Hi guys. I have been playing prot pally since season 1 of shadowlands, and i cant just push high content in pugs, since i dont have friends to play with me. Prot pala takes a lot of damage, blizz even nerfed World of glory heal to +250% per hp loss (it was 300%) since we take a lot of damage thats not fair. It is hard to survive, i mean im not having a fun time pushing high content and i love prot pala. All im saying is, bulwark legendary need to have some defensive mechanic too, or Shield of righteous. Some parry chance would be nice. please take a look, palas are fun to play but as soon as you reach +15 keys, it is just you sweating for not dying… (as you all know paladins are wheelchairs, it is hard to kite too.)
2 Likes
Disagree, they aren’t meta but they are perfectly adequate tanks.
If you want to kite you have to take consecrated ground.
If you’re squishy you should be using double judgement, its way more holy power generation. Otherwise take the avengers shield legendary and go first avenger.
You also have defensives, I’m not sure what you’re arguing here? You have ardent defender, Guardian and a bubble taunt. On top of that you have kyrian vial.
You’re doing 16’s atm, whats “high” content for you?
2 Likes
thats the thing, i dont feel good tanking. i deal a lot of damage, but when i play for example vengence i feel a lot better.
So Dejarous You see a lot of the defensives for Prot paladin is held up in standing in consecration Kiting is not really a thing that can easily be done if you need to keep defensives up, (even though it is the only real option sometimes) you see Just standing in consecration Prot paladin get 3% damage reduction (other tanks get this by not standing in anything) and Mastery reduces incoming damage but only when standing in consecration.
No other tank has a whole stat not work at all when not standing still. or nearly still.
Out of all the tanks having to move punishes prot paladin quite a lot more than the others if there is ranged or caster mobs in the pull.
Every tank has similar things that is not even worth mentioning when talking about tanks.
And how they feel about each other.
That is a talent that makes you take more damage then using other talents for you to have 8seconds every 5min (or 3.4min if you talent in less movement or being immune to spells for a set amount of time)
Or do you mean the bubble taunt fixate that lasts 3seconds? That any dps player with movement and a taunt can do the same as by just running away.
Prot paladin is the most squishy tank right now that is not even an argument to make they are, the redeeming feature is higher dps in theory than other tanks.
I’ve tried all tanks in SL except Monk, and Paladin is the tank I feel the least safe on, despite their huge arsenal of cooldowns. It’s the only tank where I can just drop dead seemingly out of nowhere. Even my warrior felt sturdier 20ilv below, and I barely have any experience playing warrior before.
Obviously Paladins are capable of doing high keys, but I would argue it’s the least forgiving tank to play in terms of getting killed from even the smallest mistakes.
The main issue I have with Prot Paladin atm is:
-
Free word of glory mechanic is clunky. Unless you’re already sitting on a free cast, you can get caught in a vicious cycle if you choose to heal yourself instead of keeping SotR up, because you’ll just get chunked down again. I also don’t think it should be on the GCD for Prot because it’s such a reactive ability and sometimes that GCD gets you killed before you can use it. I actually prefer the old version which was just a short CD.
-
Mastery based around standing in Consecration doesn’t feel good in M+ with all the kiting you have to do. It helps that they reduced the CD on it so you can drop new ones every 4 sec or so but still feels clunky to use. Would have preferred if the mastery effect was baked into SoTR instead so you would be more sturdy on the move, without having to constantly spend GCDs on putting down new Consecrations.
-
Upper limit on SotR duration. Even if you are able to generate a lot of Holy Power or get lucky Divine Purpose procs, SotR still caps at 13,5 seconds. I know this also applies to other tanks, but it was only introduced in the first place because of Brewmaster Monks building several minutes of Ironskin Brew, which is now just a passive for them. I don’t see a good reason anymore to cap SotR duration, or other mitigation for that matter.
It’s a shame really because I think the Prot Paladin fantasy is great and their overall toolkit is really fun. But with the current shortcomings it’s just offputting to play, especially as an alt. None of the other tanks gets punished to the same extent for small mistakes.
2 Likes
The mastery needs a rework to passively give damage reduction without sitting on consecration or make consecration move with the paladin. This would be huge.
