04/10/2018 20:19Posted by MoontearRemove void form...biggest crap for shadow spec in wow.
void form is nice dont need to remove it , we just need a talent change , put some as basic spells , and some increase % dmg
void form is nice dont need to remove it , we just need a talent change , put some as basic spells , and some increase % dmg
Void form would be Ok if we could cast and move at the same time.
At least on PVE.
At least on PVE.
02/10/2018 10:08Posted by Cterin02/10/2018 01:28Posted by AmarîelBut at this point the horse they're sitting on is as high as the mt.everest, no way they come out and say ''ok, the void thing wasn't such a good idea after all''
I think the Void theme is a blast and fits the class fantasy and theme of the spec wonderfully.
Pre-Legion Priest, with the shadoworbs was, to me at least, mind-numbing and dull. The intensity of Voidform along with turning more and more dark and growing tentacles is cool as hell!
It does suck that, from what I gather from the various posts here, that Blizz has screwed over our balancing and rotation.
In my humble opinion, I would simply like to return to something Legion-like and then we'd be good!
Void Torrent and SW:D as baseline!
And a proper AoE that isn't Mind Sear or Shadow Crash would be nice as well.
I hate void crap they should have just made fourth spec for that crap and let the real shadow priest be as it was for you it might have been dull but i loved it this void stuff just feel like a discount version of mage or warlock with no escape abilities and little to none other defenses.
For pve void priest feels like a chore to play and for pvp i rather would shove my hand in a blender.
I miss shadow as it was in wotlk and cataclysm those were the days i last time had real fun with shadow.
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I miss shadow as it was in wotlk and cataclysm those were the days i last time had real fun with shadow.
Absolutely. Those were the shadow Golden Days. Give us back Devouring Plague as a baseline dot, I don`t care, just call it Devouring Void or whatever if it doesn`t fit the class fantasy (they removed it for this reason). The gameplay and efficiency peak for shadow was totally back in Wotlk / Cata. Anything after that was just garbage.
Our dots damage was absolutely stunning in Wotlk, if we took the damage % of the dots from that time to implement it in today`s priest dot dmg, our vampiric touch should be non-crit 5-5,5k / tick. :) Just saying.
Here is a great discussion from the US forums about shadow, let`s join the demonstration with the following phrase:
"Don`t ignore us."
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On the US priest forums is a very good post "removing void form:how to" or something like that, do check that out.
06/10/2018 13:20Posted by ZupinhoOn the US priest forums is a very good post "removing void form:how to" or something like that, do check that out.
Post in Question: https://us.battle.net/forums/en/wow/topic/20769456829?page=1
I'm going to copy and paste exactly what I said on that post here. Because it honestly feels like people are forgetting how much the game has changed around shadow, and just focusing on the changes to the spec itself.
Tldr: I think Voidform has failed in what it set out to do, and needs to be rebuilt or removed. I do not think what was outlined as a "solution" works well in the modern game, as many combat mechanics from that era have been upgraded or replaced, and without them what we enjoyed as Wotlk/Cata shadow would have been quite lacking.
Tldrtldr: Voidform currently bad, needs core changes. Ripping a core mechanic out and replacing it with nothing isn't solving the problem. Talents can't and won't support entire reworks / concepts on their own.
We have a pretty similar sentiment towards Voidform. It's a problem, it was fun when it was jacked with absurd amounts of haste, but the way it was built is just... not good for too much content, and the fundamental problems can't really be covered up without attempting to ignore the mechanic entirely (BFA).
On to what you specifically want to do with Shadow, I'm honestly seeing problems. Now I wholeheartedly agree, 100%, than Voidform in its current incarnation needs to go before shadow can really be a functioning and enjoyable spec. But you've also got to remember that once you take Voidform out, there's really not much at all left.
What's left worked, a long time ago, back before we had pandemic windows, when the hybrid tax was in effect, when we still had snapshotting. A lot of the global systems that justified / fleshed the spec's simple kit out back then are gone, and the concept of a "Hybrid Dps" being a dps who not only has heals, but is expected and required to be using them consistently within encounters, is gone. I'm not going to talk about if that's good or bad, just that being expected to both heal and dps in boss encounters justified a simpler core rotation.
