I would like there to be some balance overall in m+. If you want to talk about expansions of not being meta I’m no stranger to that, being a holy priest main, but you know, it doesn’t mean it’s ok if something is blatantly OP just because it’s a different thing then last time.
Ion mains a Restoration Shaman.
Balance really we have had those spells always and priest pala and druids are still doing good there has never been since a good time for healers so close .
I mean, they had them since Legion, and oddly enough in Legion it was fine, while in BFA it was not enough for them to have decent enough coverage in M+.
I do not think that the class needs pruning just because of this, personally, not unless you aim to drop all unique features other healers have (mass dispel, guardian angel - holy priest cheat death -, purge, pain suppression, ironbark and so on.)
Druids are still pre-dominant in M+ by the way, having the highest coverage in pre-10 keys, and being second best in keys between 10 and 15.
If anything if you want balance then you should ask for monks to get some sort of buffs in the form of utility, and nerfs to druids and to an extent paladins.
The question you should always ask: Are priests/paladins/druids/monks fine for 15s? So far it seems like Holy and Mistweaver are lagging behind, while the others are doing perfectly fine representation-wise.
Disc priests are apparently doing really well, having almost as much representation as druids do. I guess priest utility could do with a look at as well?
Yes, damage doesn’t matter at all, especially on the adds on Torvald in SD. /s
Disc is in pretty good shape atm in m+ but i admit we are a little infront of you but i only admit that because its you .
To make it better. Also in legion. And that is when i started playing, so i dont know how it was before. But as far as i know that brez is there since forever.

I guess priest utility could do with a look at as well?
Disc Priest is a design mess in general. It’s really dependant on your group being good, but if it is the utility and coverage it brings is nigh on broken. No surprise that even Limit and Echo use 2 Disc Priests each in their progression teams.
I personally feel the spec as it is currently designed is impossible to balance properly, so needs a complete redesign.

I do not think that the class needs pruning just because of this, personally, not unless you aim to drop all unique features other healers have (mass dispel, guardian angel - holy priest cheat death -, purge, pain suppression, ironbark and so on.)
Some unique utility is okay, but there should be a limit to it as well. It’s fine I think if shaman kept their link and cast while moving while dropping the stun and interrupt and astral shift. Would still be very strong.

If anything if you want balance then you should ask for monks to get some sort of buffs in the form of utility, and nerfs to druids and to an extent paladins.
It is my understanding that monk’s heal output and CD coverage is fine, but that they have massive mana issues, which is something blizzard has exacerbated with the water change.

I mean, they had them since Legion, and oddly enough in Legion it was fine, while in BFA it was not enough for them to have decent enough coverage in M+.
Like I said, I feel BFA’s heal meta was less about the amount of defensive and preventative utility you brought and more about the potential to deal damage while healing, which druid was in a class of it’s own for.

Like I said, I feel BFA
So what about Legion were we were turned away aswell ? and BFA we were mocked . Infact all the utility we shamans have has been ingame since classic apart from the BR totem which is useless .
I wish i had a mass dispell , a fort buff ,a cheat death , a grip a power infusion so on and so forth .

Some unique utility is okay, but there should be a limit to it as well. It’s fine I think if shaman kept their link and cast while moving while dropping the stun and interrupt and astral shift. Would still be very strong.
We had this in previous expansions and were not invited in M+.
I rerolled for a reason in s1 bfa from resto shaman to pala. The shaman was with all this utility terrible.

