Just dropping the facts by. Lordaeron is rightful Forsaken lands since they are the true people of Lordaeron. Alliance needs to get out and get back to Stormwind where they truly belong to. Alright. That is all I wanted to say. Peace out.
No, the Forsaken need to get back underground where they belong.
Lmao salty alliance scum incoming. Mad because I drop facts? Pathetic.
It was already confirmed in the Eastern Kingdoms book that the Alliance withdrew from Lordaeron, as Anduin asked the Horde council permission for Shaw and Flynn to visit the ruins as part of their fact finding expeditions.
So yes, Lordaeron in fact does belong to the Forsaken but right now it’s still uninhabitable.
I am expecting Lordaeron to be restored in the near future as part of getting the Undead and Night Elves new homes. Restoring Undercity is a vastly easier endeavour than using assets to create a brand new city.
Soon after Gilneas and Gnomeregan which will be aaaany minute now, I’m sure.
And before Gilneas and Gnomeregan, there should be a Silvermoon and Exodar update anyway…
After all, Gnomes have Mechagon now so making Gnomeregan into a proper Capital City is not a priority for Blizzard anymore (not that it ever was…)
As for the Worgen, they will probably get a new place/zone alongside the Night Elves inside their new capital (just like it was in Darnassus where they had their own tree). And technically, they still have Stormwind which I think for Genn it’s officially considered “their second homeland” now, just like for Alleria and the Void Elves basically (if you don’t really count the rocks of Telogrus’ Rift in space anyway…)
Gilneas itself will probably become more relevant in a new future faction war I guess, but Blizzard also said a new war won’t happen anytime soon…but I think we all learned we shoudn’t really trust them on this one of course. (just like about the actual duration of the “confinement” of Sylvanas in the Maw)
Yes, Lordaeron belongs to the Forsaken.
The Light-worshipping, Queen Calia that was risen through the Light and is a extremely close friend of High King Anduin Wrynn.
So Forsaken culturally will be a better fit for the Alliance (same with the blood elves, really).
Lordaerong belongs to the Forsaken, and the Forsaken belong to the Alliance
Except the Alliance controls Southshore (Lordaeron), Amber Mill (Lordaeron), Shadowfang Keep (Lordaeron), Pyrewood village (Lordaeron) and Fenris Keep (Lordaeron).
Disagree, before Gilneas sure, but after Gnomeregan.
To be fair, they should update Quel’thalas, Azuremyst Isles, Gnomeregan, Gilneas, Hyjal and Tirisfal at the same time for all the homeless races!
I don’t think so…now that Anduin will stay in the Shadowlands for a whole and the Alliance will officially be led by hardened soldiers (and not really diplomatic leaders) like Turalyon and Alleria, both the Forsaken and Blood Elves are surely not in a good spot, and therefore the Alliance might mess with them in the future trying to reclaim their former holdings in Lordaeron (and even Quel’thalas as Alleria said), meaning both races are not accepted among the ranks of the Alliance at all even now that Sylvanas is gone (evidenced by Genn still being quite hostile against Lor’themar in his post-judgment speech saying he shouldn’t have followed Sylvanas for so long). And don’t forget the future role of the Scarlet Crusade too…
Most of these places must be rebuilt first anyway and I don’t think the Alliance can economically afford to rebuild them all at the same time, also don’t forget there is a difference between nominally and factually “controlling” a zone. For example the Night Elves officially “control” Darkshore again but the zone is just almost empty of Alliance forces (in fact the Horde still have a bigger presence there with the Shatterspear Trolls)
And for example even if Southshore will be completely rebuilt, then it will be locked in combat with Tarren Mill once again forever, it’s not like the Alliance is in any position to gain control of much of Lordaeron despite having a few bases here there (nominally). Not until a new faction war and a new offensive against the Forsaken at least, I guess…
Sure but some zones clearly have priorities over others, depending by the direction of the story of Blizzard in the future. For example Quel’thalas as the last true Capital City of the Horde and main Horde zone in the EK, definitely has a high priority right now. Same with Exodar that has been repaired and should be able to fly once again right now…
Turalyon “I cried because I could sense the Light in my teacher-turned-Forsaken Archbishop Alonsus Faol when he was in the Cathedral of Light” while Calia is basicly a Lightforged undead and Turalyon is a Lightforged human.
