Could we please have some explanation as to why there was such a huge stealth nerf to Divine Light?
This to be at minimum a 40% throughput nerf. Paladins were the bottom of the pack healer wise for three straight phases; now we actually are finally doing better and we get hit hard with the nerf bat.
I understand that we were on top for them three weeks, but we still don’t have a fleshed-out toolkit as promised (not even a real chest healing rune), and DL sort of made up for the lack of interesting buttons a little.
Now this massive stealth nerf and still no toolkit update?
Why are you being dishonest? You have a point to argue the nerf being disproportional but why do you have to kill any credibility you have by making up?
P1 BFD:
h ttps://sod.warcraftlogs.com/zone/statistics/2007/#metric=hps×pan=1000
P2 Gnomeregan:
h ttps://sod.warcraftlogs.com/zone/statistics/2008/#metric=hps×pan=1000
P3 Sunken Temple:
h ttps://sod.warcraftlogs.com/zone/statistics/2009#timespan=1000&metric=hps
Do browse those links and tell me how favored resto shamans have been. Oh wait I’m sure you’ll tell me pve parses don’t matter when discussing pve performance…
!!Spoiler alert!!: worse!
If you don’t count the people who tried to heal as a mage and failed, thus dragging down the class as a healer, mage healer and resto shamans were consistently the bottom healer specs.
But guys, don’t let me interrupt your sad imagined paladin healer drama with facts. Have at it! It’s a paladin characteristic by now.
“I’m not top! OH WOEEE IS MEEE I HAVE IT THE WORST! HOW UNFAIR!”
I agree that if you take that one sentence and ignore the rest of what I wrote then your reply would maybe be legitimately considered.
I’m not going to fall your your little snuck premise and insist that you reply to my post as a whole rather than cherry picking parts you want to troll people over.
Not trolling anyone here, just calling you dishonest…
Again, the nerf seems harsh, you seem to be a great player, why then do you have to ham up your arguments when they stand on their own without the need to make up stories that are clearly and easily demonstrably untrue?
What, do you guys think logs from previous phases are gone?
From my poin of view you can have the nerf reverted, I don’t care, doesn’t affect me. What bugs me is seeing this:
You know this isn’t true. And making up stories makes me question the rest of your intentions.
No it doesn’t go for any spec and if you look at the highest performing and lowest performing you will see what I mean.
The role was new for the class so there is a higher learning curve. An average priest/druid/shaman/paladin could heal ST just fine, a mage? It was a gamble, as you would either get someone who actually knew how to do it or someone who was role-playing a healer.
Ye, paladin is a fustercluck of abilities that dont quite synergize. It has the potential for awesomeness, but then you run into issues like having to choose between infusion of light and sheath of light.
And the beacon of light/sacred shield interaction is still ridiculous.
You want beacon on main heal target. You also want sacred shield on the target that is taking dmg.
So you want to beacon tank, then heal everyone else, having the tank take the beacon healing.
But if you do that, there is no point in sacred shield, as the heal from beacon does not proc sacred shield. So there is 0 synergy. It becomes clunky and inefficient.
Im using pala to farm stuff. Only thing its good for now.
For holy, you cannot pick all the runes that would make it play great.
For prot its the same. You cant go taunt and crusader strike, which would be a great way to keep mana sustain up.
And yet, paladins were far and away the strongest healer in MC with all the “kit issues”. So much so even the devs thought a nerf was warranted.
h ttps://sod.warcraftlogs.com/zone/statistics/2012/#metric=hps
I mean imagine the kit issues of other classes that are supposedly stellar compared to paladins, if paladins with said issues are doing that well?
Welcome to SoD mate, I know you only pvp and hate pve (I do both) but Shaman AoE heals are garbo, you can have them (but you wouldn’t want them). It is generally accepted at this point that resto shamans are mainly a tank healer. Other classes are much better suited to raid heal.
It always has mattered, since you will always have people that don’t understand their spec and those who actually understand their spec. It is proven regardless of what game you play you will always have the good and bad players on certain classes and roles.
Even if mage is an outlier thanks to how unappealing that is, it still goes very much the same for other classes.
Average healers could and can heal it, just had to hope that you didn’t had a healer that liked gambling and faceplanting amongst other factors that a healer couldn’t control.
tough talk, i have been doing both and to say a paladin healer is good is like saying shaman healers are good.
No, and to argue otherwise would be just you being stubborn or thick, I’ve provided you
with ample proof why that is the case.
You constantly and repeatedly shouted for everyone to hear how PvE is a no-skill activity only losers engage with and that it doesn’t matter… and the devs should only cater PvP as that is the only place you can have any skill at all…
Come on now, let’s not dig that up, will you?
But anyyyyyyywayyyyy, good luck with getting the nerf reverted or lessened, sounds kinda harsh. Just argue the issues you really have and not camp fire horror stories about palas being the worst always at everything…
ignoring those facts is just being stubborn but okay apparently you play on a mythic+ level to know lol.
okay mr. rephrase everything, it is a solved game in PvE and trying to balance around that clownfiesta rather than something that consistently changes like PvP is a waste of time and resources. Shaman and talking about skill, how ironic, when was the last time you actually needed to do anything to win. Oh wait you didn’t need to because a good chunk of shaman runes, especially the ones that benefit hybrid caster shamans, literally allow you to play a low effort game. Any other hybrid actually gotta do something.
cant even quote me correctly without rephrasing it in such a manner that it would benefit you lmao.