Given this, I don't think cutting the baseline kit / rotation back to 2 Dots, Flay, Blast, Sear, and Death and no resource system, leaves enough there. I see you try to fix that issue with talents, but what about the other 100 levels until someone has access to those?
The talents themselves are kinda all over the place. You can either have a 1 minute cooldown that increases damage and nothing more, still leaving you without a resource. A talent which adds a secondary resource to the spec, and essentially turns it into WoD, or a talent which takes dots out of the rotation entirely.
First of all, the obvious problem I see is a talent can't provide an entire secondary resource on its own. Not only is that confusing, but it's also a UI element / artwork for a single talent of a spec. And it's a roundabout way of saying "Give me orbs WoD was better".
CoP coming back, without Mind Flay Insanity, is going to be really, really, dull. No Dotweaving, just Spike Spike Blast ad infinitum.
On top of all of this, these are three distinctly different playstyles (Which bliz likely doesn't want to do for a talent row), with three almost certainly different stat priorities. This was already a problem in WoD when we can could target and acquire different sets of gear, in this lottery world now this is just not going to feel good when X, Y, or Z, gets nerfed and your stat priorities flip on their head because of that.
I get the frustration with Voidform, and I admire the work that went into estimating how much you need to buff the damage to offset the loss of Voidform. But the spec needs a lot more work done than simply ripping out the core mechanic and leaving it there, even if that core mechanic is now almost universally hated.
If you wanted Shadow Orbs back, they'd need to be centrepiece of the spec, instead of a talent. And we've already heard enough that they're much more than likely not coming back.
Adding this bit right now.
Even if they did, talents that made shadow orbs work (Mind Flay Insanity, From Darkness Comes light, and by extension Mind Spike) would also need effective and compelling replacements.
I wonder what Blizzard will do.
I mean, they can move some talents around, change them a bit, tweak the whole Insanity -> Void Form gameplay, and call it a day.
Or they can try to tackle that big "fundamental problems" area.
The former is easy. Players will be dissapointed, but they'll accept it because it's better than status quo.
The latter is difficult. Like really difficult. It's what everyone wants, but no one agrees with each other on. It's what everyone feels is wrong, but no one understands what is wrong.
Of all the Shadow Priest suggestions I've read in the past months, I pretty much disagree with all of them. But I don't have any suggestions of my own. I can't even pin-point what exactly is wrong with Shadow Priest. I just know something isn't right.
Good luck with that Blizzard!
A lot of it is feels.
For example, when I play my Warrior it feels good. If there's a mob I want to kill, then I'll press Charge and go: "BOOM! Boom! Boom! BOOM! Dead."
That feels good. You connect right away and deal some immidiate damage that starts high and ends high. That feels satisfying.
On my Shadow Priest I'll see the same mob, and then I'll cast my DoTs, use my Mind Blast, cast my Mind Flay, and then I'll wonder if I should use Void Eruption or just Mind Flay and Mind Blast again. I'll settle on the latter and then the mob dies.
That process doesn't feel good. Casting DoTs in the beginning isn't satisfying. That's not as fun as using Charge and Mortal Strike. You're really spending the first 2 seconds just doing nothing. And even when the DoTs are up, the damage they do doesn't feel satisfying at all, but you can't choose not to DoT up, because then you know you're missing out on potential damage, and that feels even worse.
Mind Blast is an ability you expect to hit hard, but it doesn't. And Mind Flay also just feels slow and without impact. And you end up clipping it all too often because all other spells take priority.
And that's just the rotation for one mob. And it feels terrible. And I don't have any idea how to make it feel good. On one hand I want to say that Mind Flay is a terrible spell, because I don't want to have a 3 second channeled ability that deals a semi-moderate amount of damage. That's boring! On the other hand I love Mind Flay, because it's such an iconic ability, and it's the embodiment of what a Shadow Priest is and what it means to melt faces.
