Re-evaluating the Keystone System (Mythic+)

Community General Discussion
1

I’m a Holy Paladin trying to get into +16/17 Mythic+ keys through the group finder, and I’m spending more time applying to groups than actually running dungeons. Sure, you could say I’m not playing a “meta” healer, but I think the bigger issue lies with the structure of Mythic+ itself rather than my class.

It also doesn’t help that we’re near the end of the season, and far fewer >=16+ keys are being run. RaiderIO data shows the volume is pretty low right now, though I’m not sure how it compares to previous seasons.

That said, I want to take a step back and examine why the keystone system exists in the first place. At this point it feels like an outdated mechanic that introduces unnecessary friction for several reasons:

  • Your keystone is random, and often it’s not even a dungeon you still need for rating.
  • If your key isn’t resilient, you waste time forming a group and then another ~30 minutes running a dungeon you didn’t want to be in.
  • Group creators usually prefer meta classes, understandably, since they want the cleanest run possible. But this heavily limits who gets invited.

Because of this, I’m struggling to understand the hesitation around moving toward a more straightforward M+ progression model—something like: clear a dungeon at +N, unlock +N+1 for that dungeon. No keystones. No depleting. No grinding back up a bad key. And potentially less pressure to invite only the most meta specs.

Lastly, regarding the group finder: is there a reason we can’t have an actual queueing system based on current rating rather than this manual “apply and hope” setup? It feels like 80% of my Mythic+ gameplay is waiting in the group finder instead of doing the dungeons themselves.

2

You could join some ingame or discord m+ community. You’ll have easier time to get into groups, rather than wait for random invite in group finder.

And how would this work? Do you propose to start with +N and if you don’t clear it you can’t proceed to higher level for that dungeon? Which means you have to first do all +N just to move to +N+1

This will never happen. People who are strictly performance oriented will always look to form best group composition, hence meta will always be for them first pick.

Again, look at my very first sentence - you can give it a try if you don’t have good guild for that. Usually, those communities but also some guilds are doing runs not strictly based on some schedule (like Raids are scheduled for example).
Up to you, hope it’ll get better for you soon.

3

You could join some ingame or discord m+ community. You’ll have easier time to get into groups, rather than wait for random invite in group finder.

The in-game community search and finder system is archaic in its design. Its search functionality is so limited that you often have to paginate five to ten times just to find anything, and even then the communities you discover are usually outdated. Yes, a Discord M+ community can help, but having to tab out to find keys is just a poor man’s band-aid for the fundamental shortcomings of the current group finder.

And how would this work? Do you propose to start with +N and if you don’t clear it you can’t proceed to higher level for that dungeon? Which means you have to first do all +N just to move to +N+1

It could function similarly to how keys work today. For example, if there are eight dungeons in the seasonal pool (A through H), you can queue specifically for Dungeon A. If you time it, your next run becomes A+2. If you don’t time it, well that’s fine your key doesn’t deplete, you simply queue for another try with the same or new group.

Likewise, if all of your dungeons are at +15 and Dungeon A is easier than Dungeon B, you might find it more efficient to push A+16 and A+17 first. This would let you progress a few levels higher in certain dungeons compared to others—just like how key pushing works now.

It wouldn’t be efficient to take Dungeon A from 1 to N while leaving the others at +0. The rating you gain decreases as the key level gets higher, so to maximize score you’d want all dungeons to sit at roughly the same level. That’s how you maintain a well-rounded rating.

This will never happen. People who are strictly performance oriented will always look to form best group composition, hence meta will always be for them first pick.

Sure — this can still happen if you want to form a specifically crafted group. I’m not suggesting they remove the LFG feature entirely, but rather that they allow players to queue based on certain criteria, such as current rating or a combination of rating plus current dungeon level.

As an aside, I also think the lack of incentives to push beyond 3000 is part of the problem. Players who go higher than 3000 are typically doing it for the title—which is awarded to only the top 0.1%—or simply because they enjoy the challenge. There’s no reason the WoW developers couldn’t design additional rewards for pushing higher. These rewards wouldn’t need to be power-related; they could be purely cosmetic or take any number of creative forms.

4

At that high key level you should definitely invest in finding a team mate .post in recruitment threads .also in communities like no pressure .