Disc is in pretty good shape atm in m+ but i admit we are a little infront of you
but i only admit that because its you .
O yea I think disc’s ok in m+ actually. In fact first team to do a +15 had a disc not a shaman. I was simply saying healing throughput wise, shaman definitely does more than disc atm in a 5 man group.
You can’t ask nerf for every other healing spec that goes to top just because yours is designed by an incompetent person.
Holy won’t be S tier in M+ ever, unless you nerf hps of every other spec into unplayability.
I don’t mind not being top, I’m used to that and it would also be hypocritical to say it’s not okay for something to be obviously top and then demand to be top yourself.
I think the gap should be narrowed.
I can’t think of a way to buff Holy that would not trickle down to it being even more ridiculous in raids, so I didn’t suggest that.
The only thing I could think of would be to make analogous utility spells for holy, but at that point you’re just taking unique aspects of other specs and bandaiding them onto holy, which wouldn’t be good imo.
An idea I think could be good would be to make censure baseline and replace it with a talent that lowers the duration of psychic scream to 3s and increases the cooldown to 2 minutes, but makes it no longer break from damage and horrify mobs in place instead.
The problem disc faces is that it is a spec that is designed for damage prevention on top of dealing damage, so yes, they likely need a complete redesign if we want them to not be top dogs in atleast one type of content (which they have been for multiple expansions now.)
Shamans have had massive amounts of utility ever since classic, way more than what the have now. It is simply because of that I feel they should keep theirs, because it was always what distinguished them from the others. As I said previously this only really became a problem because shamans generally weren’t allowed to have the throughput to compete right off the bat, on top of their utility being niche and mostly useless in BFA.
Monk’s biggest downfall is that they have really good burst throughput with high mana costs, on top of them having little in terms of utility. In M+ they still have their AoE stun and ring of peace, on top of really good defensives (way stronger than what shaman has.)
There will always be a topdog in terms of strength, and so far it seems like the difference between the healers is actually more balanced than it was previously (as I said only MW and Holy has low representation.) I see no reason for a change yet, and even if there ever will be a change it will come in the form of throughput adjustments (which shamans already received once.) This is the expansion of “unpruning” so Blizzard will not touch shaman toolkit.
But you need not worry. Blizzard never lets shaman stay top for long. In the end we always fall back to druids and paladins. It is just the way things go.

I think the gap should be narrowed.
If you actually look at rankings and facts you will see the ALL healers have never been closer its the stupid players and community who ask for meta ANY CLASS can do 15s

I don’t play a resto shaman nor have I ever grouped with one
I am pushing +7/+8 content same as you do. I play a tank and can’t say that at this level that resto shaman is far more superiour than other healers I partied with. I was in party with all healer specs.
As for bloodlust, mages and hunters are also a good source. If you ask me I find that druids’ combat-ress is way more usefull in M+ than the shaman self ress. If things go south, the tank dies first in the majority of the cases.
I am not talking high level key pushing here. I am not there at this point and neither are you.
Paladins and Druids were bonkers in BFA. Can’t other healers be decent too in M+ for a change?

his I admit is hearsay because I don’t play a resto shaman nor have I ever grouped with one
This is the worst part. Not that I’m disagreeing with you - when resto is played well it brings so much utility to the table.

AND COMBAT REZ
You mean the talent that you have to drop with the intention/knowing someone is about to die? it isn’t all that good lol. Thus why no one uses it.
Also all healers are doing super well in M+ at the moment. Disc, Druid, Paladin and Shaman are all capable of doing 15+

You mean the talent that you have to drop with the intention/knowing someone is about to die? it isn’t all that good lol. Thus why no one uses it.
I only used it in s1 bfa when the game was “spam the tank, never have time for healing other members”. I just knew somewhere dispite the insane focus healing tank that he died somewhere. But throughput was by far the biggest problem for shaman in bfa s1 to s3. S4 with corruption shaman got actually pretty decent again. Resto got buffed for 3 seasons in a row. and it was needed.
But yes. APT is ‘useless’. it is not a brez and it is also not even counted for those
Why not have an enhance shaman & disc priest in your m+?
More mobility
Still have lust
More damage
More healing
Yeah, the talent can be good once in a blue moon, it has it’s unique times where it’ll shine for sure, but it’s very much not a talent people will realistically rely on.
Especially when it’s on the same row as Earthern Wall totem (love of my life) and Ancestral Vigor