Silvermoon brainwashing

Someone brought this to my attention recently.

Priest Ennas and Lyria Skystrider we’re both protesting in Silvermoon bazaar area, as they believed joining the Horde was a mistake. They love and respect the history Quel’thelas had with the Alliance.

The people against them argued that Arthas is alliance

While they argued that the undead Arthas used are the same ones who are allied with the Horde

They also argued Sylvanas was not the same person as the old one

(It appears they are correct, look at Sylvanas now showing her true colors)

Three magisters supportive of Lor’themar appeared and mind controlled them

They both started to change direction and supported the horde now. Claiming what Lor’themar is doing is great, and the magisters are wise.

So is what the Magister did is correct? It seems more crazier than the Void whispers .

Whichever faction you follow, you need to agree that Sylvanas is not the same one as the alive one. They were correct.

How many people did these Magisters mind control? No wonder the Blood elves accepted the Horde so easily despite the history.

Anyway this whole conversation and protest reminded me of the forums and how we constantly argue about Thalassian elves. lol

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The Blood elves are still in the Horde purely because of gameplay reasons. Don’t delude yourself that there might be a genuine reason for their affiliation to that throng.

WoW has proved this again and again. Theron opened negotiations with Varian to rejoin the Alliance in MoP, and then again in BfA Theron cooperated with King Anduin to overthrow Sylvanas. Then you have citizens who have to be brainwashed to comply, factions that broke off like the High elves and Ren’dorei… no other race has as many dissidents as the Blood elves. The Purge of Dalaran happened purely because of gameplay reasons. Jaina snapped primarily NOT because of lore reasons, but because Blizzard can’t just force all Blood elf players to faction change to Alliance. The community would be broken, you’re basically forcing people to say goodbye to friends and communities.

Regardless, if this were an RTS or a MMORPG not built on a strict two factions system, Quel’Thalas would be back in the Alliance. As it should’ve always been. Blood elves are Horde merely because asian girls wanted a pretty Horde race to play as.

I don’t even think Quel’Thalas would want to remain neutral, because being part of a massive international military alliance is always preferable to being alone in the world.

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Yeah pretty much this.

If wow wasn’t a game of faction then Quel’thelas would be Alliance. But to balance out the faction population it had to be done in Burning crusade. And as you said, Horde guys wanted a pretty race for their girlfriends to play. It worked.

Don’t get me wrong I’m not angry over the fact Quel’thelas is Horde. I’m okay with that.

It’s just that this information made me wonder how many people these magisters brainwashed. That’s all

Well, given the alternative traitors historically have in other races/societies, what those Magisters did was the lesser evil.

Blood elves joined the Horde because after getting wrecked by an Alliance Prince, the Horde was the one that offered them a helping hand instead of spies, saboteurs, and a rampaging racist eager to use them as expendable fodder.
The latter seems to be a factor of importance for Blood elves, as they were willing to switch sides again in MoP when the Horde was the one being led by one.

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The fact the alliance left them to die has nothing to do with that, of course…

Go play Warcraft 3.

And then come back.

Thanks.

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Garithos in Lordaeron*

It was not the only human kingdom.

Some High elves ran to Stormwind, Stromgarde, Dalaran, Theramore and got easily accepted in as refugees. You can still see them today in the respective cities.

It was only Lordaeron that had a racist general, who is now dead by the way. And the kingdom of Lordaeron along with its people fell and became part of the Forsaken (who you are allied with now)

So Blood elves went to the wrong people for help. There was other human kingdoms

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You do realize that Stormwind and Ironforge already had enough problems with domestic threats, right (Defias, blackrock orcs, dark iron dwarves, etc.)? Let alone the fact that they were in no position to help a kingdom on the other side of the continent, which had already left the Alliance.

Go play Warcraft III and Classic, thank you very much.

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The majority followed Kael and became addicted to fel magic. The horde was the only one that welcomed them as they were: suffering, broken, in dire need of help.

The alliance was not there to lend a hand. It was the forsaken who helped in the ghostlands.

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Could it have something to do with the fact that the Forsaken are literally under Quel’Thalas? Hmm…

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Let’s revisit what happened to any faction that landed their help to Blood Elves/High Elves:

War with Trolls and Zul psuhing elves thin, when Human sent army to end the biggest threat elves faced, in return there was silence from Quel’thalas in 2nd war - only when Allerias small token force decided it was their duty do so.

Abandoned and left to slaughter by Garithos - Naga and Illidan offer Elves their help and cure from their shattered Sunwell. In return Kael’thas cut the contact with Illidan and conspired with Burning Legion to bring down what seemingly now would be Lich King (haha).

