As the Blizzcon is near what do you think should be pruned and changed in pvp?
MMR and ranked system simplified. Just gain rating for win or lose for lose then someone who has higher winrate wins. Add losing cr for sitting rating and there you go. MMR creates all these pathologies.
3 Likes
Nothing. They will be busy fixing all the pve stuff they didnt manage to do before the deadline.
HEALER PARTICIPATION SUGGESTIONS:
- Cap dampening at 40% - Games will still be quick, but healing wonât be as stressful (therefore more enjoyable) and healers wonât be useless later in the game (which will result in fewer 3-3, since they will be able to have more impact on the outcome of a fight).
- Make PvP titles require -100 CR for healers: Rival at 1700, Duelist at 2000, Elite and Gladiator at 2300. People who seek cosmetic rewards will be more likely to give healers a shot if they perceive it as âeasierâ.
Itâs also completely fair because climbing as a healer is objectively harder, seeing as there are no healers in the top 100 of solo shuffle.
Rewards:
- More stuff for casual players: You get your first worthwile reward at 1800 with the Elite set. Thereâs nothing interesting for new/casual players below that threshold. Meanwhile, at 2400, you get the tabard + the pennant + the cloak + all the weapon skins, and potentially the gladiator mount if you maintain the rating for your next games.
The tabard should probably stay at 2400, but the other rewards could be given to lower rated players. Pennant at 1200, cloak at 1400, and weapon skins at 1700 for example. - Participation trophies: Mounts, skins and armor rewards for grinding arena games - regardless of rating, like the tabard of brute force. This will reward participation at all levels of play. You can also make healer specific rewards to encourage even more healer participation.
- Give âLegendâ players are recolor of the current gladiator mount.
Class design:
- Bring back Chi and Stances for Mistweaver Monks.
- Redesign Earthen Wall Totem so that you donât constantly yell at your screen because your most powerful spell is invisible and requires your team mates to pay attention.
- Reduce micro-CCs. Death Knights can chain so many of them, itâs ridiculous.
- Remove Precognition from DPS casters. This encourages cheesy gameplay where you bait precog then youâre free to launch an unstoppable barrage of damage.
- Reduce mobility across the board. Monks, Demon Hunters, Warriors and Evokers donât need 2 charges of Chi Torpedo, Fel Rush, Charge and Hover.
5 Likes
just give healers more MMR for wins. Its really that simple. Going 4-2 in a lobby where you healed dps 500 MMR above your own should give you an enormous spike in MMR, instead you get 5-10 extra MMR and your next game is healing 1500 mmr players where they donât bubble or iceblock 6 rounds in a row, you go 3-3 and lose 15 MMR.
3 Likes
I also have a fix to this problem: track dampening/time played.
If the 3-3 happens because one DPS either goes 0-6 or 6-0, then the game should track which healer managed to heal his teams for the longest period of time/highest level of dampening, and reward them with +15 MMR/CR at the end of the game.
The other, weaker healer goes +0 CR +0 MMR.
1 Like
I donât believe itâs about difficulty. Itâs about not being fun for healer to play shuffle. Dampening stacks so fast that you feel like that speedruning guy from vine while dps players are just chilling. Neither of these changes will fix shuffle participation nor the incoming trinket change. In fact healerâs participation is only lower. You cannot even truely play RSS if you cannot do your HPS rotation properly.
RSS as a bracket would die soon imo as soon as Solo RBGs will appear. Majority of casual low exp players will play them instead and participation in RSS will drop. Itâs just not fun enough to play. Most of the players who play solo shuffle are these who cba sitting in LFG, like playing alone, donât have anyone to teach them PvP basics or playing while friends are offline.
How can you say that, when my first suggestion is literally a dampening cap?
1 Like
Iâd rather we reduced the impact burst cds have so people didnât die in seconds. And then adjust the healing based on that.
At least thatâs my opinion from playing mw. Itâs not fun even without dampening when hp bars ping pong all over the place.
Itâs stressful
2 Likes
Because there are still other unfun things like competing against other healer and if you have one pepega then you go 3:3 and thatâs the thing that happens most of the times. RSS format just doesnât work for healers. Overall I think healers are discriminated in the game - the fact that they cannot play 2v2 skirms is just toxic towards healers.
I also addressed that issue.
Does anyone remember why healers got their own mmr system in ss? Why dont we follow the group mmr? Legitimate question, I dont remember.
1 Like
Broadly speaking?
1) Abilities and passives that do too much:
This one is quite self explanatory, but there are broadly speaking three categories: a) Abilities that provide too much bang for their buck, b) abilities that remove counterplay from an ability c) Abilities born out of necessity to counter another broken ability, creating a vicious arms race cycle in class design
Category A:
- Abilities that maybe started off as a defensive or an offensive cooldown or an ability that have since been perverted into a hybrid of the two or outright combining the two.
- Good examples include for example Divine Shield and BoP which used to reduce your damage by 50% and make you unable to do melee attacks respectively, because they were defensive cooldowns, not offensive ones.