They also need to revert the 15% armor nerf they did in Shadowlands prepatch or give us a good 15%+ hp bonus.
It is hands-down the best tank to snowball carry lower keys up to +15. Anything higher than that and you are better off with a Guardian druid or a Blood DK, they are just designed better for it.
If you want to push 20+ timed keys, you need a premade for a protection paladin, pugs would be a terrible idea.
2 Likes
Yeah pretty much this. Even if BDK gets chunked down as well they have passive to smooth things out below 30% HP, not to mention Death Strike is a natural part of the rotation so you’re always healing yourself. For some reason Blizzard decided that Prot Paladins should also take spike damage like a BDK, except that you can’t spend all your holy power on word of glory.
On low level content Paladin is very fun but as soon as you get to a certain threshold you just feel like a burden to your healer, and messing up one GCD can easily lead to death. Again, no other tank has this problem atm.
It’s one of the reasons I barely play it. I want to have fun in this game, not a heart attack every time SotR falls off for 0,5 sec or I take one step outside of my consecration.
Yeah once you start pushing high keys with prot paladin it becomes the hardest tank to play by far. It is way better raid tank than dungeon. But a guy like Eltharien has done +24 and even +25 keys on prot paladin so it isn’t exactly impossible.
Thats exactly what im trying to discuss right now. Prot paladins are NOT FUN in +16 or more. it is just heart attacks one after another… how can we contact blizzard about this ?
You can’t. “Not fun” is subjective.
It really is not subjective at all, randomly dying is not something anyone would think is fun or good gameplay.
As someone who used to heal m+ did you like healing DKs in BFA?
Now think of a much much worse version of that where you have no indication if things are going to go well or badly it just goes as it goes, and it is not how it is supposed to work by how the class is designed unlike DKs.
Of course fun is subjective, what a ridiculous assertion.
/facepalm
You got to be joking or just playing semantics i assume it is the semantics angle of the word fun here, because i can not believe you do not understand this.
Have you ever played prot paladin ? Give it a try in +16. And then come here and speak of fun …
Yea, I’ve timed 16’s current season on a prot pala.
Personally, haven’t tried higher than +15, since the dungeon portals have absolutely no value for me, especially that I am an engineer and can travel to any zone every 15mins.
I have 3 suggestions for you:
-
Go after some Domination gear from raids, they make a big difference in our performance, especially the absorb shard which smoothens damage intake by a lot. The only mobs I had a bit of issues with is Fortified Spires of Ancesion with raging and no pug DPS interrupt with me. Apart from that, no real issues with current +15 keys, it is all very smooth.
-
A bit of a Ballsy move, but I would suggest giving Venthyr General Draven a shot, he has great traits for both raids and dungeons. 13% damage reduction under 40%, 8% damage/Healing increase if you take "built for war’ talent, with “Regenerative Stone Skin” giving you another 15% healing hot(4-5% of my healing total). Add to that, you can use Ashen Verdict as an extra healing/damage CD every 4 mins. The other Soulbind talent “Move as One” keeps you constantly at 20-30% increased movement speed, which means you can easily kite mobs without the consecration talent.
-
Not your fault, but you need better balanced gear, that 25% haste can be lowered to 20% and God damn, that Vers % is so damn low, no wonder you take hits like a truck, My vers is around 25% with trinket and food buff. Mastery is unreliable when compared to Vers in most scenario’s, even with Holy Shield.
I know these are not talent or class suggestions, and it is sad that we have to resort to certain borrowed-powers to compensate for our weaknesses but I doubt they will do anything this expansion and we have to resort to these stuff until next Expansion(or until we give up and quit).
thanks but i know what my class wants, the whole thing is. other tanks dont have to take this much effort. im gearing a DH
It’s not scaling in self healing as i thought it would as other tanks are doing, we need to wait and see we are a bit behind
Not sure what you are quoting, but paladins have decent healing and I am not talking of word of glory, i rarely use it outside of the free casts. I have 5/6 passive healing methods. This allows me to facetank 95% of all dungeons, and pull 7k total dps on average, i do only 15+, too easy but wouldnt pysh keys with pugs. It really does get better with gear, I wouldnt ever change tank classes, it is just so much fun.
When you randomly die as prot pal you fail terribly at playing your class