Is there anyone powerful enough to do what Sylvanas did in Shadowlands cinematic?

Lore Story
62

Oh, come on we’re talking about World of Warcraft here where logistics don’t matter and the numbers are made up.

But, they seemingly don’t need the land. The blight is used all over Drustvar during the assault (and its actually used by orcs during that assault), Darkshore has Nathanos ordering the apothecaries to blight everything down to the coastline.

It’s exactly so simple. Throw in some blight in one district, leave and come back a day later or so. Just continue until Stormwind crumbles. Or just go to Westfall and destroy the farms and watch as the Alliance starves to death as they cannot use the land to produce food anymore.

Teleportation seemingly has no limits and as people constantly reminded me and never shut up to tell me: Oculeth can teleport people around and place them anywhere he wants.

If you want armies to matter then you need to remove superweapons and superheroes. Not only one of these things.

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63

In a world where a horned dude character can cleave planets in half with a sword, or since you said:

While characters like Arthas ascend to god-like powers, much like Malfurion grows into that power level. Will you blame me for taking the complaints on high power levels as rather moot?

Because from my point of view here these characters only become a problem once the writers mishandle them. Otherwise they are absolutely incredible.

Shattering armies with the fury of nature is cool. Raising Sindragosa is very cool.

Working through an entire expansion to kill that dragon and defeat Arthas (somewhat) is how it’s executed properly. If Arthas instead went senile, like Malfurion, and forgot his powers as the Lich King then that wouldn’t have been as decent.

The fault here should not be plastered onto the characters.

The Horde could have very well organised a massive Shamanistic ritual to mess with the elements and weaken Malfurion, I would have been overjoyed with that instead of the laziness we’re all subjected to.

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64

…or they could create an equally powerful Plot Nuke Character on the spot to counter Malfurion and call it ready to go.

And we find that entire factions are pointless because we have these super beings that can battle each other to death and solve all our problems when these arise. The planet ceases to be considered such, and just turns into these powerhouses training ground.

Because much like Blizzard created Malfurion, they decided that now Sylvanas can solo the Scourge and kill the Lich King.
And Nathanos can handle Tyrande with the aid of a Valkyr.

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And THAT! Is the writer’s fault, not Malfurion’s for existing. Because we didn’t need a Plot Nuke to defeat Arthas, we built up to it.

Likewise, nobody needs plot nukes to defeat Malfurion, it can be explored properly. Problem is, Blizzard can’t be bothered to.

They are the only ones responsible for this.

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66

just because they have track record of dealing badly with such a things doesn’t change the fact that blight needs to be produced, delivered, redistributed, and that it’s scarecely used due to side effects.

They do need the land, they don’t use the blight all the time, only scarcely. I only recall that there was one outpost in Tiragarde sound where there was preparation done for war campaign which was about assaulting one base and taking a body of one captain. And in Drustvar there was one world quest about mushroom farm and blight creatures. But never the entire Horde warfare was about blighting everything on their path.

Westfall was already super poor, humans eat dirtpies for dinner there.
As for blighting the city, it’s guarded so they would react once you’d drop first few bombs, you can’t just throw some, leave and come back and continue without a reaction. And when you want to nuke an entire city you need more people, more resources and more preparations to actually do it. So I disagree.

Teleportation has limits, this is why both Horde and Alliance needs ships, skyships and other means for transport.

Oculeth can send one person or very few even but he wouldn’t be able without an issue send on another continent without a preparation a notable squadron, resources, and all the stuff carrying the blight.

During questing, he very often was talking that he needs proper preparations to transport much bigger stuff, or that he needs to set up proper pylon for a stable portal.

Superheroes are a much bigger problem, as I managed to cover for a while Blight has quite some negative effects and limitations were superheroes have none. The only problem I can think of is that they can’t be at two places at the time.

Improved weaponry is not the problem, Alliance has it as well via lightforged technology and apparently mages can work around with blight.

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If Malfurion never existed we wouldn’t have this problem.

This goes both ways: if you think they may/can create these elements for one side, you can’t fault them for using said technique again if they feel like they want/need it.

The problem lays with the element itself. Once you’ve used it, its a free pass to use it again whenever you feel like it.

68

If Archimonde never existed, they wouldn’t have miswrote him in WoD.

Megamind.

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69

WoW this thread went to hell quite quickly xd

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That Horned dude is a TITAN, actual GOD in Warcraft Setting. For the forth time I’m talking that the issue is that power of gods is given to mortals, and to leave god-like powers to actual gods.

Arthas was still not god-like, Vrykul called him that, but in the end all the things he was able to do was due to Burning Legion created artifact. Arthas himself was never that powerful.

Meanwhile Malfurion never had any powerful from another dimention, was never transformed by Titan himself like Sargeras did to Archy and K’J.
He just had a tutor from a dragon and a demi-god. And now he is more powerful than both of them.

Some characters are handled better than the others. But Malfurion is on the same level as Thrall and Jaina. Writers went over the board with them and they created more plotholes in the meantime. As I suggested before, him being all powerful back in WotA could’ve been attributed with wild gods lending him powers to defend from legion. And that would be reasonable, what is unreasonable is for him to be stronger than any of them without having any reasonable story to back it up.