So I've no idea what Blizzard should do. I know it's about the feel of the spec. I know that even if Shadow Priest gets buffed to be the undisputed strongest dps spec in the game, then I will still complain, because it will still feel bad to play. But I honestly don't know what will make it feel good. But I hope Blizzard does, though I have my concerns....
I mean, they can move some talents around, change them a bit, tweak the whole Insanity -> Void Form gameplay, and call it a day.
Or they can try to tackle that big "fundamental problems" area.
The former is easy. Players will be dissapointed, but they'll accept it because it's better than status quo.
The latter is difficult. Like really difficult. It's what everyone wants, but no one agrees with each other on. It's what everyone feels is wrong, but no one understands what is wrong.
Of all the Shadow Priest suggestions I've read in the past months, I pretty much disagree with all of them. But I don't have any suggestions of my own. I can't even pin-point what exactly is wrong with Shadow Priest. I just know something isn't right.
Good luck with that Blizzard!
A lot of it is feels.
For example, when I play my Warrior it feels good. If there's a mob I want to kill, then I'll press Charge and go: "BOOM! Boom! Boom! BOOM! Dead."
That feels good. You connect right away and deal some immidiate damage that starts high and ends high. That feels satisfying.
On my Shadow Priest I'll see the same mob, and then I'll cast my DoTs, use my Mind Blast, cast my Mind Flay, and then I'll wonder if I should use Void Eruption or just Mind Flay and Mind Blast again. I'll settle on the latter and then the mob dies.
That process doesn't feel good. Casting DoTs in the beginning isn't satisfying. That's not as fun as using Charge and Mortal Strike. You're really spending the first 2 seconds just doing nothing. And even when the DoTs are up, the damage they do doesn't feel satisfying at all, but you can't choose not to DoT up, because then you know you're missing out on potential damage, and that feels even worse.
Mind Blast is an ability you expect to hit hard, but it doesn't. And Mind Flay also just feels slow and without impact. And you end up clipping it all too often because all other spells take priority.
And that's just the rotation for one mob. And it feels terrible. And I don't have any idea how to make it feel good. On one hand I want to say that Mind Flay is a terrible spell, because I don't want to have a 3 second channeled ability that deals a semi-moderate amount of damage. That's boring! On the other hand I love Mind Flay, because it's such an iconic ability, and it's the embodiment of what a Shadow Priest is and what it means to melt faces.
So I've no idea what Blizzard should do. I know it's about the feel of the spec. I know that even if Shadow Priest gets buffed to be the undisputed strongest dps spec in the game, then I will still complain, because it will still feel bad to play. But I honestly don't know what will make it feel good. But I hope Blizzard does, though I have my concerns....
#remove void form, bring back 3 raven shawow orb!
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03/10/2018 18:58Posted by SarazanBlizzard knows how buff shadow priest, they just don't want.
It is every patch, you have weak, good and strong specs. This is what they want. We are just unlucky, because shadow is bad now.
Buff basic spells is good, but they should focus more on talents
- Twist of Fate needs buff (10 % is too low)
- Shadow Word: Death back to base abilites
- Separate Lingering Insanity from Mindbender (This 90lvl row needs rework, everytime just mindbender)
Shadow in pvp in Legion vs Melee was bad. Just horrible. This Bfa is even worse.
BUFF SPRIEST !
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07/10/2018 15:46Posted by Duskruby#remove void form, bring back 3 raven shawow orb!
no use to remove it ! it is fine how it works
they just need to remake some talents and and bring mass hystiria back
and we are fine !
p.s : my opinion !
today i managed 10k dps with 368 gear on a normal uldir boss!
i shed a tear! aoe aint so bad but single...
i shed a tear! aoe aint so bad but single...
Asking buffs for SP from Blizz... nice joke guys...
They just hate us or they have no decent developer who has any idea about SP.
Blizz only listen locks when they cry, for ex; why SP get nerf most of the time ?!?
Let me tell u... when sp did more dmg then lock... cuz locks have been touched by the high heavens in Blizz's mind.
If we can convince some locs to cry for us, the sun will shine upon us.
Otherwise we r just here to pay for getting cancer.
They just hate us or they have no decent developer who has any idea about SP.