With this character I play in a casual guild, I have cleared heat 3, been an avid m+ player/mythic raider/ pvper. You don’t know any of that and you assume otherwise even when I do present my arguments with proof, bad faith on your part.
To claim that you can never show skill playing a Shaman is just to say that you are biased and hate this class, don’t even need to elaborate this point further.
Posting wclogs as “proof” which shows as if both factions had Shamans and Paladins isn’t the same as ingame, where you are stuck with either of em. You talk somuch yet not even recognizing it. Yikes.
What relying on overtuned runes is skill for you? You are actually delusional to believe so. The only effort is playing enhance in PvP, and that is compared to resto/ele shamans, which have no such effort or any to begin with.
But I doubt an ele/resto hybrid could even understand the meaning of effort.
This post has gone a little offtopic, so I’ll just address the issues directly pointed at me.
You’re right that I tend to avoid directly linking healer logs and rankings, as I find it aggregates into further discussions about healer log memes. However, even without me doing that, it seems to have gone that way anyway, so guessing doesn’t matter.
You can also just end up linking logs that you think prove your point rather than just discussing your point, for example I could just use the below links.
h ttps://sod.warcraftlogs.com/zone/rankings/2007#metric=hps
h ttps://sod.warcraftlogs.com/zone/rankings/2008#metric=hps
h ttps://sod.warcraftlogs.com/zone/rankings/2009#metric=hps
Admittedly these are faction specific as I couldn’t see a way to show these all together for both Horde and Alliance.
While there are a couple of Paladin and Mages shown, the overall majority is clearly Priest/Druid.
Even then, both the rankings I listed and your grapths don’t mean a huge amount, as without going into each individual’s log and checking to see what happened in the raid, it doesn’t really mean a lot. Was the raid taking higher damage due to standing in avoidable damage, were healers ignoring dispelling, etc.? None of our links can really show that.
Again though, to be clear, I feel you’re hyper-focusing on one line out of several lines of text, which makes me question your intentions as well.
Ignoring the part about the toolkits way key to my point, we really are bottom of the pack in that regard; we’re back to the essence of the vanilla/classic healing but with the added small twist of beacon/SS + DL (now on an 8-second cooldown).
Only caveat to this is I don’t play Horde in Classic/SoD, so I can’t really comment on their toolkit and healing, but I have heard they have also been done dirty!
You know what that graph shows? If Alliance had resto shamans they’d be weaker than holy paladins for those respective phases. The fact that you can’t do the math yourself is pretty Yikes indeed.
You guys claim holy paladins are the utterly worst healers when that is not the case and there is no data to support that.
I play other classes than this shaman, the fact that you can’t recognize skill in other shamans makes me draw the conclusion you don’t understand what you are looking at. Not surprising in the least then that you claim shaman take no skill to play.
I know shamans seemingly able to take 3 people at once and others who flop in almost any 1v1, that cuts hard against your “ele shamans require no skill to play because runes OP”
too bad that the only trolls are the people who endorse blizzard favoring shamans, more specifically runes tailored perfectly towards Elemental and Restoration. Enhance has taken a L outside of PvE.
Aren’t you busy getting your head bashed in again by Miylee/Potato/myself and others? LMAO. Your two braincells are arguing about third place.
Now someone to respond to with a brain.
good for you, thankfully not a one trick pony shaman player. which is more than i can say for the majority of ele/resto trolls.
it is literally the tutorial class for pvp, what did you expect from people? there isn’t much you can do wrong with current SoD Ele/Resto Shaman where your mistakes do not matter much to begin with because of runes like earthbind root, decoy, riptide, power surge, lava burst to turn a fight instantly into your favor.
It isn’t even remotely on the same skill requirement as rogue, warlock or paladin to begin with.
The fact there are still clowns trying to defend this when paladins can now fight back in some capacity by asking for paladin nerfs is pretty insane. Four phases of overtuned shaman is now getting turned onto the horde just in the form of pally.
worst healers on alliance, which is what mattered in previous phases, but the one time paladins are good which is on fights that actually provide both higher tank damage and decent amount of raid damage, it is the treatment of Fun Detected, Fun Removed.
The only good part about paladin is getting nerfed. Congratz what an utter failure considering what paladin healers are made for.
This post has gone off on a bit of a tangent. I’ll again try to keep to the parts I think relate to me so as not to confuse things!
First off, I’m really not sure your graph(s) do in fact show that. Could you go into more detail as to why you think this is the case? I’m not saying you’re incorrect; I’m just not sure how you came to your conclusions based on what you linked us to.
Secondly, I in no way claimed Holy Paladin’s were “the utterly worst healers” at all; I said we were bottom on the pack healer wise. I then went on to give context to this in my next paragraph in terms of toolkit and rune availability. I understand it’s inconvenient to your point of view if you were to include everything I have said rather than hyper-focusing on the parts you think are easier to attack me on, but in reality, it serves no practical purpose as we’re then essentially discussing separate ideas.
On a side note, it didn’t slip my notice that you agree the Divine Light nerf was harsh, and for that, I appreciate your reply and hope that blizzard re-considers their changes!
up?