No just Shaman and let Paladins shine for the rest of SoD. Make it fair and make Horde misrable.
Not being able to attack while in bubble would be a good start. That would herd out the terrible palas from the actual good ones.
Paladins so OP, SIKE
Literally goes over every nerf paladin got over shaman.
"Pops bubble, doesnt heal, and just expects to win.
LolâŠand this ladies and gentlemen is your typical Ret Pally."
A bad paladin should not win vs a Shaman no. A good Paladin wont use bubble in the opener⊠A good pala will use it as a last resort to bandage. But now all the meh palas are opening with bubble and when they lose - lol - they come crying over shamans? Like what.
TheyÂŽve been soo used to just facerolling everything with bubble in the opener so when they cant do that vs Shamans they cry about themâŠ
In that video the pala made 3 misstakes and got destroyed in the first fight.
Second fight he left his brain completely- he actually opened with bubble⊠I cant watch that guy anymore tbh.
Take a hint shamans OP.
It literally doesnât matter what a paladin does against a shaman, shamans mostly full HP and mana. Horde players are literally delusional af to even believe paladins OP when their faction class quite literally blows them out of the water in terms of Damage, Healing, CC and CDs.
And judging from your yapping, you have 0 clue about how broken shaman is and apparently bubble is a âI winâ-button for you.
whatever keeps you above the water, 
You just posted a video of a terrible pala getting destroyed, and you think that is how the matchup goes for a good pala? Jesus no wonder why youÂŽr getting farmed by shamans - you clearly have no clue about how to play Ret - we want palas nerfed because unlike you there are actually good palas that know how to play. This has nothing to do with your experience as a pala - since your not one of them - can you get this through your tiny brain?
When I talk about Ret palas - its not the likes of you Im talking about, not the below average meh palas that open with bubble vs a shaman lolâŠ
So let me ask you, if a good pala engages a warlock what tip do you have for that warlock?
1v1 Scenarios in vanilla are all about rock paper sixors, its pointless to discuss them.
If palas cant attack while bubble that wont really impact the good palas, it will however impact the terrible ones. I think that is a good change.
Hunters counter Ele shaman, so im fine with Ele shaman ripping noob rets anyday of the week.
Ret pala does not counter hunters, IÂŽm not talking about 1v1ÂŽs when I am refering to these nerfs - its bad mechanics that should not be in the game (it made sense in P1-P3) - but not in P4. Same as DR not being implemented on entrampment - its bad for the game.
This is not a 1v1 discussion about bad paladins vs good Ele shamans - ofc they are going to get destroyed - when he opens with bubble - doesent even have engi vs the class that counters him.
Its like a hunter going up against a SL lock in Vanilla with out engi or max distance and then crying that he got destroyed.
Sad part about the video is that compared to him, a good pala with engi only needs one trinket to do well vs them.
And here is he still yapping, mate you talk so much nonsense you could feed an orphanage. Yes that is literally representable for any paladin v elemental shaman.
Shamans have it literally easy mode since day one and thatâs a real fact.
We have more clue how to play ret than any horde player trying to pretend to, which is loads more.
LOL, keep dreaming troll. You keep yapping on how âgoodâ paladins are yet never played one. Itâs literally the reality that paladins got more nerfed than shaman till p4.
Run meta, drainlife rune to reduce AA damage and gain more HP
Use succubus/felhunter/felguard pet - if you dont you are more likely to lose anyways.
Pray, this is a hard matchup.
spoken like a clueless clown that gets owned by alliance paladins, when you already rolled horde.
lol. you dont play pvp, stick to pve.
lmao. aslong shamans are simply overtuned with their mechanics, which is just a fact, bubble is fine. Even in group content shaman is outstanding, Paladin is not.
PvE players like you are still delusional, even if he would have engi, it wouldnât make a difference thanks to decoy and tremor cancelling it out. Not to mention 25% resist as an orc. Just stating the obvious which is not obvious to you.
Tl:dr just for you, stick to PvE, it suits you perfectly as you lack experience, knowledge or even skill regarding PvP. You are just a sad troll who needs to go outside.
IÂŽm a PvP player you imbecill-.- you have no arguments other than that you are clueless - we already know that from P3 dude. Yet you keep talking about PvP when you have 0 clue with a 99% lose rating in BGÂŽs. Thats already established since P3 my dude.
When I speak about ret nerfs I refer to good palas, not garbage palas like you - do you understand this?
Are you? Explains why you give a damn about PvE parsing in PvP context. You bring up just slander where other people and me bring the actual objective facts.
We know how bad you are if you struggle against a nerfed shaman in form of a paladin, thatâs why you post threads about it and cry about bubble, a literal worse CD than anything shamans offer.
sure you doâŠ
A Yes or No question, do you understand that when I speak about Ret palas its the good paladins - not the garbanzo palas like you. Do you understand this fact?
I dont give a damn about PvE parses, there was a PvE andy insulting my logs as a PvP player - I only stated that my logs were better than his as a PvP player. Reading is hard.
