”
 Even if it had nothing to do with how I healed
 If people want to flame you, they will. Regardless of what you play and how.

The “only” positive the two roles get is less que times
 But due to scarcity, if those two roles are good at making friends / adding people, playing with communities etc. they will be flooded with invites anyways, so they don’t need to sacrifice their mood with potential toxicity in the same degree.

If I may add another anecdote; I started playing more with people from No Pressure, earlier in the season we did a +10 with a tank that said he hadn’t done a 10 before and apologized for any mistake beforehand
 Then the Unholy DK in the group just told him “No worries, if you need I can ping what mobs to pull together for our comp”

So the dude was just helping him out with routes, throwing in the occasional “This double pack can hurt, so don’t hold back on using CDs here” we did have a death here and there, but we timed it and the tank reached 3.1 rio (he added us all on bnet).

It took the patience of 1 unholy DK to probably give the tank his willingness to learn and enjoy the role more

1 Like
48

Depends.

For the pugs, maybe. But it also brings in more bad apples into that role.

For guilds, not so much, since leaders and officers tend to be tanks in order to coordinate their raids better, so their demand there is limited.

49

You’re being incredibly obtuse, you know damn well when I say dps they’re not on par with DPS roles


50

I was a tank main in DF.

Bring a tank feels like babysitting 4 people. Add to that, you have to know all tacs on all bosses, obviously.

That can be a mouthful to look at guides all the time. And if you do it wrong it is way more punishing for the entire team compared to being a DPS.

I don’t really think there’s a shortage of healers though. People are just picky because they either want a healer that heavily overgeared or want a specific combo like leather healer only if everyone else are leather users in the group.

My rdruid is 3k and my rshaman is 2800 mythic rating, and I feel like I only got denied because of my armor type from time to time.

But the reason it could feel like a shortage is because for every 20 DPS there’s a healer. For every 40 DPS there’s a tank. Tank has become the least desired role thanks to people’s hostile attitude towards lesser skilled people.

DPS people are also quick to believe they can do a better job as a tank and tries to learn the tank why they think he is stupid.

But the same type of players refuse at the same time to play anything but dps

51

And they should be. In DF it was fun to outdps some bad dps in dungeons

52

I mean we don’t only see Ret and BM as the only DPS even so they are the easiest specs.

53

As I said, that is with skilled PUG group. I’ve certainly ran into Arcane mages grabbing aggro mid pull because they target side mobs instead of usual funnel targets, or Shamans popping ascendance on the pull right after I used dps cds to keep up aggro with other 2 dps who were using cds.

And yeah, overall it is dps skill issue, which stops as you get into higher io, but at the same time it’s yet another thing increasing barrier of entry into tanking for newbies.

54

The question with this remains; how much do we need to change to counter ‘bad players’?

Do we really need to give tanks virtually unlimited threat because some DPS players are just numb? Do we really need to cover for parties where they refuse to mark priority targets, and where they refuse to follow said order? Do we really need to cover for players who cannot wait for the tank to have gathered the desired mobs? Do we need to cover for parties where they refuse to interrupt? Where does this stop?

You don’t solve a DPS issue by giving tanks more DPS/threat. Tanks can already put out staggering numbers in big pulls. Just don’t single-target an unimportant mob in big pulls, and you’re golden.

1 Like
55

Yeah, but they aren’t the most powerful ones.

Plus being a meta spec nets you more invites in m+, regardless of your skill. Point still stands.

2 Likes
56

True, it’s alright if poor DPS simply gets to face the consequences of their poor play.

The annoying part is when decent DPS plays with poor tanks (and there’s a lot of them). In those cases DPS may very well rip threat mid pull, simply because the tank doesn’t deal enough damage. Not that I think thst should change though, those poor tanks should simply be stuck farther behind the decent DPS.

57

It’s a weird situation. When doing stuff in the overworld, I see quite a lot, in fact more than the 1-in-5 players ratio would suggest. I’ve even been in world boss and Hallowfall event groups with more than 10 tanks.

But in instances their rarity is the bottleneck

58

Delves are a big contributor, most tanks can get away with running dps Brann which makes delves super fast, and the tank dps is good enough for outdoor content. They only run into problems with barrier of entry into raid/m+ tanking.

59

I mean that was obvious before delves even launched.
Better meaningful solo content will ofcourse tank participation numbers in groups content.

I have seen many people saying they only did m+ cause there was no other non raid content to do and as soon as they got delves they never touched m+, again

1 Like
60

I am not playing only Monk :slight_smile:
Doing damage on heal should be some kind of unique thing, but now they push it on every single healer. Luckily on PTR right now the Caster MW build is much superior than FW, so maybe I don’t have to focus on damage anymore.