And even in strictly two factioned game they considered going back to Alliance when Horde bled - Trolls thinned to dust, Tauren losing their leader. A family that took them in such dire need. Swept aside on a first chance when Garrosh’s gaze fell upon them.

So to say that it was only Horde providing the help they needed justifies to why they are there is a far stretch statement.

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I understand your desperate attempts to modify the facts in order to suit your narrative.

Lore states otherwise though.

As such, blood elves will not join the alliance any time soon.

Toodles.

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While I agree that the blood elves (sadly) will stay in the Horde for aslong as WoW exista, I must insist your reasoning seems flawed.

The Alliance certainly was a dck to them, but it has always been a two way street between humans and high elves and treating eachother like dcks and thus this can hardly blamed on the Alliance (humans) alone.

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That didn’t prevent them from sending some dwarves spy masked as an ambassador.
And Night elves also had quite a handful of problems back in their lands, and yet they felt like sending an expedition that tried to further beat them down when they were at their lowest.
Want to talk distances? Try measuring the one between Teldrassil and Silvermoon.

Agreed.

The High elves joined and left the alliance so many times.

They were always like:
“we are independent we don’t need anyone. We are immortal our magic will protect us” lol.

Of course Alleria know this was not the case. They needed the human to survive, and so she tried to convince the king that the Horde are allied with the Amani and invaded Quel Thelas.

The High elves are like:
“Rubbish! Nobody invades a kingdom protected by Magic”

Then ironically, Sylvanas is the one who convinced them by throwing a Troll’s head on the floor shocking everyone. Lol.
The king finally Accepted to join the alliance. This was Warcraft 2

Shows you how stubborn they are

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Or until Blizzard removes or applies some changes to the faction restrictions. Which could very well happen in a future expansion. You need to spice things up for a 16 years old game, and that would be a very good way to do it.

What does the lore state?

The talk is not about Elves joining Alliance or not - apparently we have our own.

I think there has been a misunderstanding from the original topic.

I was talking about the brainwashing in silvermoon. Why are these magisters doing it? How many people did they brainwash?

I’m not Saying Blood elves should go Alliance. That ship has sailed

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It was One dwarf - who was Alliance ambassador. You know it as well as I do that Ambassador duty differs from an army to help out on Scourge invasion. Whole Northern part of Eastern Kingdoms was blighted with Scourge. Fighting the way up to Silvermoon would prove challanging.

Time’s were much more calm when Silvermoon opened their doors to both factions.

Let’s use the available sources that we have to determine if Quel’thalas current political position is gameplay driven only or not.

Warcraft 3 set the story in such a position that pretty much there were only Blood Elves left and not even a single High Elf. There was no determining the splintering of the elven people in that game.

It was WoW that showed this division. And it really had a gameplay roots.

Quel’lithien, Quel’danil and Farstrider Lodges were set in Classic WoW. Back when RPG was still canon. And already RPG introduced Blood Elves as lost people dabbling with dark magic that made them hostile to both Alliance and the Horde with only Goblins remaining as the sole ones willing to trade with them.

So that’s why High Elves were introduced as bunch of refugees. Their state was so miserable that one could compare them to homeless rats.

With one short story about a lone High Elf in Theramore Inn being bullied by two Dwarves who stole his dagger. The only memento of his homeland and family upon which the Elf used his magic to snare Dwarves, take back his dagger and flee.

The three Lodges placed in Plaguelands, Hinterlands and Loch Modan were designed to serve as hubs for the High Elven faction called “Silvermoon Remnant”. It was supposed to be an Alliance friendly reputation group. Something a kin to Silver Covenant.

But it never came to be, because at that time Blizzard was changing the lore and focused on the Blood Elves. Decided to make them less Diabolical. And so from people lost in dark arts they became grim, pragmatic survivors. And thus the three Lodges full of High Elves lost any real significance and were just left there.

But Blizzard didn’t want to fak up the existing lore too much since they already scored few mistake gems with one such being where Chris Metzen himself explained that he simply forgot about the origin of Eredar when he related them to Draenei.

Although old lore was already in motion and couldn’t be reversed immidiately and that is why we were introduced to Kael’thas and his Sunfury that was the embodiment of those “evil” Blood Elves.

High Elves on that matter were turned in McGuffins serving as an excuse for the Alliance to mess with Thalassian lore, such as Quel’delar and later Zul’aman. Otherwise Alliance would have no reason to even care about those things.

So yes. Gameplay reasons in that matter are big. And may even be the primary case why Blood Elves and High Elves ended the way they did.

