I’m usually a part of the silent majority. But at this rate I feel that I need to speak up.
So view this as an open letter to Blizzard.
I have done everything there is to do in wow. Starting in vanilla I’ve been a hardcore PvE player with roles like raid leader, officer and guild master in Hardcore to Semi-Hardcore Guilds. In SoM i did the PvP Grind, Killed Nef Hardcore and in Classic Era I’ve done the speedrunning raids.
I did not think I would like it when I started SoD but I totally loved it. Every bit of it.
10 Man raiding was lovely - I could raid lead my friends and manage the guild without feeling that I had a second job.
The raid difficulty was lovely in Gnomer - good for a guild group with comms.
Itemization was lovely since it did not take a loot council to manage it and everyone got geared.
So from me as a GM and RL of a “DAD GAMER”-guild it meant I could actually enjoy the game.
Now with Sunken Temple and 20-man raiding it feels like I could just as well start a guild in “Classic Era”. I honestly don’t know what you are thinking, Blizzard.
It was clear from the start that SoD was testing the waters for Classic+ and that it was for the people that some would call “Dad Gamers” or “Casuals”. It was fun. Everything else caters to the “hardcore”- or “semi-hardcore”-ppl and I was actually happy to not have WOW as a second job for once.
I haven’t tried ST yet (raiding tomorrow) so I don’t know about the difficulty though it’s been nerfed already but on the first 2 phases, the issue was with the community, not the content.
Nothing in BFD or Gnomer required to be parsing at 90+ and have an opti comp full of casters. It’s normal to have a bit of difficulty especially this early in P3 but Blizzard can’t fix the mentality of its players.
SoD is hard on PuG especially if you don’t play the OP class/spec of the moment - maybe it will be less so with 20 man raid rather than 10 - but a lot of it came from the community’s requirement to access said raid, not the raid itself.
yeah true on that, big reason on why I skipped completely gnomer in p2 and just kept doing BFD with my druid and mage just for laugh (but know i have basically no gear on my mage due of always losing rolls kek).
I’m disagreeing with every word of what you’ve just said. The previous phase’s ‘raids’ felt more like dungeons with loot pinatas with more health, they didn’t feel like raids at all.
That’s the entire point? SoD is part of Classic.
No. 10-mans should be ‘optional’, not end-game.
This is exactly why the game shouldn’t be designed around puggers, because the community are going to min/max and exclude people regardless of how easy the content is.
It’s your right to disagree, it’s healthy even. But having the option to be a grown-up, a job, family and still have time for guild leading is still what I would like to have. I’ve done 40, 25 and 20 before and I don’t have time or energy to manage it with my life.
And I’m far from alone in feeling this.
SoD is SoD though? They are trying out new stuff.
The entire point is not that it’s classic, cause we have classic - its called “Classic Era”
I disagree with this because of the following reason:
You have Classic era, WoTLK classic (Cata inc) and Retail if you want to do the raids that aren’t “dungeons with loot pinatas” @ end game. Why should 20-40 man be the be-all-end-all and the people wanting small tight groups and content that respects time be left out from even more WoW Content?
I have tried ST and it is harder, today it was easier but still harder than Gnomer.
Don’t get me wrong, I like hard - and it can be harder with a weeks lockout. Dreamscythe and Weaver was really, really fun.
The problem for me is managing bigger guilds. Cause you can’t recruit 20 people in a guild doing 20 man raiding, the number is closer to 40 to get a good setup. And if you have 40 people you need to start managing a second raid team to not have the people on the bench leave - then you have to manage 40+ people. It’s far too time consuming and a lot of guilds are dying for it.
I did some sunken temple today and I am a big fan of 20 instead of 10 men, it really felt like a raid this time. I love 20 men raids. Wish MC was 40 tbh
Where is this specifically mentioned? You can be casual and do hard raids. Its really not easy. ST today was a big joke and Im not even in a “good guild”
You can do all of those whilst still commiting to a one-night a week raiding schedule instead of jumping on every 3 days and wasting 30 minutes looking for people.