I doubt he’s going to war against his former teacher and former princess as they are both filled with the Light, like him.
Also, Alleria always wanted Quel’thalas to rejoin the Alliance, not genocide her people more and then claim Silvermoon.
Because Lor’themar was pinning all the blame on Sylvanas, while he willingly followed her until the last moment.
Genn did, and still does, acknowledge not all the Forsaken are Sylvanas stans. As shown in the Before the Storm novel during the Gathering, yet he would blame all blood elves for what Lor’themar did?
Also, just a quick correction, Fenris Keep (and the island) and SHadowfang Keep (and the village) are under Bloodfang Pack control (and no mention of the G.L.F.)
But, the Bloodfang Pack man both locations, guard the treasures and artifacts, and even gave Shaw and Flynn a “tour” of their keeps to check on aforementioned artifacts.
Southshore is however, still in the process of bieng deplagued by Raleigh the Devout and while guarded/mannen by Alliance troops is (for now) useless as a base.
Also, rebuilding Southshore is strategically smart and if Stormwind (and the Alliance, I guess?) can rebuild the Kingdom of Stromgarde in a couple days, I doubt a city like Southshore would be a problem (just a case of Blizzard’s rule of cool, admittedly).
That’s really an assumption of you. Why would Lillian Voss, Calia Menethil or the Forsaken in general want to automaticly wage war on a nearby Alliance village? That’ll be like saying the Shatterspear and night elves are at war because the Shatterspear rebuild their village.
Or that the Horde and Alliance forts/towns in the Barrens are automaticly at war. Or New Kargath and the Alliance outposts in the Badlands etc.
By that logic, neither is the Horde in a position to control much of Lordaeron. They have only 3-4 towns/villages/bases and the majority of Forsaken were evacuated to Orgrimmar.
Well let’s start to say the Light isn’t an omnibenevolent force, so one of them could start to turn into more extremist zealots, especially with the whole " The golden one claims a vacant throne. The crown of light will bring only darkness" prophecy that is probably talking about either Turalyon or Calia indeed (or both!)
But in general, coexistence of undead and living beings is not possible anyway, not for long. So even an attempt of dividing Lordaeron into a kingdom for both the living people of the Alliance and the Forsaken undead wouldn’t last long without hostilities ensuing soon anyway. Especially with the Scarlet Crusade still around and creating trouble for everyone, anyway…and the Forsaken still have to find a new way to “reproduce” after all, hopefully without taking corpses from the Alliance…
The majority of the Sin’dorei are fine without the Alliance as you can see even recently, they can deal with the remaining Scourge led by a San’layn even alone without the Forsaken or the Horde. Also a return to the Alliance of the High Kingdom of Quel’thalas would mean that the Void Elves would be free to return and that’s forbidden until the Holy Sunwell is still standing and active…so it’s not possible to “bring them back” to the Alliance without conquest, which was my point indeed…
It happened the same with Garrosh, as much as they disliked the ruling Warchief, the Horde races need time and preparation in order to rebel against him, otherwise if they are not ready and working together, they would be easily subdue by the Orcs or Forsaken. Now there’s a Council but back then the Horde worked like this.
Also technically the Blood Elves could have helped the Forsaken invading Gilneas back then in Cataclysm, bringing even more death and devastation to the Worgen. But the Blood Elves chose not to help despite the Forsaken had helped them in the Ghostlands. So Genn should be a bit more grateful to the Sin’dorei at least for that reason.
As an elf fan, through and through - I reckon that Shadowtwili is right in that not only do Quel’Thalas and the Azuremyst Isles need updating, but both Lordaeron and Hyjal need an update, for the Forsaken and Kaldorei.