We know that Arcane is addictive and is supposed to have serious side effects. But Jaina is performing tasks which usually takes up to few mages and doesn’t break a sweat at all.

And Thrall, his ascension was completely off and actually made character lamer nor cooler. Thrall was great because he wasn’t all powerful, he was just one among many that took the reigns and tried to do something for his people.
This is why he was appealing for so many years and now isn’t anymore.

We find different things cool then. And again, raising undead is different to obliterating army all by yourself. Necromancers are a thing, this is why I disagreed with your that creating army is the same as solo destroying army. Creating army even with necromancers takes time and that army doesn’t have to be that efficient. It was the frostmorne that made necromany far more advanced.

What I not find cool is that mortal is making actual god look ridiculous by comparision without having even good explanation for it. “He’s first druid of a kind” shouldn’t be a reasoning to back up strenght of soloing armies where 3 if not more wild gods perished while fighting them.

Or as Zarao said- make new OP character to balance it. Then we have DBZ like encounters. Since you’re not against Uber op characters then you shouldn’t be against of introducing more of them to bring struggles to Mally.

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I really don’t get what Archimonde has to do with any of this (least of all, WoD’s one).

But still, his example has nothing to do with Malfurion.

Archimonde was created to represent a demon. Narratively speaking, he was akin to a cosmic force that had to be dealt with in a high fantasy plot. And as such, wasn’t restricted nor tied to the sort of grounded stories that we would expect from any mortal race. He was a device.

Malfurion, Thrall, and Jaina, are protagonists and mortals in a story that demands of them to have a more deep persona.
To be protagonists of both High and Low fantasy stories.
To deal with the Defias and the Burning Legion.
To deal with the Scourge and the Horde/Alliance.

For good or ill, these are mortal leaders ruled by a different handbook than elemental lords and Space horrors.

If you suddenly put them par on the likes of a Demonlord, whenever the story goes into a more grounded level, you break it.

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And Malfurion was created to represent the most powerful and wisest of the Archdruids.

And Malfurion was a force of nature, much alike.

Yes, like Malfurion dealt with the Burning Legion in WotA and then in Warcraft 3?

Yes, thank you Zarao, we all know there is no setting more grounded in reality than Warcraft. :hugs:

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73

And now Sylvanas was created to be par on him.
And Nathanos is now able to fend his wife off.

And next time, there will be another Saiyan moment, when some single dude is able to beat back an entire army.
And we will sit there wondering what all the fleet fuss was about.

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And again, that’s on the writers being absurd, not on Malfurion for existing.

Like yeah, we’ve reached the point that the fantasy elements in a fantasy setting are at fault for being too much fantasy. Blame the fantasy.

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Archdruids are still mortals, Not gods. Malfurion was not boosted by Titan and twisted to be ridiculously op being, Malfurion was ridiclously OP when he barely started to get teachings with Cenarius.

I don’t know what else can be said if you don’t get the difference.

There are gods and mortals, it’s immersion breaking when mortal is much more powerful than a god.

Sounds like double standart to me. It’s not absurd when they apply said rules to Malfurion but it is when they apply to anyone else?

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No, it’s not.

Because by your own reasoning we’d be already allowing such by accepting Malfurion’s character and what it represents.

We would open the gate, and let the flow of Supermen, and Gokus to pour in.

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Who claimed they were gods?

How was he ridculously OP?

Not following you here. Malfurion isn’t even the sole victim of this.

Archimonde in WoD received much the same treatment, by immediately dying almost as soon as he was summoned.

Every character here is a victim of bad storytelling and it has nothing to do with how the characters were or who the characters were.

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How does it matter though? If entire armies and fleets appear out of nowhere, why should it suddenly matter for the blight? Undercity was destroyed, yet this didn’t stop the Horde from throwing around with blight like its candy.

And yet everytime the Horde did appear in BfA the blight wasn’t far away. Oh, and in Drustvar the Horde starts throwing around with it once you finish the four quests on the Alliance side and your main objective is to stop the airship.

Westfall is the breadbasket of Stormwind. And really? You want to use the dirtpies as part of the lore even though during said quest perfectly fine pumpkins were around the corner? Or you know the fact that I could bring the meat of the coyote back to them instead of just the tail.

And how would they deal with it? They have zero countermeasures against the blight. Increasing the guard presence? Great more casualties. Spread the population? Oh, well just blow up the houses they’re gonna have to live on the streets then.

That’s why we build up an entire garrison in Draenor. On another planet. In another timeline.

Boom. Headshot. Superhero is dead on the ground.

And let’s not talk about the fact how machine guns completely destroy the entire concept of warfare in Warcraft.

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79

As in Arthas, Kel’thuzad, World Shaman Thrall, the Aspects and so on? Fantasy elements in the shape of almighty characters that have been in Warcraft since its inception?

Welp I raise my hands. Guess Warcraft was never meant to be the place for this smh.

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80

You are throwing in the same lot neutral forces of nature, villains created around a very specific setting, and one of the chief examples of the problems with these sort of stories.

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81

Because it’s only blue characters having all the Power. Thrall got nerfed and Sylvanas is gone.

That leaves Characters like Velen, Malfurion, Nightwarrior Tyrande, Jaina and others in the God tier of powerful army crushers.

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