I work between 42.5 to 65 hours a week, I work 12 hour shifts and spend a lot of my time tired. I still prefer set raid days with more players than jumping in rando pugs and hitting loot pinatas.
Trying out new stuff isn’t the same as changing the game in it’s entirity. We have 10 man raiding in WOTLKC, Cataclysm and retail. They don’t need to be a part of Classic.
You have two of those for your free-loot 10mans too.
Because that’s the playerbase that the game is catered for. This is a CLASSIC seasonal realm, not a Wrath or retail one.
Not every game has to cater to you, you know? You don’t have to play something, you’re not obligated too. If a gamemode for your desires exists already then you can go there.
Managing biggers guilds of adults isn’t that difficult, assuming everybody has the same objective.
Bigger raid sizes also means more room for error and more available spots, which means less pickiness with classes and specs for randoms.
It seems from your comment that you’re not looking at it from the perspective as a Guild leader/Raid leader which is what my POV is.
As a raider I have 0 problems with logging in and raiding with 40 people.
How is that changing something when they already implemented it?
How are they already not changing the game in it’s entirity with the changes in SoD?
Mages healing, Rogues tanking ect.
It’s still not the same - end game/BIS is gatekept by 20/25/40 man.
Still not the same, you get loot in 5 man dungeons and questing as well - should you just be happy with that?
I dont buy the whole “if you dont like it, leave” rhetoric.
Also, how is the game catered to me?
Classic Era - 40 man
WoTLK - 25 man
Retail - 20 man
As a player I have no problem with it. I have done it before, I’m doing it in retail for mythic and as a player its just… log in - do your stuff - get gear.
My problem is from a Guild Leader/Raid Leader perspective and you have not even touched on that.
I agree with the post. I enjoy playing SoD because it requires low commitment. I can get, raid with friends and log off.
Since phase 1 I have been raiding with a small group of friends. On a raid night 7 to 9 people are online and we pug the rest.
But 20 man raid means either we have to pug most of the people or join a bigger guild.
I am not saying that the game shouldn’t have 20 man or 40 raids but it needs to have a 10 man version as well.
I would say difficulty in BFD felt easy, Gnomeragon felt just right but Sunken seems way too hard. There are other versions of wow for difficult and time intensive content. I enjoy SoD because it is not too difficult, it is not that time consuming and it doesn’t have overly complicated systems. If you add those to the game then it becomes same as retail.
I’m still on the mend about it being too hard - I personally like the content.
I mean it’s a weekly lockout so 2 nights a week should still be doable - but yeah. Im sure it’s too hard for PuG’s… but that does not help the “small” guilds either… who need to PuG to fill the 20 man raid. So I can agree with you there.
Thinking about it - smaller raids might solve the difficulty problem as well - 10 tight knit people in a raid vs 10 tight knit and 10 randoms would still make it a whole lot more difficult than it has to be.
That is the most absurd thing I heard. Guild leading is completely optional just as raid leading. You are asking to nerf one of the most complex, time consuming aspect of the game, which is only done by a tiny percentile of people. By this nerf the rest of the raiders gameplay experience will change drastically.
I was raid leading 15 year ago, today I just raid. Maybe you should do the same, instead of asking blizzard to cater to your special need.
Stupidest take I have ever seen. What you are saying is that you know a sweat lord so it’s not a problem for you, so why should it be a problem for someone else.
Guess it’s time to uninstall the game for everyone that don’t have unemployed people in their friend group.
(Also I’m stupid and never post on these forums, hence the deleted posts)
No need to rage.
Raiding is optional too. Guild leading and Raid Leading is not optional if you want a guild and want to raid. Your comment is therefore null and void.
Logistically, as a GL/RL, it does matter and takes up a heap more time and energy with the snowballing effect.
Still enjoying the content for what it is.
I see its even more absurd now. If you want to raid it is absolutely optional to raid lead.
Car mechanics are essential for car travel, but it is optional to be one. Also cars are designed for the owners need, not the car mechanics need, because car manufacturers want to sell cars. It is super simple really.
