Imagine if open world PvP was only about skill regardless of your level

Don’t level with warmode, if you don’t wanna be ganked.

Then you have misunderstood the point of this topic, or my point at least. Take away all the PvE benefits if that helps. Leveling is fast enough as it is.

The point is to improve open world PvP so that it would encourage players to engage in PvP regardless of their level. It has so much to offer, if it was changed up a bit. I could see the world becoming much more alive. Being able to one hit a player after spending a few more hours leveling is not going to wake the PvP world up.

Blizzard will never improve W-PvP because they never talk about it. People don’t play W-PvP enough. There are no rewards and if there were people would do raid grps and go 1 shot solo players. That is not PvP.

Last time W-PvP was great was in MoP. They destroyed server communities.

WPvp doesn’t need equal ground, it cannot be equal by design (gear/ number of people/ situation / professions / toy box / potions / extra action button). Therefore, asking to improve something already biased in one way or the other won’t make it better.

WPvp is the last remnant (for now) of the old pvp way, it was great at a time because as said by Babera you had communities at Server level that made it great with rivalries, gank, camping, spotting. Now that it’s with WM, you don’t find this much except you have now more target available (even more with the pvp WQs), but that stops here. No more drama, guild wars, forum post, taunt, etc…

If you are low level, you are by design a weak link. Look at the old AV going on right now, they are bumped to lvl 70 but they lack gear & abilities, they cannot do anything & giving 10-60 lvl to somebody when he enters combat won’t change a damn thing if you talent tree contain 3 meager talent points.

If you want to preach for an equal ground, then it’s over Battleground that you need to look at. And then I would agree: In leveling every time you enter a BG you have max lvl bracket & same ilvl all over. Same in Max lvl BG, that would improve the experience for sure

World PvP has always been gank or be ganked. Its not meant to be equal or fair. They made arena for that nonsense but then completely bonked it by making healers way too powerful. (among other things)

world pvp would be better if they brought back legion templates and put everyone on a equal ground but the no life pvpers don’t want that :smiley: they suck to much in a real fight

Thats because templates have no place in a mmorpg where gearing your character is one of the pillars of the game… What point is there in gearing if everyone is equal?

It defeats the entire point of maing your character stronger.

If people dont want to get insta-killed put some effort into your character or go play another game where such things are the norm.

pvp has no place in a mmo but they still added it

Lineage 2 agrees with you :grin:

Nah, the Dark Souls reference is on point. “Killing the monster” isn’t “killing the ganker,” it’s dealing with your own objective while the ganker is about. Get from A to B without being spotted or caught.

If you’re skilled enough to not get caught or to get the ganker off your tail, then you can reach your objective. If you can’t be arsed to do stuff like that and put the work in, then turn War Mode off.

War Mode is there to let people just fight with whatever they have. If you want your levels or gear disadvantage not to matter, then go play PvE. Why crowd into this optional gamemode demanding it change?

If you want WPvP at the moment, go find it. Take the risk and see if your gear is good enough. The only thing the mode needs is some objectives to draw people together.

So you fly away with your dragonflight mount, unless you need to follow a npc for a quest. That’s about it.

“Ganking” is anti-PvP. I feel like it’s really only a method preferred by players who do not like PvP or are not good at it, so they vent their frustration when they know they can avoid an actual PvP duel. Adds nothing to PvP.

One option out the top of my head would be to decrease your damage output by a certain percentage depending on the level of the player you’re attacking. You will still have the advantage of your skills, but have to be ready to actually duel a potentially good PvPer.

So let me get this right, a lvl 1 mage should be able to win VS any class, lacking about everything exept the basic cast?

You didnt mean a lvl 1? Then lets say lvl 10… 20, or 30? One should be able to win while lacking many tools and powerups of attacks just by being skilled enough?

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Can somebody explain to me how do you get ganked multiple times nowadays? It’s not like you don’t have flying mounts available at low level, directly dragon riding at lvl 58, 2/3 hearthstone with 15-20 min cds, zone with no level limitations in DF or even being able to change expansions before that.

Griefers can be pretty obsessed to kill 1 target but there is so much ways to avoid them now that you can just completely disappear from their radar in few seconds.

Any changes you put in place they will find something else to annoy you. If you lower down their lvl when attacking you, they will wait that you are low, they will bring 1-2 friends, whatever come to their mind to grief.

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As it should be. This is an RPG, you improve your character, you are stronger. It can’t offer an equal playing field without harming that very fundamental aspect of the game. And why should it? Nobody gets into WPvP expecting it to be a sport. That’s not what makes it fun.
Instanced fights are one thing, but roleplaying games won’t ever offer balanced (as in chess rules) competition and they shouldn’t try to. Think of all the times people called for help against gankers in low level areas. That kind of emergent social behaviour wouldn’t be there if ganking wasn’t a thing.

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The only MMORPG where I enjoyed its PvP, that was purely based on Skill where gear and level doesn’t give a huge advantage besides a considerable gap, was in the stupidly named “Space Cowboy Online” or “Ace Online” when it got its name changed… old game from 2006+, an Arcade space flight mmo.

Your Skill to outmanoeuvre enemy players and avoid incoming hits made PvP fun, more so in chaotic dog fights trying to destroy the enemy faction’s ship.

The only bad thing I found with regards to PvP in that game was Gate camping, people coming into zones to be blown out of the sky.

I played an A-Gear, which was literally a flying tank that had a siege mode while on the ground… XD

Wingrest Embassy when you try to walk the npc as you exit the Embassy. The npc won’t walk without you, so you have to return to it, if you want to continue the quest.

Respectfully disagree. I’m not an old school WoW player so perhaps I do not have a sentimental value to “ganking”, but to me it is a broken system that works against a proper PvP world. If you want to kill lower levels, you should be prepared to duel against them with your advantage of spells. If you don’t want that, then you don’t want PvP. That’s my opinion on PvP anyway.

bad take./10

What’s the point of gearing then? What’s the point of levels and stats?
Even in PvE, if it’s to be just a contest of skills, you don’t need the entire infrastructure of RPG progression.
Progression has meaning (build and class choices as well) because it changes the gameplay experience relative to a particular challenge. To put it simply, the boss has x power, so increasing mine means I will have an easier time. The same applies to players in PvP. If we don’t want that, we don’t want variables, power progression, optimal and suboptimal choices and so on.

Oh no, Retributor has an opinion!

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Gearing helps a level 70 get advantage over other level 70s, or a level 60 over other level 60s. But this topic is not about that.

As for levels and stats, a level 70 has access to all the spells and therefore has more tools to utilize in a PvP situation, and depending on their gear, will deal more damage (if the above suggested solution would be implemented, where your damage output would be decreased by a certain percentage when attacking lower levels). As a side note, I dislike how we can one hit old content as well. I don’t think that should be the case, but that’s another topic.

But PvP in my opinion is inherently about the battle between the players and that should always be the heart of it. Gear and level should play a part, but should not be everything. Gear will play a bigger part when the players are the same level. And level will play a part to an extent too, of course. But it is not really an achievement to reach level 70, yet it makes you a superhuman to a level 60. If level is all that matters, there is no PvP.