No, this isn’t another thread about drop rate. This is actually not that bad if you time your keys (2 items from end chest). This one is about really bad ilvl structure in there.
At first ilvl improves very quickly, each next key level gives better loot at the end. And then starting from level 7 it comes to a grinding halt.
It’s 200 ilvl for +7
203 for +10
207 for +12
210 for +15
There’s significant difference in gear and skill requirement between a +7 and +15, yet you only get 10 item level improvement, less than one difficulty difference in raids. There are so many people hard-stuck at 200-ish ilvl because of this stupid structure. You quickly run into a wall with this system, where you push your keys to say +12 (the best you can realistically do with 200 ilvl average in party) and you only get 207 gear. This isn’t enough to let you progress another 3 key levels to next tier of rewards. You have to play the damn waiting game from weekly vault to get any significant rewards.
3 Likes
bliz want raiding to be the endgame. they don’t want m+ spam to make heroic raiding irrelevant like past xpacs. the only out of balance part is the m+ vault still giving 226’s. which still eventually, well within a month or two makes hc raiding pretty pointless.
that said, M+ needs scaling down a bit to suit its rewards. people can still push stupidly high keys if they want the challenge, but +15’s difficulty defiantly doesn’t reflect the reward.
personally id rather see the vault nerfed for m+, them made easier up until loot cap and keep HC raiding relevant for more than a month.
sure thing, except that raid drop rates are also pathetic.
I’ve ran into numerous streaks of 10+ bosses killed without any sort of loot already. They tell us to raid but there is no reward from raiding. And on top of this, weekly vault from raiding also sucks, this time it’s skewed too much in M+ favor where it’s very easy to get 220 ilvl reward there (a single +10 key!) but from raids you need to kill 3 heroic bosses to have ONE 213 option.
I would be fine with this if raids awarded about as much loot as they did before. They nerfed the drop rates by nearly 50% compared to BFA in raids. And some items seem to never drop at all. I keep seeing the same cloaks and rings dropping all the time, but other pieces of gear - very rarely, if ever.
1 Like
oh yea completely agree. its no where near rewarding enough. im 6 mythic bosses and 2 sire kills dry this past month. as its all i bother with.
a bad luck protection in the form of a vendor would solve it…
IMO they need to go all in or not with “raiding is endgame” thing. not, well its endgame but do a +14 for mythic raid level reward once a week…
why spend 3-4 hours clearing the raid for a single 213 if your lucky, 2 if u won the lotto. or do 1 +14 and logout for the week / until raid progression / bit of pvp. thats what its caused amoung my guild
You get the gear from vault.
It’s not meant to get by doing the dungeon, Only vault.
1 piece per week.
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Then idk why should i be even playing anything except 1 or 4 mythic+ dungeons a week. Seems pointless. My raid progression this tier is extremely slow, i don’t think ill even get a curve. Guild went through 2 dramas with major breakups already, raids are farming the same bosses week after week, progress is non existent. People don’t bother anymore. Even a casual can do +7 and get 213 from vault or whatever, no need to waste lots of time on attempts in heroic (which is quite hard due to loot scarcity)
I did my 10x +14/15 and that’s it this week.
I don’t care about the raid, I don’t enjoy it, and I am overgearing it in many slots. I would need to do mythic to get decent gear from it and I really don’t care about mythic raiding. I also cba to pvp.
I need 4 more dungeons for KSM then no more reason to log in after I open weekly vault slots, except to push rio which I probably won’t do because I pug only.
Forcing people to gear through the vault instead through the grind is against the spirit of wow and demotivates players to keep on grinding which is the point of the game.
They need to delete the vault from the game and put the gear back to dungeons and raids.
2 Likes
then don’t play more than 1 or 4 if it feels pointless to you.
Also i don’t raid, especially in an expension without much loot drops… considering M+ vault give higher ilvl any way
Yeah it really feels like the vault is causing a lot of people to skip raiding and just do a few m+ for vault options then log. Imo the vault actually made things so much worse. Needs to be gone and loot put back into content… not timegated
1 Like
15+ and M+, in general, isn’t end game content. Raiding is.
Thats because of the absence of titanforging.
Your best loot improves one item per week from vault.
The easiest way to do so is to push your m+.
Heroic raiding is what you’ll do after having over geared it from m+.
And once you have done it once and see that almost no loot drops and that most of your loot already has higher ilvl you won’t bother doing it again.
And because you haven’t done the heroic raid a lot, doing it in mythic difficulty will be out of reach for almost all players.
Another factor is that investing in learning the dungeon mechanics is something that will last the whole expansion while learning the heroic raid mechanics is learning something that will become obsolete at a given point between mid March and mid May.
They could start to design raids just like dungeons; divide them into the shorter wings and balance them for 5-30 people. Raids are an outdated format anyways (take up to much time at once).
Well, for the sake of people who still like to raid old school, they could keep the current system, but as soon as a newer raid comes out, the older one is moved to “dungeon status”, can be run by wings and gets affixes like M(+).
(also implying that mythic dungeons and raids shouldn’t be treated differently regarding itemlevel)
Another problem is that people want to play it extra safe. So I usually get invited easily only to groups where I cannot get any upgrade (I have ilvl around 203 on my main and I can only get to invited to runs that reward me with <200 ilvl and we then finish the dungeon with 15 minutes left. What is the point? So I also started to play great vault only i.e. one or four mythics per week and that´s it. Great Vault is the only reasonable way to get upgrade.
M+ is absolutely spammable while raids are on a weekly lockout, like were you seriously unable to make that conclusion?
Raids = tougher to organize, more logistics, requires a dedicated team and commitment
Dungeons = can be done in a random day’s afternoon.
Like, I understand that pushing high level keys is difficult. Noone’s denying that it takes some skill. But when one run requires 4 times less players, 35ish mins of your time per run, and can be repeated for as many times as you have keys, it has to have item levels according to that.
Thanks to an elitist bunch who can’t tolerate that other players enjoy a different game mode that is equal if not more difficult than theirs in certain areas.
2 Likes
This is not even the worst part. From a +7 you get 216 in the vault. You can get better gear than what drops in +15 from just doing a weekly +7.
It just feels pointless.
And that will kill them, sooner or later.
most idiotic thing is that conduits are locked at 200 ilvl.
why cant they at least drop 213 at 15s or something? its ridiculous. you can get 213-226s from pvp and raiding…