While I completely understand the underlying philosophy of the new system, this has actually created more issues than it has solved.
For means of hopefully collating constructive feedback:
When someone votes to leave, the vote fails and they then continue to play, they effectively take the group hostage and force the disband on the next vote.
this is actually wasting time and making for a far more frustrating experience than previously.
I have just been in a group that spent 40 minutes in a stand off. 3 wanted to leave, two didn’t (it was a 12 that was out of time). It became impossible for anyone to actually leave and developed into an extended stand off as nobody could vote leave and people were again hostage taking to spite each other.
I suspect that this system works brilliantly in lower keys where characters are gearing, and therefore score is largely irrelevant. Unfortunately at higher levels there is no reason to complete a key.
Some suggestions:
Allow group members to have 5 abandon votes each. This would prevent the hostage situation above.
Making it impossible to vote for a period of time is just frustrating. Usually by the time the group has had a chat, they are ready to disband, and then have to wait pointlessly to do so.
3/5 group members wanting to leave would be a better threshold. Realistically if one player does not want to play then this will end the key.
The ‘stick’ of the deserter debuff is there, but there is no ‘carrot’ to actually make it worthwhile for people to then strap in and complete the key after it has timed out due to their arguing. Forcing people to finish a key that is of no benefit to them feels incredibly negative.
Anything added would need to be actually worthwhile. Does this need a supplementary system for people who voted no and then continued (although this could be open to abuse…)
Overall this has made for an excessively negative experience. I mainly play pug keys and have yet to have a ‘no’ vote that has then led to anything other than 10-15 minutes of my time being wasted stuck in a group with people arguing.
I would love to hear anyone else’s thoughts and particularly ideas on how to improve the system. I really hope this gets iterated upon quickly.
Again, I really like the philosophy that underpins it and the goal of cleaning up keys. I have had plenty of keys gone due to people insta leaving when they have been timetable, but all I am currently experiencing is worse player behaviour that is wasting me time.
pretty dumb system
why it requires 5/5 votes? there is ALWAYS someone who wants to grief others.
even after 50 death because people play without a mouse i am not to leave and people having fun abusing it
what we need is a basically surrender, where most people would agree and group would disband without penalty of leaving, maybe with penalty to the key itself like lowering score by one level just not to abuse the system?. If vote fail then the game is on I guess and you can proceed to normal kick voting.
I went to an Ara +10 key today, mage was the Keyholder seemt also good as rio was 2,3 k and 700+ ilvl, Mage total Dps not even 3 mil 4 of us tried to end the Key, Keyholder voted Against so it was rejected and we where forced to play the Key. 13 mins overtime. Because no one accept the Keyholder had fun anymore. This system is the worst enemy for Pugging. And they need to make a few changes there. Thats pretty awful. and if the Keyholder like a Boost the should pay Gold for it and not hold 4 others against there in a Dung.
There are 5 players. As soon as 1 has the mindset of ‘this is not it, I want to go’…it’s not gonna be very fruitful regardless of whether the run continues, the players leaves, or what not.
And for some reason this is overlooked; they just don’t want to play together anymore. Forcing them to in any shape or form will only lead to different undesired behavior.
I’d say…IF this system is to remain, limit it to +2 till +6. Beyond that point it starts to revolve around Crests → timing becomes more important → even if 1 player isn’t in the mood anymore, that will have a significant impact.
That and just automatically detect auto-leavers/griefers after the run started. It really ain’t rocket science.
Yeah the key holder being able to keep a group captive feels awful.
I really think there at least needs to be some form of meaningful incentive for pushing through after an abandon vote when the key is out of time.
The system stopping at +10 is definitely the way it should go. At least then there is an incentive for weekly gear etc.
I just had a +12 where we wiped, did vote, decided to keep going, had another 2 deaths which bricked the key (everyone agreed) and then we had to sit aimlessly for 5minutes so that we could vote again. It just feels ridiculous.
i dont even know why we need this system.
in all the years i had few leavers that radomly left. Most keys people left for a good reason but the vast majority 99% i had no leavers and we finished the key.
Nobody cares usually if you try and by the end you are 1min OT but typically you can see very early if you OT it by 10mins or so
the whole problem comes from blizzard giving owner of key 2 votes .
it shoudl have been 1 vote each and 3 - 2 win .
we told that exactly this will happen and bad players will be trying to hold others hostage in order to get boosted but nooooo no no - it was all the leavers fault always - not the underperformers
i was in a gamit 10 where this had just happened after a hooktail wipe the vote to abandon failed and the priest just sat their dead not doing anything, this is frustrating as its only week 2 and ppl are alreasy taking groups hostage
There’s a lot of takes in this thread about how annoying it is to be ‘held hostage’ in a key where you’re way over time with 30 deaths etc. and 2 guys not being willing to abandon, but I’ve noticed someting else happening too…
Pugs will go pretty smooth up until 1 mistake happens to where the key becomes tight but still timeable, and people will just abandon vote instead of actually pushing on. Since when does hiccup that doesn’t even leave the key unable to be timed make people just give up?
This new abandon system is never gonna work if Blizzard doesn’t punish people for going AFK if their abandon vote gets declined
It’s difficult to imagine this system working when you have 5 people who may have completely different mindsets going into a keystone.
Some people want to abandon after a single mistake that is salvageable… Some people want to keep pushing if there is any chance the key can still be timed, and some people want to finish even if a key is depleting.
Before we just had the issue where someone may leave if a key is depleting, but that doesn’t happen often because people don’t want to be ***holes. Now it’s like people think that because they started an abandon vote, it’s acceptable to stop trying even if it gets declined - you just go afk and try to abandon again in a few minutes. It’s kinda even more toxic than what we had before
You are an incredible degenerate person, if you think it’s acceptable to go afk in a key if you started a disband vote and everyone else declined. They’re not ‘keeping you hostage’. You shouldn’t have signed up for something you weren’t willing to do.
If you’re talking about cases where you’re over time and still only halfway through the key, please understand that this is not removely what I am talking about.
Also, please understand that as you’re telling me that 'You didn’t listen. So high on my moral superiority horse… ’ etc. - I am not the person who implemented this system nor did I ask for it. But it is incredible toxic to leave a key that is perfectly timeable, because you died once, when everyone else in the group wants to try and time the key still.
And you’re a 2500 DPS player running stamina gems btw. Please spare me the condescending tone telling me this isn’t a kindergarden… Pff
