Mage is absolutely useless atm

like, idk what is wrong with people that have any complain regarding mage being anything but useless nowdays.
i cannot find ANY class that does less damage than my arcane, ive full burst with bl people without even forcing their major defensive cds, my cc are often absolutely useless, sheep in a bg or in a duel means basically healing enemies, and any dmg will break it, same for ring and db, instant break from anyone, my defensives and fofensives, most of them can just be dispelled.
I legit do not even understand anymore who can think mage dmg is good.
Cast evocation 7 seconds 7% intellect, managem, 5%intellect
Cast Surge, 2.1 seconds, you get rune of power, 30%, and surge gives you 45% more damage
saltwater potion 30% more dmg
berserking 30% more dmg
consume clearcasting, 20% dmg on the next 2 arcane blasts, you proc it with managem, instantly burn it and presence of mind stopcast macro for 2 big blasts
insert burst macro with trinket (saltwater managem)
playing flasked, with intellect food
AND I DON’T FORCE divine shield off a paladin, because glory, and instant selfheals are enough to keep him up.

now if this was, any other expansion, all this would have been more than enough to kill him, i can tell you, that in vanilla, tbc, wotlk, cataclysm, pandaria, legion, mage was an absolute monster pure glasscannon dps that could focus all dmg in his burst combo, and 1shot, unless you used major defensives, or lined, or cced

nowdays? mage is a support class with MEDIUM mobility, yes ive said MEDIUM, yes you can kite a few melees, but unlike some other dps, you just don’t have room to do dmg, and kite at the same time, you either do one or the other.

most other classes, can just, leap, spear, burst macro, zugzugstorm, and thats your block. and that goes for most classes, you die from any aimed + rapid, your only ways to interrupt that, supernova, and greater invi, but ofc, they will do it on a stun, so you prealter ? u die before stun is over, u trinket to alter back ? he dispells your alter and u die, basically everyone watching you is your 5 minute defensive cd, and they can ignore you, as you are no real threat.

most of my bgs i focus only on icewalls, knocks, and peeling, because dmg is just not there, doesn’t matter how many things i abuse, there is simply NO DAMAGE

moving to ccs, while sheep with perfect coordination in arena does seem to be a very much hated cc from the opponent, in EVERY other scenario, its useless. you sheeping in bg makes you the strongest of healers, dispeller of all dots for your team, and all sheeps rings db get instantly broken by any zugzug warrior that is going to say he is doing MORE DAMAGE THAN YOU which is true because mage does no damage at all.

i could go on forever, but i know that the only people that understand what im saying are MAGES that are playing bgs, duels, or wpvp, the arena heroes that gert carried by the synergy with rogues or w/e don’t care, and the pve players are absolutely clueless probably of what it feels like to have your class butchered for years because it works just fine when mobs don’t move and your tank pulls around your combustion or burst.

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Frost mage is in very decent spot in competitive pvp. The damage is really solid, you can drop another player on 50% of his hp within GCD (GS + nova + lance proc), there is good synergy in kiting damage and overall spec feels strong. The issue is handling the pressure as a mage, I can see that becoming a large problem since in shuffle you will be tunnelled all time. But imo there is no reason to complain.

Next patch mage is about to be even stronger despite crit nerfs.

What is this based on?

Also would like to you what you are basing that on given the utter lack of any changes to mage other than the joke 5% buff frost and fire got.

10.1 hotfixes just dropped, about damned time: -

Mage

Arcane

  • Radiant Spark duration increased to 12 seconds (was 10 seconds).

  • Touch of the Magi duration increased to 12 seconds (was 10 seconds).

  • Arcane Blast damage increased by 10%.

  • Arcane Missiles damage increased by 8%.

  • Arcane Barrage damage increased by 8%.

  • Aberrus, the Shadowed Crucible 2-Set Bonus has been adjusted – Arcane Surge’s spell damage increased by 10% (was 5%).

  • Aberrus, the Shadowed Crucible 2-Set Bonus has been adjusted – Duration increased to 18 seconds (was 12 seconds).

Fire

  • Pyroblast damage increased by 8%.

  • Fire Blast damage increased by 10%.

  • Fireball damage increased by 15%.

  • Scorch damage increased by 15%.