Now let’s focus on the Lore aspect.
Warcraft Chronicle vol. 3 describes citizens of Quel’thalas as a nation of isolationists who care little about the outside world. They just wanted to be left alone to their devices and make contact with other races only when necessary.

So your standard High Elf living in Silvermoon didn’t give a sh!t about Alliance or the Horde. Even when the rest of the Eastern Kingdoms were at war, with Kingdom of Stormwind falling, Dwarven Kingdoms being in retreat and Humans forming desperate coalition to face the threat.

This obliviousness is what later became their doom. Anasterian sent token force to aid the Alliance during Second War only because his bloodline was indebted to that of Anduin Lothar’s due to the fact that his ancestor Arathor himself helped Elves to deal with Trolls in times ancient which resulted with Thalassians teaching Humans some magic.

Once the threat was dealt with, Dark Portal closed by Khadgar and Orcs sent to internment camps, Thalassian indifference once again kicked in. Like truly if Americans have Thanksgiving Day. Then Thalassians should have Fooksnogiving Day.

Anasterian officialy pulled Quel’thalas out of the Alliance and ordered every High Elf remaining in it’s ranks to go home.

And this is where Warcraft Ultimate Visual Guide from 2013 kicks in that describes this event.

Some Elves returned. But not all. Others who formed bonds of friendship and brotherhood in arms with Humans and Dwarves refused to return. They outright objected the royal decree of Anasterian Sunstrider.

The best example of it would be Vereesa Windrunner who at that time was enamored with her Human later be husband Rhonin.

So no. Being loyal to the Alliance is not a High Elven thing. Only the tiny portion of them who were exceptions to the rule stayed behind. Statistic High Elf didn’t give a crap about Alliance.

This of course left the Alliance High Elves disgruntled believing that one day such point of view might bite Thalassians in the a$$. And boy if they were not right about that.

It is worth noting that Kael’thas at that time also was an exception to the rule. Crown Prince who preferred other races than his own people. Living among them in a distant land. Thalassains couldn’t understand what driven him to do so. And thus never could truly connect with him.

This desire of his even worried Anasterian himself who could only hope that one day his son will become fed up with this style of life and embrace his heritage.

Arthas’ invasion was a major blow back in the Third War. But what could be noted is that High Elven defenders with Sylvanas in front called him. “Human traitor Prince” for example.

Which indicated they blamed him not just as an undead, but as a Human in general. A Human that coused greater harm and destruction than any Orc ever did. Arthas was the embodiment of that what is the worst and darkest in Human heart.

Orcish Horde never made it to Silvermoon. So it’s citizens didn’t suffer Horde’s treatment. But they did suffer from Human Arthas’ hands.

Which is why Garithos who on his own would be quite insignificant, became such a pain.

Again we go to Warcraft Chronicle Vol. 3.

When Kael’thas came to the ravaged Kingdom of Quel’thalas, his people greeted him with concealed resentment. Blaming him for not being there when they needed him the most.

And he only added insult to the injury when he gathered an army and left to join the Alliance. Once again the Prince left to fight a war in a distant land. And what good came from pledging himself to the Alliance? Being shunned as a cheap fodder for the undead.

This loyalty nearly cost him his life and evaporated any desire to serve within it. This was the moment when Kael’thas’ mindset was finally tuning in toward his people.

Garithos was just an another Human that sought Elven demise. And enough was enough.

This was the moment when Alliance loyal High Elf Prince became fed up with it’s current bullsh!t. And with Garithos declaring his execution and all his subjects, any Alliance High Elf should have adopted Blood Elf mantle and stand with his Prince.

But they didn’t. I don’t know HOW in the world the likes of Vereesa avoided Garithos’ wrath but somehow they did, hidden within Kirin Tor, equally oblivious to see their Liege, their Prince to be killed unjustly.

We know that Grand Magus Telestra, a High Elf herself and Kael’thas’ mentor abandonned him when he allied himself wit the Naga, but held a massive grudge against Kirin Tor for standing idle when Garithos ordered mass execution of the Elven kind. Which is why she and her High Elves joined Malygos during Nexus war. She and all that followed her perished.

And they were pure Kirin Tor High Elves which makes me wonder what Silver Covenant was made from? Where did those die hard Alliance supporters came from? Theramore? Allerian Stronghold?

The point is that Blood Elves joined the Horde because Sylvanas Windrunner who died defending her Homeland in life, still desired to do so in death. And it was she, a dead hero of her people that extended the hand and made the offer, serving later as mediator between Lor’themar and Thrall.

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Stick that nostalgia trip somewhere where the sun never shines. We are Horde now and it will stay that way for as long as the game is running. You lost.

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