- Another example would be Grounding Totem, which used to reflect only absorb one spell effect (just like Spell reflect), but which has for some reason still the legion tax added to it, which for some reason gave it the ability to absorb an infinite number of spells. At least spell reflect was changed in SL, and remains useful to this date.
- A third example would be Intervene, which used to redirect only the first attack/ability made against your target, not everything within x seconds.
- And just so people donât think I am biased here, fast mass dispel (removed next week) and void volley also belong to this category.
- And some more abilities: Tranq immunity (it is supposed to be a healing cd, not an immunity), Metamorphosis (remove passive leech that allows the DH to facetank damage with a DPS cooldown), Blink/shimmer (granting absorbtion and/or healing through talents, it is a movement cd, not a defensive cd), and so forth. Note that these abilities themselves do not need to be necessarily powerful to be degenerate, they simply promote a degenerate game design by their very existance, regardless of the meta.
- How to fix this? The answer is very simple: You separate the intentions clearly from abilities and either add them in as their own abilities, or you remove the one that does not belong there. SO for example for Divine shield and BoP, put their defensive restrictions back into place, or in Groundingâs case make it stop only one spell.
Category B:
- These include abilities or passive that straight out remove or reduce the counterplay options to them through automation or passive protection. Good examples from the past include blade dance auto dodge, paladin auto bubble from legion, or fast mass dispel, which is thankfully getting removed.
- Good examples of current abilities with the same problems would be monkâs turbo fists (it is a rotational dps ability, not a defensive against melee), the upcoming DH blade dance damage reduction, resto druid treant tier set, paladin auto dispel tied to rotational abilities, etc. If it is enabled by a rotational element, chances are it is in this category.
- How do you fix these problems? Generally speaking it is healthier to remove them. Counterplay should always exist.
Category C:
- This includes abilities like the druid and shaman dispel protection, paladin aoe dispel, mortal wounds being made available to just about every class and their grandmother since SL, sharpen blade, evoker breath dispel, etc.
- The best thing would be to remove these, but you have to erase the whole house of cards, which means the problems that caused these abilities to exist in the first place: For example, mana increase to dispels (Already fixed), other means than mortal wounds to pressure kills (e.g rot cleaves and dots actually dealing meaningful damage once more), and so forth.
I thinkone of the key differences between MoP and DF class design is that, while they are very similar, MoP is still ahead because while classes had even more absurd defensives and offensives than they do currently, that was fine because every single one of those abilities was dedicated to that task alone and nothing else.
Second wind did not also increase your movement speed or reduce the damage you took.
Deep freeze did not also make your target take insane damage on the application.
Shield wall did not also provide an absorb for nearby allies.
Grounding stopped 1 spell.
Warlock reflect only worked on fire and shadow spells.
And so forth. The abilities were one-dimensional, but the classes were multidimensional. Nowadays, it is the other way. Classes have become gimmicks because of gimmicky abilities being too powerful. See current Elemental shaman 4+3+4+3+4+3+4+3 rotation of meatballs and earth shock.
There are other things too, such as:
- changing interrupts to only put that spell on cd, rather than the entire spell school, but those are the most important things that should happen in overall class design.
- Healing and damage spells, broadly speaking, should go back to âif it is casted, it deals more damageâ. Instants are way too prominent across the game and have far too much power, which I suspect is the result of the âgo go goâ fast MOBA mentality of M+, which has bled into the game since Legion. Classic fights are slow and grindy, but also far more satisfying because you get to use your whole kit in a fight, not just a fraction of it because the game ends so soon. Damage is not the issue I feel, but rather how it is dealt.
- Rather than also pruning classes of mobility or other culprits that people name as the problem, I would instead buff the underperforming classes.
2 Likes
Blizzard : You need to sort out all of this these guys have mentioned in this thread, people are frustrated to fast paced game and spiky damage. Enough is enough. It has to change. Itâs not healthy, and it doesnât serve anyone who wants to compete on high level.
Provided by Details Damage meter.
- Unnatural kill windows for human reaction - This has to be the biggest minus in pvp.
example by ele shaman: 0,4 seconds.
x3 casts Ascendance proc.
Lava Burst damage in 0,4 second window 555,900.
Give them what they want faster so they can stop queueing sooner?, this 1000% pepega
Your statement only makes sense if you think all healers are already capable of achieving 2300.
Yes, ânoobsâ will reach Rival quicker than they do now. But since Duelist will be closer and more âwithin their reachâ, maybe theyâll give it a shot and will actually try and get it this season instead of just assuming that they donât have what it takes.
Thereâs always a bigger goal in this game.
Only Rank 1 players have nothing more to achieve.
Everything you just mentioned is gone the second solo q rbg is out, the masses of casual players (myself included) will play majority of our games there for rewards up to elite.
Think longterm how about not having a rogue or hunter cc a healer for 20 seconds straight.
CC can exist, it just needs more counterplay.
Shamans have very well designed CC in my opinion:
- Capacitor Totem can be straight up destroyed and canceled, or you can walk away from it
- Lightning Lasso can be interrupted by your team mates
The game needs more CC like this.
Thatâs why everyone plays with an aug, because they can dispell their healers most of the times.
if they introduce more support specs,
the support specs could replace healers
resulting in FASTER queue timers