  • Improved Combustion now grants Mastery equal to 75% of your Critical Strike stat (was 50%).

  • Improved Scorch duration increased to 12 seconds (was 8 seconds).

Frost

  • Glacial Assault damage increased by 20%.

  • Comet Storm damage increased by 10%.

  • Snowstorm’s Cone of Cold damage increased by 12% per stack (was 10%).

  • Frozen Orb damage increased by 8%.

  • Blizzard damage increased by 12%.

  • Brain Freeze now causes Flurry to deal 65% additional damage (was 50%).

  • Aberrus, the Shadowed Crucible 2-Set Bonus has been adjusted – Flurry and Ice Lance damage is increased by 20% (was 15%).

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WOO HOO

finaly :smiley:

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Well along with announced buffs, blizz has stated some specs will get nerfed more than others with crit nerfs (such as frost mage) and because of that they are tuning flat damage of other abilities. These are as following:

  • Frostbolt damage increased by 116% in PvP combat (was 100%).
  • Comet Storm damage increased by 8% in PvP combat.
  • Flurry damage increased by 8% in PvP combat.
  • Ebonbolt damage increased by 12% in PvP combat.
  • Frost Bomb damage increased by 12%.
  • Ice Lance damage increased by 34% in PvP combat (was 20%).
  • Glacial Spike damage reduced by 5% in PvP combat (was 15%)

So that’s a long story short. My take on the changes and why it will make mage even stronger you can find in my post ‘10.1 frost mage’ which i made couple days ago but sadly that kind of threads are not very popular on these forums.

Watching Venruki lose all 6 rounds in a Solo Shuffle (on his main, playing frost) last night was painful, but reminded me and a lot of the stream viewers of how bad/hopeless things can get for mages in PvP. I guess it was a “bad lobby” for a mage, but he did say that nothing in 10.1 will help mages in that kind of situation.

The announced PvE changes are just damage modifiers and they are clearly designed to help with AOE and make AOE talents more attractive. However, I think we all know mages will not drop vital single target and 2 target cleave talents for minor improvements on AOE. Snowstorm should have been changed to a single point talent and I think that would have made it appealing enough to take (at least situationally).

There’s still a huge discrepancy between Lonely Winter and Water Elemental. I watched a video today where someone pretended to be a new player in WoW and picked a mage and for a while didn’t notice how important Lonely Winter is. Most of Lonely Winter should be baked in to the base spells, which would then also solve the issue of Water Elemental not really being a great talent (although I’m stubborn and still run with it some of the time, but only when playing solo).

Watching the video by Manather (on the new damage changes) made me think about how I would tweak the frost talents.

  • Swap Meteor and Glacial Asssault and make Glacial Assault a single point talent
  • Make Snowstorm a single talent point
  • Make Fractured Frost a single talent point
  • Reduce Lonely Winter to 10% damage increase (or even less!) and buff the base spells a bit

The talents going from 2 points to 1 point would still get the 2 point effect, but with just one point.

If you take out points from single & target damage on the right side of the tree, you can invest in AOE & cleave talents on the left side, making things more balanced.

Would Cold Front be any good, if it was easier to reach?

when i say mage, i say mage, not rmp, not “with 2 people behind you” and not synergy and stuff, as a solo clas, mage is not that good atm, and i don’t see how 10 or 20% more dmg is gonna make that much of a diff, well i do play mostly arcane, and it feels like 2 major problems i seem to have are dealing dmg, and beaing weak to dispells.

I fell same mage is like usseles like in 100 players www please make it more common for normal playrs like me i hit like 2860 rio in s1 but i cant beat like any of other dps and i put lot of reading and studying about class but is so hard to playd it well when you dont hat 100% perfect set up, in raid eazy at every boss i got 90% at warcraft logs m+ insane to compare vs much worst players

i normally find it really fun to sit and theorycraft and try things and perfect my gameplay while spamming content 12 hrs a day when i don’t work, but some patches and expansions make this an absolute nightmare, right now, i can say that arcane cannot be top dmg in pvp, its just not possible. you lack the numbers, evne with the buffs coming, its just not happening, the numbers will make the 5-6 seconds of burst look more insane maybe, and i say maybe because we might lose the 2p tier set for 20% more crit chance, that was a solid burst gain that im gonna miss probably.

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