I’m not a fan of completely “Highborne-ing” the Night Elves to the extend where they are just Alliance purple Nightborne / Blood Elves, but we have seen an update to their architecture in Val’Sharah, Darkshore and Azsuna. I reckon something which is combination of these 3, on Hyjal, could make for a great city for the night elf fans which can make up for the loss of Darnassus.
I do not believe the lies of Old Gods, no idea why anyone would take the lying, cheating, murderous, insanity-inducing parasites seriously?
Why? Besides they can make it voluntarily.
Either they allow themselves to go extinct or they give every human the choice of bieng risen as a (Light) Forsaken thus extending their lives.
They should explain the pros and cons tho!
I never said they weren’t fine withour the Alliance or Horde?
Not really, remember its an alliance and they can maintain their own rules. The night elves used to forbid arcane magic users in their lands when they joined the Alliance.
Also, Alleria literally stood in the same room as the Sunwell before it went crazy!
Or just tag along with the Alliance??? Horde and Forsaken can’t conquer the rebellios imperial subjects if the Alliance is defending them!
How about no?
The Alliance could’ve conquered Lordaeron twice, Orgrimmar twice and Thunder Bluff once or even destroy the Horde.
Maybe the Horde leaders (including Sylvanas) should’ve been abit more grateful for that.
Light Forsaken would be an Alliance allied race if they ever happen…but the main problem about the real Forsaken still stands even if they happen. Maybe they could recruit more numbers from freeing the Scourge…in any case living alongside the Alliance Humans if they returned in Lordaeron would just mean to ask for troubles for both races so it’s better if it doesn’t happen at all…
If the Sin’dorei returned to the Alliance, Alleria would either remove Lor’themar from power and become the new Regent Lady (or Queen if she’s really insane enough to take that title because the Old Gods told her that the throne of Silvermoon belongs to her once already), anyway she would clearly become an important character in the Alliance Sin’dorei new society…and as such, it’s very naive not to think she wouldn’t revoke the exile of the Ren’dorei…
and it’s scientifically proven that If a Void Elf touches it, it gets corrupted by the Void though. It would become way too stressful for every Blood Elf guard inside the Sunwell Plateau to constantly check every Elf that comes to visit the Sunwell (and wants to touch it to recall the good old times), if they are a Void Elf or not…you have to understand that it’s something that can doom their entire civilization. Blood Elves can’t take any risk about that.
Most of those times they could do it only with the help of (a) Horde rebellion anyway…
but anyway, “grateful” also in the sense that Genn should understand that when there was the Warchief, the Horde races can’t just turn against him in a single day because they feel like it, it’s way too risky.
Imagine Quel’thalas waiting for Alliance reinforcements when they are under siege of the Forsaken (and as usual the Alliance could be very slow to react, anyway)…that’s unthinkable from the point of view of Lor’themar.
And anyway Lor’themar could have retorted that Genn could have done more against Sylvanas, too…he didn’t send any of his Worgen to attack the Horde during the War of Thorns in order to defend the Kaldorei for example it’s too easy to talk like this against the others when in other situations you did nothing as well…
Let’s just agree to disagree on this part then!
With what authority? No really, what authority does she have to remove Lor’themar Theron and revoke the exile?
And if she could, why can’t Vereesa Windrunner? Why couldn’t Sylvanas Windrunner? Why didn’t Alleria immediatly revoke her own exile, remove Lor’themar Theron from power and have Quel’thalas join the Alliance when she visited?
Cool, luckily their exile could stay intact if the blood elves join the Alliance.
I understand it can “doom” their entire civilisation (even if the blood and high elves did pretty fine without the Sunwell for a decade or so) but by that logic they already have to check every elf that’s visiting the Sunwell because there’s no outward difference between void elves, blood elves or high elves (unless you’re an OG purple void elf ofcourse).
Luckily just like how the exile of the Highborne night elves and the usage of arcane remained intact in night elven lands when they joined the Alliance, so too could the exile of the void elves stay intact if the blood elves joined the Alliance.
Oh. Risky. Well I guess that makes the destruction of Gilneas, Darnassus, Darkshore, Theramore and Southshore alright. I mean genocide is way preferable than running the risk of having to hold out for rienforcements because you’re following a genocidal dictator (again).
