my brain is smooth only because it’s more aesthetically pleasing
5 Likes
Eh - I’d say in that instance it’s more to do with differentiating the Chaos Dwarf mechanic from the Dark Elf slavery mechanic.
2 Likes
I mean, it really doesn’t even fix the discrepency, and it still means they weren’t above using slavery back then. Changing the words does not change the meaning in this case, forcing them to mine kaja’mite or enslaving them to mine Kaja’mite is exactly the same thing???
So the omly thing they changed was removing the word slavery, so Goblins can’t hold a grudge against Zandalari for enslaving them probably? 
(and people won’t be offended by the mere mention of the word)
1 Like
Sure, it might factually be that, but to the prideful Zandalari? Completely different…
5 Likes
I feel like we’re making up a guy to get mad at a bit here.
1 Like
I am not mad or anything, just feel like this change was completely unneccesary.
But then again, its kinda a blizzard thing to change things that doesn’t need changing 
2 Likes
I mean this is the same company that has spent 50% of TWW writing stories about Danath and Eitrigg snogging one another after they removed all of Danath’s racial slurs from the game that he used. Primordial-level Racist Grandpa was unfortunately already too far for Blizzard, we can only fear for future retcons to the Zandalari and Mogu, beyond them already retconning Rastakhan’s involvement entirely and acting like he didn’t have a single pinky-finger involved in the Pandaren-Zandalari Wars and Enslavement.
May the future have mercy on Lei-Shen’s lore, lest it become “The Thunder King tyrannically ruled over his enslaved populations. Politely.”
Its conspiracy-level posting but I do truly believe Blizzard gets absolutely curbed by their PEGI rating and higher-ups any time they remotely try to add something grim and or dark back into Warcraft. I have said for awhile now that I think Azeroth would be better served by a 16 or 18 rating to increase the width of the umbrella and allow them to write about and discuss more topics in a more mature manner.
4 Likes
Which might well be true. Lei Shen was not known for throwing slurs, while “I’ll rebuild the bridge with your bones for bricks” was still his style of rule.
3 Likes
Actually the Mogu being so reliant on slavery and then getting overthrown by the Pandaren is the reason why Zandalari see themselves as above it. As much as they were allies, they were also rivals, and seeing slavery be their downfall reinforced their convictions.
The goblin slavery was inconsistent with all of Zandalari lore about their stance on slavery, with every single other source in the game (and novels) both before and after being very clear about how they hate slavery, because even the lowliest of Zandalari labourers takes pride in his labour and relying on slaves is weak and shameful. Have you no pride in your work? Do you not dedicate your labour to Torcali?
Them enslaving goblins was a weird retcon that never made sense, and they’ve since retconned it in every other source to stay consistent.
9 Likes
Idk chief if I could put little green gremlin men and womwn to do all the digging/mining work (which by the way sucks), I don’t think the Zandalari (literally described as elves of trollkind, omega proud and pompous) would have been above having slaves to do that work.
As others have said, it feels like unnecessary smoothing of all the edges in the setting.
You forget they have a literal Loa for labour. It’s a form of worship to work the land. Delegating that to a slave is borderline blasphemous.
I would argue it was unnecessary edge that breaks their identity. For all the complaints people have about Blizzard not being consistent, there’s a lot of crying now when they are trying to make their lore on Zandalari slavery consistent across the board. The goblin slavery is the unnecessary retcon that didn’t fit.
5 Likes
Inconsistencies would not be out of place in any society, Zandalari or otherwise. Even if you have a loa for Labour, I’m quite positive some Zandalari, or even society as a whole, would be willing to entertain that this type of labour or situation would be fine to use slavery in.
Tauren are described as being spirutial and in tune with their surroundings, including being peaceful. Yet, we have the Grimtotem (pre and post shattering). Exceptions prove a rule, they don’t diminish them.
And in my experience, Blizzard touching on anything these days to “improve” it is sketchy at best, and destructive at worst.
Agree to disagree, I think gobbos being originally gremlin slaves of trolls was and is cool.
1 Like
Why are the Zandalari members of the Horde then?
The orcs are very well known, and famed, for their practice of slavery, enslaving anyone they can from other orcs to draenei, naga, worgen, blood elves, night elves, humans, ogres, and ogron, even up to this day.
https://warcraft.wiki.gg/wiki/Help_Wanted_(quest)
Kaja’mite… you know, the stuff that legend holds helped the entire goblin race to evolve into the ultimate masters of alchemy and engineering?!
It’s the stuff that helped us to overthrow our jungle troll oppressors, to take control of Kezan – may she rest in peace – and is the most valuable ore in all of existence!
Apparently until Chronicles 1 it was jungle trolls that enslaved the goblins and the intro for goblins has forest trolls depicted as their former slavemasters-turned-slaves.
do you actually want an answer or are you just using this post to go “red faction bad”
'cos I mean the obvious answer is that the Zandalari look at it exactly the same way they did with Mogu slaves - it’s an example of why the Orcs just aren’t as cool+badass+amazing as the Zandalari are.
telaryn would likely remember better but wasnt the zandalaris membership in the horde more tenuous than any other until the shadowlands prequel novel? because i remember fairly clearly prior to its events the zandalari saw the horde as allies but not equals. talanji did not start treating the horde on equal footing until their chief loa basically said “do or things gonna go bad for you without them.”
1 Like
They did not formally join until after the events of Shadows Rising, yes. The opening incident of the novel with the assassin trying to kill Talanji happens during her negotiations with the Horde Council and the fact that the assassin was able to get so close to her in Orgrimmar showed her that the Horde is sloppy and the Zandalari are going to formally end their alliance there and then, since they were already on thin ice over the armistice.
It’s only after the Horde stops the Widow’s Bite coup and Sylvanas’s plot to kill Bwonsamdi that they come around to formally joining the Horde officially after Talanji spends the novel soul searching and contemplating on her father’s legacy, which ultimately spawned the coup. Sins of the father and all that.
2 Likes
Speaking of which why did Blizzard retcon/write Rastakhan into an idiot?
1 Like
Because… Uhhhhhh OHE HEY LOOK A NEW RAID TIER!!
I wouldn’t go so far as to call him an idiot, its remarkable how easily the right people can manipulate, but its the same thing you can chalk up to any lore characters rash actions or acting out of the norm: content needs made and that content aint getting made if said characters half as brilliant as they are in the lore/books. There wouldnt be a need for content. They would have the issue solved then and there, or wouldn’t logically make the blunder in the first place.
Recent event in guild wars 2 reminded me of the chain of events where one of the settings most brilliant tacticians and diplomats suddenly started speed running the Anakin Skywalker guide to war crimes.
You want the simplest explanations for why any lore character acts against their former iterations? The writers needed to nessecitate plot for gameplay.
It´s pity they did at all, the whole thing with Talanji telling Sylvanas to her face that Zandalari are joining as allies was very fitting for the Zandalari. And, given how they´ve turned the Horde into faction ruled by a council rather than a single ruler, they could have easily stayed in their unique position without causing any narrative issues in the future (as I doubt anyone will have authority over other nations in the Horde coming forward anyway, so it´s not like there would be this big question mark of “will the Zandalari join with the rest of the Horde?” over Talanji whenever the Warchief decides something).
5 Likes