Quitter Mentality - Battle for Nazjatar

PVP War Mode and World PvP
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It’s amusing when forming a raid for Naz Battle, watching the group’s numbers fluctuate when behind on points. The quitter types looking on LfG for a winning group. But feels good to eventually have enough in the grp to turn the battle around. I love comebacks!

However, it’s not easy to keep track of raid members that have rejoined after previously quitting, but stay because winning now. They are taking the spot of a potential non quitter. It would be good if the raid ui gave a warning that the applicant already quit, with accept or decline buttons. This would be helpful to lock quitter types out of our raid.

Otherwise, gotta keep track of their names. Not easy for me when so many join and leave (‘joilers’).

Same types in bgs, except potentially bigger liability. Not as bad if they just leave, a player that’s less of a liability could replace them. But staying in bg, demolishing the morale of their team with negative chat, making a comeback impossible? Report for cheating imo.

At least in naz battle they typically just leave, but they should not be able to rejoin if battle is later being won.

Possible Addon Solution

Maybe there’s an addon for raid member management? Or someone could make it. This would be useful for any raid grp, not just naz battle. Here’s what I’d want in the addon.

A: Display accept or decline buttons when previous raid member attempts to rejoin, or instead auto decline previous raid members.

B: A moveable button, to kick previous raid members at any time.

C: Apply A and B to just current raid, or instead current and all future raids.

D: Output what actions the addon has done to chat, or not.

2 Likes
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Think it should be a natural auto decline if you set them on ignore TBH. Oh also update it so we can ignore B-tags too so I can set the player on ignore and decline them from my groups regardless of character they apply on.

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Ignore to prevent group joining would be nice, if not already possible. But for this situation, an automated list would be better, rather than having to ignore them. Btag would be ideal, but that would not be possible in UI without revealing the name, and at all in an addon I am guessing. The ignore list is limited to 50 (right?), this list could be thousands long.

Hmm… what if they leave raid because objective is complete, in that situation they should not be added to a list.

An addon would have to:

  • Have as part of its UI, an option to say objective is complete.
  • Which when clicked, displays a msg in chat “Objective complete you can leave raid.”
  • Players leaving before that msg, would be added to zee list.
  • If objective not marked as complete, rejoining players trigger a prompt for raid leader “Accept” or “Decline”.
  • And have a button for kicking players that are on the list, or option to auto kick. Good if this is all choices in addon settings. It may not always be the case that a player quit because quitter, and so the auto kick may not be 100% reliable - leader may or may not care about that, so make it an option.

I don’t know if raid member kicking is even possible via API tho.

If not, even an alert to a specified text channel would be something. The addon can for sure record name-servers, and can intercept log msgs - Spy does both those things. Could an addon intercept the msg that a player joined/left, look that name-server up in the list, and output a msg to chat in an obvious way - kinda like Spy, HTTD, etc. do. Then the raid leader has to manually kick em… better than having to remember names.

You can inv to a group via clicking on a name in chat, I wonder if can kick from group using addon.

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I think the problem isn’t necessarily people leaving the raid, but people rejoining all the time. Someone might leave for a legitimate reason before the objective is complete.

I would propose that an addon behave like this instead:

  1. Whenever the raid is formed a new list is created of all the people who leave the raid. This can happen locally for any member in the raid with the addon, even if they aren’t the leader.
  2. When anyone leaves the raid, they are added to the current list of leavers
  3. If someone on the current list of leavers rejoins the raid (either fully joining or requesting to join) the addon can take a configured action.

The configured action could be asking whether or not to blacklist the person permanently and if you are the leader or assistant also kicking them or automatically taking that action instead.

Besides kicking, all of these things can be done even if you are not the leader, so you can build up your blacklist while joining other groups too. Using the rejoining as a signal is going to make your blacklist more accurate too, since you won’t have to deal with any kind of message telling people when they are allowed to leave.

2 Likes
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Ey, good thinking. I like the idea of it not just being for the leader, anyone can build up a blacklist. Nice. And addons can share data, that would all be great!