Oh man, holding out against Forsaken is unthinkable, but genocide on two species isn’t?
Also, as shown with Theramore and later Dalaran, the Alliance as a whole and Stormwind in particular have proven to be able to respond quickly and decisively.
Both immediatly got aid when they were under attack and requested it, and Darnassus was immediatly able to evacuate countless civilians and innocents to Stormwind by utilising their own and Stormwind mages to portal them there. Sadly this had the side effect that troops had to be moved through sea instead of portals.
Genn didn’t try and destroy Warchief Sylvanas on the Broken Isles.
Genn didn’t advise Anduin that if Darnassus was captured, they should be freed before they could reclaim Gilneas.
Genn didn’t fight alongside Anduin and the Alliance when they invaded Lordaeron (and had to defend themselves against Lor’themar Theron standing by his genocidal warchief).
Genn didn’t help the Alliance recruit more allies to bring Sylvanas (and Horde) to justice.
Genn didn’t help in the invasion of Zandalar when it seemed they were going to join the Horde.
Genn didn’t join the Alliance navy when they had the chance to destroy the remnants of the Horde fleet.
Yes, Genn did nothing. Just accept Sylvanas from day one and didn’t war against her, or warn others of her nature for decades.
He did something, but not nearly enough to scold others on the other faction just because they had to act in a cautious way (for both rebellions)
In fact, I just recalled the Alliance did the same to the Blood Elves…as Garithos imprisoned Kael’thas and wanted to kill them all, the Kirin Tor Mages, the Ironforge Dwarves, the remnants of the Alliance of Lordaeron (which could very well include some Stormwind soldiers too), just… stepped aside and did nothing, and allowed it to happen.
But you don’t see Lor’themar scolding the Kirin Tor or the Alliance leaders because of that in the Sin’dorei past (even someone like Rommath didn’t, and I have to suffer an old wolf saying that to Lor’themar instead…at least Lor’themar just ignored him, he has to do some better things with his time I guess, like finding Prince Kael’thas and talk to him about the past and future of the Sin’dorei)
Yeah right. Oke. Sure, whatever you’re saying.
Genn barely does anything.
Lor’themar Theron on the other hand. Such a wise, patient, smart, tactically genius man. Wow, Genn should just shut up and accept Bore’themar as the superior person that totally stood against Sylvanas, unlike Genn!
I’m a Blood Elf fan, but I’m also impartial to this because their is a wider story here and both Hellaynnea and Shadowtili are right in what they say, but neither side can claim the moral high ground. The Alliance / Kirin Tor did wrong first.
Garithos’ actions were inexcusable and Modera, along with other members, did stand by and watch as those who taught them how to use magic, were put to the sword. That was wrong. Modera and the Kirin Tor should not only have stood by Kael’thas and the Elves, but they should have condemned Garithos’ actions as he had no legal grounds to command the Archmagi survivors.
However, the very same Kael’thas and his Sunfury (minus some), also joined with the Legion, set to doom Azeroth. They also attacked Quel’Thalas themselves and plunged the Sunwell into a very dark state, with references hinting back to Queen Azshara and what her and her Highborne did, 10,000 years ago.
Now Lor’themar is a very intelligent man and by the time of his short story, before WoTLK, he knew that the Blood Elves had lost the moral high ground, which is why he doesn’t make reference to the whole “Garithos” thing in a way, when addressing the Ranger Lord and High Priestess at the High Elf Lodge.
Both sides did wrong, whether it be the execution or joining the Legion. Now, neither side can claim to be morally superior.
Lordaeron belongs to the Horde. Accept that and move on.
No he’s entirely right, the Forsaken belong in the ground. They aren’t even a race, rather literally just human corpses.
Also, not everyone in Lordaeron was killed and raised, there are those who fled south, so that means the very same who did flee south are the rightful owners of Lordaeron.
That said, Silvermoon belongs to the High Elves, and not the Blood Elves and their usurper Lor’themar Theron.