Blizz only listen locks when they cry, for ex; why SP get nerf most of the time ?!?
Let me tell u... when sp did more dmg then lock... cuz locks have been touched by the high heavens in Blizz's mind.
If we can convince some locs to cry for us, the sun will shine upon us.
Otherwise we r just here to pay for getting cancer.
2 Likes
Priset was My first char i made and i was shadow even before it was a valid spec. It had its ups and downs but tbh, i feel like the BFA iteration has a posibility to become the best one yet. The shadowpriest core is still there, but the explosiveness of voidform feels great mechanicly and thematicly (to me). Unfortunatly this is Also tied to specific talents.
Shadowy insight
Dark Void
Shadow crash
Legacy of the void
Without these talents the rotation feels stale. Both Single target and aoe.
Dark Void > shadowcrash > one tick of mind sear > Void euruption to mind sear spam is one of the most satisfying AOE in the game and has supporting Azerite traits.
My complaints is more in the line of;
Why do i need specific talents for My rotation not to feel hollow. Why do i have virtually No utility for mythic+ And Why is My AOE dotting that lasts for 15 sec on a 30 sec CD and Why did You put core spells as talents?
I do however feel that the 8.1 core is better then the legion version, and with some talent tweeking it Would be perfect… for pve.
For pvp we feel like a relic from a lost time. In current day wow with all the melee mobilitet and interupts / cc, A caster with basicly No slow or mobility, even though there is so much thematicly cool potential - blizz gotta be trolling here.
I think they have pretty good utility for M+. Decent CC, off healing, Life Grip and dispel. You can also keep your DOT’s extended with Void Bolt just about long enough for Dark Void to come off CD.
“Decent” CC: No mass stun, no casted CC for infested outside of undead (2 packs across 2 dungeons where that’s relevant). No reasonable cd interrupt.
Except nobody builds their group assuming their healer isn’t good enough to deal with what’s coming. Attempting to heal damage after it’s been dealt also pales in comparison to never having to take the damage at all, because of mass stuns, grips, ring of peace, and other superior kiting / disruption tools that shadow doesn’t have access to.
Grip is cool, if only it was on a cooldown similar to other “tank assistance” cds like vortex and ring of peace. (I’m aware this would be insane for PvP, but the value of grip is significantly less in PvE than PvP).
I’ve done a fair few 17-18 keys, that’s not amazingly high by current standards, and there are about 20 or so shadow priests higher than that (and some 400+ demon hunters), but even at that level I can see how my lack of knockback, reliable interrupt, reliable casted cc, mass stun is causing problems for the group, and would be even worse going further.
EDIT: And with the new reaping affix revealed, I can only really see this lack of mass mob control becoming even more of a problem.
ou…im kinda out of touch with that. Can u elaborate more about that afix? a bit offtopic but still please 
Every time you kill a mob in the dungeon, a ghost stands above its corpse. Every 20% of mobs, all of those ghosts run towards your team and try to kill you. Once that wave dies, they don’t reappear again throughout the dungeon, and the next wave will revive the next 20% you kill etc etc. 5 waves per dungeon.
There are 3 types of ghosts. Casters, small mobs, and big mobs. Big mobs have a frontal cone, casters have random target casted spells and a floor aoe, and smallies just melee the tank. Each ability applies a stacking dot which can be dispelled.
Current strategy is to do very specific trash pulls to minimize mob number whilst maximising mob count, get the trash to 19%, find a safe / logical place to stand for optimal add funneling, then ring of peace / aoe stun / treants to remove any danger from the tank and aoe them down.
DHs are doing 200k+ dps on each wave with eye beam and fel barrage, whilst mass stunning to protect the tank. OL rogues with blade flurry trait basically the same if not more. Moonkins have treants to keep the tank safe, and ring of peace is incredibly powerful for negating any potential damage.
Jumping off objects, such as the Boat / Inn thing in Freehold, is also incredibly effective for kiting / manipulating the pathing or the mobs.
Bottom line of reaping so far is it makes the specs that are already good at baseline Mythic Plus even better, and shadow provides zero relevant utility to help survive the reaping.
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