What if they leave raid after the battle is won. They should not be added to blacklist. If the addon can detect Naz battle is over, that solves that issue tho. But maybe it can’t, still want the addon. Hmm. Maybe I am missing something!

Also, would be great to know if members can be kicked via API for auto kick. But, if all we had was a frame listing the impacted players, when clicked it targets them, can right click kick. So, at a minimum that could work.

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Since the list I described in bullet point 1 is only temporary that causes no issues. When the raid disbands the temporary list goes away. After the battle is over the raid will disband and no one will likely rejoin, if they don’t rejoin they don’t get added to the permanent blacklist.

Personally I would not automatically add people to a blacklist but instead show a popup every time someone rejoins to ask what to do.

2 Likes
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Ok, sounds good. It would be cool if Blizz just put this into the UI, but they won’t!

If I was not lazy I’d make this addon!

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the problem is the abuse it that can be made with the system.
i dont like you so if i notice you i kick you and because i have said addon next time you apply to this raid i will blacklist you because i dont like you and i have assist.
tho to be fair it should not be possible to teleport/shard anyone into a on going battle(goes for both sides), everyone trying should get the option to shift out if they want to but not anyone into the battle

1 Like
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Not abuse. The ones building the raid have ofc every right to decide who’s in the raid. This is about helping them to do that. Ideally, there would be no quitter types, but since there are - would be great for group formers to be able to eliminate them easily.

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but there is a possibilty of abuse from how it was typed out and that should not be there, so i could get assist and kick you(assuming you dont have assist or is leading) and when you reapply i blacklist you. now good luck getting in a raid.

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Well, ye be careful who you give assist to, same as any raid.

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and that is not taking into account stuff like me needing to go out for 2 mins to do something or getting offline because of a power cut then comming in a little later to see im kicked(most likely to make room for others) and then try to join again only to get black listed, there is to many options for it to go wrong and it does not really do anything for the game other then having battles un balanced by people sharding in way to many people for the shard to handle, to me it would be better to just make it so you could not shard in people when the battle is started, would also fix your problem.

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Problem with preventing shard hopping - you rely on your shard’s existing players to be motivated to win battle. What if they never are, you never get the chance to win. Boring! Not fun. Better to allow shard hopping and have motivated players in the zone, for both factions. Both sides can import players, if server lag both sides get it equally, same opportunity to win.

So imo shard hopping is a requirement for battle. But, it introduces the quitter mentality.

The blacklist addon: what matters is, eliminating that player from future raids formed by that raid leader. It’s up to a raid leader who is in their raid for any reason. This addon simply helps them to auto identify quitters, which they can do without the addon - the addon just makes it easier.

How the addon works will reduce risk of affecting innocent players. The blacklist would be triggered when players leave raid, and rejoin. That is a quitter that is shard hopping to find a winning shard. We do not want that player in a raid battle.

The question is, is it possible to make this addon? I can’t quite be bothered finding out hehe. Such an addon could potentially be useful in other raid or even party situations. For example Call to Arms lfg parties.

Doesn’t have to be an automatic blacklist, raid leader could be prompted by addon UI to take action, add to blacklist Yes/No. That way innocent players not affected.

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If I’m not mistaken the Battle for Nazjatar only activates based on the shard population, thats why you can always find battle for nazjatar’s active (from what I understand atleast.) if people stopped factions from pulling in excessive amounts of players it would remain theoretically an equal playing field.

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Ye, but I’m talking motivated players, rather than players that just happen to be in shard. If 8/10 existing shard members are not interested in battle, that’s a boring battle. Better to keep the ability to shard in motivated players. See no reason to change that. Both sides have exact same tools to form raids.

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Hard to fix without being strict like how world pvp used to be on servers. I remember how hectic it was to get into Tol Barad and Wintergrasp when there was a queue for it, its a shame that Nazjatar isnt treated that way when the battle for nazjatar begins.

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Doesn’t need a fix, sharding in motivated players is already implemented. We’ve had x realm grouping for several expansions now.

Ye, those zones feel fake WPvP to me. I prefer anything can happen situations :slight_smile:

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