No, you pretend to speak about good paladins yet they posted that and shared it on the paladin discord, you donât even speak for good or bad paladins.
You speak for shamans and horde
The illusion is real here, try to touch grass and go outside.
The video you showed was a really bad paladin, you understand that right? I think the problem is that you dont, since thats the opener you use vs them. Thats why I think its pointless having a discussion with you mate.
For a Ret to even stand a chance against their counter - they have no room to play like a beginner like that. Ontop of that they need engineering to even have any ârealâ 1v1.
Like I said, its like a hunter in vanilla going up against a SL lock with out engi and max distance and then crying. Only proves that he knows nothing.
I dont even play Pala and I could see 3 misstakes he did in the first engage, the second engage he just had a brain freeze with that opener. IÂŽm not claiming to be a god in PvP or even above any other PvP player but hell, that dude was playing like a beginner that knows nothing about his hard matchups let alone even has engineering - hes the typical Ret paladin on these forums, used to winning with using bubble in the opener. And when that didnt worked, he comes and cries about shamansâŠ
Back in Vanilla-Pservers, imagine this with the narrow toolset Ret had - there used to be some extremly good RetÂŽs that people feared - do you know why?
Except that is literally what happens to most paladins, if not all against shamans. You could even place two competitve players respectively of their class and it wouldnât look much different at the end.
You donât get that at all and never will since you lack the quite literal experience of an alliance PvPer and especially paladin.
Yet you proceed to resort to yapping like you are actually a professional in PvP, yet you are literally cannonfodder and a troll. No one takes your advise serious.
You sit in a glasshouse even before we started to discuss this, when in reality this is not a discussion, but you getting schooled hard. This is like talking to an oblivion skyrim NPC.
The paladin discord is laughing at your every post because you are literally yapping more than any other clown here that is attempting to defend shaman and horde as a whole.
He had multiple and different approaches to engaging the shaman, all of them failed. It literally doesnât matter even if he had engineering to begin with. People overwhelmingly agree with OP there.
You are literally still yapping a massive pile of false information and attempt to be right when you are so blatantly wrong. Thereâs another paladin on the EU that prettymuch explained the same approach as a paladin vs shaman to a thickheaded horde player just like you.
âIt literally doesnât matter even if he had engineering to begin with.â this alone proves that you know nothing about Classic 1v1 PvP. Please go troll some other topic instead of this one.
Itâs a fact, ignoring this wouldnât change it.
Tremor cancels out MC cap
Stun resistence screws with nades
Decoy screws with gnomish netting trinket.
Imagine using MC cap when tremor is up⊠Like I said please go troll someone elses topic.
There is another trinket you forgot that is the most important, but im done giving you advice mate. And a little neat trick that some godlike Ret palas are using vs EleÂŽs that is very efficient - in 10 years you might figure what that is.
Anyone still engaging with the Wave guy⊠itâs a waste of time. Guy was complaining during P2 about losing to some resto sham silly spec⊠as ret.
Guy probably is a keyboard-turner mouse clicker, the very last issue he has is class balance. Always whines about paladins being weak.
To bring paladins to the level he would consider strong it would mean to make paladins fly and have 40 yard melee attacks probably.
2 Likes
Waste of time to engage in any meaningful discussion with Horde/Shaman players tbh, sitting in glasshouses, since the start of SoD.
Clowns the whole bunch of em, clouded by their inflated egos and believe paladin is even remotely as good as shaman in 1v1, WPvP and group PvP.
Paladin is C tier at best, shaman is sitting strongly at S, just a fact. Just see all those horde on every server camping BRM and winning AV with a 55%+ WR at least.
I have attacked paladin in AV, ambush hardly crit for 400, mutilate per weapon crits for 300, normal hit 150 max. while having lobotomizer and glacial blade both with crusader. almost full shadowcraft and some darkmantle armor. (i use armor reduction poison with improved expose armor so I hit as hard as possible into warr/pala)
Paladin: Stun (do I use trinket now or after repetence?), Exorcism: 900, divine storm: 600, melee hit crit 1100,⊠some other abilities hitting 700+. I was dead in one stun, if I wereânt, there is still bubble a, bubble b, loh,âŠ
Hunters: chimera 1200, explosive trap 850 AoE, multishot 800,⊠daze from 1m close, frost trap that also roots,⊠shooting through game objects I cannot pass⊠while hitting him for similar dmg as paladins, little more due to armor diff.
Boomkin through LoS starfire (non-crit) 1200.
Warrior destroyed me in one charge stun (without using execute), if its not enough: disarm, prevent stealth: rend.
Rogues got an OP PvE rune (cutthroat, pve since bonus dmg only works against non-player controller units), mutilate become obsolete in terms of damage output compared to other classes. with mutilate i am doing just a little more dps as I did in P3 (new weapons and armor), with cutthroat almost 100% more dps.
Yeah its rough as a Rogue atm vs some matchups. Not sure if it will get better or worst in HW gear t1+. Warriors will become absolute monsters - they kind of deserve it (with Spinal Reaver).
Rogue scaling isnt the best either. And now with the trap meta its rough.