orc racial is literally the only thing remaining that stops you from dying to 7 second kidney, if you have the choice to play orc and chose literally any other racial you sign your own deathsentence into any RMX with 2 braincells
classes like rsham are literally unplayable into rogues on alliance and we REALLY dont need more questionable rogue mage players out there
Stay safe, forum police is coming and they gonna tell you you are biased cuz ur a warrior for speaking out true facts.
No one can hide from rogue mage players
Yes Orc+Sephuz Chest is MW’s choice vs rogue+mage
You see Cutie? you prove my point, your trying to make it about Rogue Mage even though the conversation is about the Orc passive because you dislike/hate the classes. That’ called having a bias opinion, just so you know.
That’s why I shut down your comment about a Rogue, you’re making suggestions based off that bias opinion.
The Warrior’s argument though, wasn’t some random suggestion like yours. He made a good point about the 7 second Kidney and I do think without that Racial it would be a problem.
So you think this justifies a racial passive this strong?
7 second kidney is mainly used because of that Orc racial from what I’ve seen, especially into Orc Warriors. Most Rogues would prefer to play MFD I think (don’t quote me on that), maybe if they reworked the passive they could also rework Deeper Stratagem along with it since there would be no need for such a thing.
as long as deeper is in the game it does justify orcracial being this strong yes, not sure if you ever saw how the matchup looks when classes get 7 second kidney´d in case you havent : dwarf shamans/ gnome warriors(those are the 2 i can definitely speak for since i played alliance WPS) get 100-0d every dr without any cooldowns being pressed.
The day subrogue gets reworked/deeper gets removed/nerfed/changed you can actually gut orcracial and none of the good players would mind, but in its current state the game would sadly just become unplayable for a decent amount of classes
Alot of Rogue players want Sub reworked also, they don’t enjoy being almost useless outside of Dance. I thought the older design was alot better than what we have now honestly.
But I’d be happy to see Sub be reworked into something that’s playable outside of Shadow Dance along with a rework or removal of Deeper and the Orc Passive changed. I don’t think they should go the route Cuite wants and nerf the base line Kidney duration and Cheap Shot duration though.
Because one thing is stupid doesn’t mean another stupid thing has to also remain to counter it.
Orc Racial is overpowered and numbers show it.
The 7s Kidney indeed is an issue, both when used on kill targets or on CC targets as you can always Sap it for free, and thus is very much overpowered.
Now someone says the Orc Racial is OP and your answer really is “buuuuut Rogue can 7s Kidney so we keep Orc Racial as is !” ?
That’s very stupid. Just nerf the both of them. Hardiness at 10%, not stackable with stuff like Sephuz, and Kidney hardcapped at 6s no matter what like they had to do in WoD at some point and everyone is happier. No more retarded 7s Kidney that gives free rating to some imbeciles, and no passive relentless for no reason thay also gives free raring to idiots, while still having a very good Racial. 10% on stuns is still powerful and will still offset Rogue spell sequences, as any CD reduction does (since it sounds like that’s what you worry about, big bad evil Rogues) but overall in the game 10% on stuns won’t be as impactful, especially if it doesn’t stack with anything else.
So no, a broken thing doesn’t justify another, just solve both and stop defending stupid stuff A with stupid stuff B while the opposing party defends stupid stuff B with stupid stuff A, else we just never move.
In case it wasn’t clear, yep, at the very least Sub should never have had a us Kidney and while it may be questionnable on the other specs it isn’t as cancer. But there are RM players who are super trash who just DB sheep someone, while the Rogue 7s Kidney Saps the other, they go on the sheep with 3 Cheap Shots, repeat every DR since the Mage can tank for way too long while the Rogue just waits for DRs in stealth, aaaaand most classes just cannot counter that at all. And that’s stupid.
Orc racial is important and needed for the game as long as rogues stays as they are.
It’s not all about the 7s kidney.
you disagree if you are a rogue or mage player
5-7s stuns should go away if u ask me. I agree with Cutie. And yes there is big difference playing monk vs rogue with orc racial and without, cuz he is squishy. Try it yourself if u don’t agree.
Absolutely wrong. It affects much more classes actually.
Druids need to stun. It affects cc combo with bash stun-clone since it’s very on the edge. It affects heavily the opener since he comes out one gcd faster.
It affects warlock. Shadowfury+chaos bolt is on the edge now since he can come out before cast is finished even with full haste build.
It heavily affects ele since your strongest spell, lasso, not only lasts less but does also therefore less damage since it lacks it’s last tick.
It affects warriors since stormbolt lasts less and again, you miss out a gcd.
Not only rogues are the victims here. No other race can passively deny that many mechanics
Rogues are busted class every expansion, 95% threads about “nurf urcs rucialz” comes from rogue mainers or RMx mainers. Just sleeping and watch when orcs comes to nowhere.
Then other races sounds like unplayable.
from a Warrior PoV id rather be human than orc so the rmp is forced to go me, honestly. But yeah shamans are kinda toast if not orc
@shadenox for some reason your post comes off as super passive agressive, not sure if thats intentional
but back to the topic at hand, not entirely sure if missed one of my posts but i literally said that the moment they rework deeper i´d be glad if they gutted the orc racial alongside it so i can finally play alliance again in peace, no sane human being would defend the orc racial , however as long as the other races are lowkey unplayable id rather have it stay like this or fix the problem at hand
You realise I was being sarcastic right? obviously multiple classes use a stun to kill. Did you read the full thing? or stop reading there?
If you make a statement like this you’re a bias idiot. I wonder if you’d defend is so much if you didn’t play Orc yourself. I think not, we all know how 1 sided you are on things.
They need to rework entire pvp from grounds up (at least when it comes to baseline dmg, racials, classes and how they function, looking at you mmm, all classes:)
Do you not think them just removing/disabling racials all together and removing Deeper might be a better solution? so people can play whatever they want instead of being pigion holed into a certain race because of how much better it is than the rest etc. Or do you like having the racials being a factor in some way?
disabling racials alongside deeper would prob be my ideal solution, racials have been a nightmare to balance ever since wrath so at this point we might aswell get rid of them
Yeah, I’d prefer that solution too. But some how I can’t see them doing it, even though it’s healthier overall.
Iv’e been a gnome monk when orc rele was a thing 