— Master Yoda, is the fel stronger?
— No, no. Quicker, easier, more seductive.
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Why wouldn’t they be able to? I always was of the opinion, that warlocks are failed mages, who went the quick and dirty way to gain power, instead of the long and hard one.
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If a priest can use Light and Shadow, then there stands no reason to why a mage /warlock can’t use Arcane and Fel.
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Felt that was pretty nicely demonstrated in the pre-Legion audio drama with Khadgar and Gul’dan.
Speaking of - that one did have Khadgar wonder if Gul’dan had picked up some arcane knowledge (he hadn’t), which at least suggests to me that a Warlock with no prior knowledge of arcane magic can indeed learn such.
There’s also the case of mage spells being laced with Fel. Archmage Vargoth is corrupted during mage’s class story in Legion, using “felfrost” spells and creating tainted portals.
Illidan’s markings were demonic in origin and infused him with greater arcane power (possibly through the infusion of fel in his magics?). That was basically part of the WotA trilogy. His ritual to stop the demonic portal and collapse the Well of Eternity was also arcane-ish in nature and fuelled by wellspring water.
I would also highlight that:
Is an assumption already; the original quest quote merely refers to infusion with opposite forces of nature. In that sense, it is no different to what a discipline priest does; maintain sanity and composure through rituals of light so that they may safely use shadows.
And by all means, discipline priests exist in lore; in a way, all priests are capable of wielding some degree of shadows. Anduin was taught by Velen, and Anduin was shown capable of using mind control.
We’ve had instances of mixing Void and Fel creating primordial annihilating energies, yet Void Elves can be warlocks without imploding. Same applies to other interactions between Light v Shadow or Arcane v Fel. In the latter case Medivh being a good example of someone who was basically the avatar of everything Fel yet remained a competent wielder of the Arcane.
If someone wants to bring up examples of quest text and lore then they just point towards the host/wielder of these cosmic energies being the decisive factor, not the base interactions these energies have when they collide or merge.
ackshually they’re pretty much bound to the normal colours and aesthetics, as arcane elements are actually just the actual elements, but enslaved with Arcane rather than coaxed out with shamanism
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An accusation as old as time, but still as ignorant as ever.
“Of course you meant to say that when you create fire, all you are doing is concentrating the inherent nature of fire contained in the surrounding area into one location, calling it into being?” – Medivh, The Last Guardian
Here Medivh is explaining the process of Evocation. Arcane magic is first conjured, and then it takes the appropriate form of the concentrated element. Frost, Fire, Water, Earth, Air, Decay.
Enslaving elements is something which pisses them off quite a bit, and only the like of Dark Shamans we’ve seen use.
The water elementals you see mages summon are quite literally created. It is actually described that a mage’s water elemental is not as strong as a real one, and that it lacks any sapience.
It is also mentioned that Jaina got so good at it though, that her elementals gained some degree of self-awareness.
I’m not sure if you’re just trolling, honestly, but I might as well post this to avoid misinformation.
Well this is true, but I’d say this is only true if that is an intended effect. I imagine the arcane tattoos on Demon Hunters are specifically designed to counter the Fel. But in a standard situation one does not overpower the other if you have a mage and a warlock on the same skill level (in their schools respectively) fighting it out.
It’s not misinformation.
When we see Jaina use a fireball in Tides of War, from Thrall’s perspective, we are told of the enslaved spirits writhing in agony for being forced into servitude. Que Thrall pleading the spirits to stop, but Jaina’s sway being too strong on account of the Focusing Iris.
It’s very clear that, one way or another, mages are casually torturing the elements on the daily.
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Koiffen beat me to it.
Mages are very definitely certainly tormenting and enslaving the elements and every self-respecting Shaman should hate Magi.
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I say “get a real job” to the shamans.
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My favourite aspect of roleplaying a Warlock is the character being an unrepentant jerk.
mages are the scum of the earth
Malygos did nothing wrong
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In regards to Medivh, the person that was -insisting- that it was impossible for me to use any form of arcane, also told me that “We can’t take into consideration what the main/lore important characters are doing because they break logic all the time and they are too powerful for their actions to factor into the actions of our more down-to-earth characters” which was a very strange argument to me.
They also said that… because they were born of the Guardian but touched by Sargeras it somehow bypassed their own self-made rule that arcane annihilates fel and fel annihilates arcane.
At this point, after seeing everyone agree that… yeah a Warlock can totally use arcane magic if they were trained for it, it’s just that they don’t want to/have to without a single dissenting voice, I’m really curious as to why they were so insistent on this point.
Also, what do you all think about their assertion that
All magic always corrupts when using it, even a tiny bit, with each form of magic producing different effects.
Nature corruption gave Malfurion got his moose horns,
Light corruption gave LF their Glowing Eyes,
Fel corruption gave demon hunters horns and leathery wings,
Arcane corruption gave Nightborne a long-life and a purple skin,
Death corruption gives Necromancers their sallow, pale and thin skin
And Void Corruption gives people an extra dozen eyes and mouths or turn them purple with glowey tentacly hair.
Hence why they insisted that someone corrupted by fel can’t use arcane?
I mean this alone implies that Nightborne can’t use Fel magic by default and we have several characters who do use Fel, not to mention that Nightborne warlocks exist.
Edit: that said magic does corrupt after a fashion. But a tiny bit of corruption does not cancel out the opposing magic, because if that’s true a Lightforged could never be hurt by shadow magic f.ex.
On the other hand Lightforged are unlikely to be able to effectively use shadow magic (if for some deranged reason they’d want to). Likewise Jace Darkweaver (?) has lost his grasp of the arcane because he is “too far gone” in being a Demon Hunter.
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I reckon the crux of the matter is this, essentially. One can become so far gone in the influence of a certain cosmic force’s power that the opposing force becomes, in one way or another, unwieldeable or unbearable to wield.
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seems like it’s something like that, yeah. Gotta keep the two balanced out, or you’re stuck with just one.
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Supposedly Fel can corrupt Arcane but not the other way around, which was a strange thing to argue by my reckoning.
And whilst I agree that someone can become too far gone towards one direction, I imagine it would have to be something like… for Fel, you need to be a demon hunter of many many millenia who has been bathing in fel energy and practicing the Fel side of their abilities to the detriment of the rest of their abilities.
That being said, Nightborne should be too far gone towards the Arcane side and yet they become Warlocks so… Maybe, just maybe, like the other person said, it doesn’t apply from Fel to Arcane but it applies from Arcane to Fel?
This is a strange subject that leads to a lot of cyclical thinking and it’s hurting my brain.
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Should they? I don’t know really. Sure they’re altered by arcane, but so are night elves and any other variation of elf (excluding void elves, I guess). But they’re not, at their core, arcane, seeing as any form of magic can seemingly influence and change elves just by proximity (I imagine elves as a default are just more sensitive to such changes). Whereas a demon hunter probably has a way more intimate connection to the Fel. Likewise for a Lightforged or a Void Elf.
I think if we are looking for an arcane steeped race the Ethereals are a good example. I don’t know about any fel-users among them (but I’m not an expert on Ethereal lore).
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