Subtlety rework, midrange?

​Hey everyone,

​With the evening quiet here in Montenegro, I was theorycrafting a fun new direction for Subtlety Rogue and wanted to share it with the community.

​This concept re-imagines the spec as a pure 40-yard ranged DPS called the Shade Weaver, a master of spectral duplication who overwhelms enemies with an army of shadow clones. The core fantasy is commanding your shades from a distance, setting up for a massive, visually spectacular burst with Secret Technique.

​Let me know what you think!

CORE FANTASY & GAMEPLAY

​The Shade Weaver uses shadow magic to project phantom copies of themselves onto the battlefield. These clones aren’t just illusions; they mimic your attacks, building to a crescendo where you command them all to strike at once.

  • Primary Resources: Energy & Combo Points
  • New Core Mechanic: Shades
    • ​You build stacks of a personal buff called Shades (up to 4). Each stack represents a clone you have ready to summon.
    • ​Your primary finisher, Secret Technique, consumes all your Shades to summon that many clones for its attack. More Shades = exponentially more damage.
  • Mastery: Phantom Tactics
    • ​Increases the damage dealt by your Shade Clones from all sources. This makes Mastery a crucial stat for empowering your finishers and cooldowns.

CORE ABILITY BREAKDOWN

Builders (Clone Generation)

  • Shadow Shuriken (Primary Builder)
    • ​40 yd range, 40 Energy, Generates 2 CP.
    • ​Throws a shuriken at your target.
    • ​Your CRITICAL STRIKES with this ability summon a Shade, granting you 1 stack.
  • Shuriken Storm (AoE Builder)
    • ​Fires a volley of shurikens at your target’s location.
    • ​Each enemy critically struck by the initial volley has a 50% chance to summon a Shade.

Finishers (Clone Command)

  • Secret Technique (Primary Finisher & Shade Spender)
    • ​40 yd range, 35 Energy, 1-5+ CP.
    • ​You and a clone perform a whirlwind of attacks near your target.
    • ​NEW MECHANIC: Consumes all stacks of Shades. For each stack consumed, you summon an ADDITIONAL Shade Clone to join the assault. A 5-CP, 4-Shade cast is a massive burst moment.
  • Rupturing Shadows (Secondary Finisher)
    • ​40 yd range, 30 Energy, 1-5+ CP.
    • ​Applies a Shadow damage bleed to the target.
    • ​Its duration is increased by 2 seconds for each stack of Shades you currently have. This ability does NOT consume Shades, making it your go-to when you’re saving up for a big Secret Technique.

Mobility & Cooldowns

  • Phantom Position (Core Mobility)
    • ​Replaces Shadowstep. 40 yd range, 2 Charges, 25 sec recharge.
    • ​Instantly teleport to a target location. This is your primary tool for kiting and repositioning.
  • Shadow Dance (Burst Setup)
    • ​For 8 seconds, EVERY Shadow Shuriken you cast summons a Shade (no crit required). This is your main window to rapidly build Shades.
  • Symbols of Death
    • ​Functions similarly, granting a damage buff and making your next builder a guaranteed critical strike (and thus, a guaranteed Shade).
  • Echoing Shadows (Major Cooldown)
    • ​For 15 seconds, you summon two persistent Shade Clones that float beside you and mimic every Shadow Shuriken you cast.

PUTTING IT ALL TOGETHER: THE GAMEPLAY LOOP

​The rotation is all about managing your Shade generation for the biggest possible Secret Technique.

  1. Build Phase: Use Shadow Shuriken to build Combo Points, fishing for crits to generate Shades. Use Symbols of Death to guarantee a Shade when you need one.
  2. Setup Phase: Activate Shadow Dance. In this window, you can rapidly fire off Shurikens to quickly get to your maximum of 4 Shades.
  3. Burst Phase: With 5 Combo Points and 4 stacks of Shades, cast Secret Technique for a massive, visually impressive burst of damage.
  4. Sustain: When cooldowns are down or you are saving up, use Rupturing Shadows to keep consistent damage on the target without spending your precious Shades.
  5. Mobility: Constantly use Phantom Position to maintain optimal range and dodge mechanics, allowing you to cast uninterrupted.

​Thanks for reading! I think this would create a really unique and engaging ranged spec with a high skill ceiling based on resource and cooldown management.

​What are your thoughts?

Seems like a Mesmer from GW2.

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I’ve always thought of a gunslinger as rogue mid range spec. But this sounds really fun too, and actually fits the current theme. Shadowy ninja summoner, i’d play that!

If only someone who cared about the rogue class was in charge of the current redesign…

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Yeah, I just now saw the new update for midnight.

Subtlety
Apex Talents: Ancient Arts
Damaging attacks that expend Shadow Techniques to generate combo points have a 15% chance per stack expended to create a Shadow Clone that repeats the attack for 50% of normal damage as Shadow.
Shadow damage increased by 5%/10%. Shadow Clones have a 50%/100% chance to trigger Shadow Techniques’ effect.

Pretty dope

I like the way sub works but the problem is we have no damage once our shado dance is down.
With the cheap shot nerf giving it CD i think they should give back garrote to every spec on some CD so its not spammable with subterfuge or shadow dance. Lets say 6 seconds cd on.

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I liked the game much better when there were only ranged and melee specs. Even DKs were too much, now we got ret and a new DH spec. Better make ranged classes have less mobility and shorter max range (cause 40+ yds on everything is ridiculous) so melee can be melee again. Btw, how is 40 yd mid range? Mid range is 15-20, 25 at best, 40 is just ranged.

I don’t really get why people propose ranged rogue, tank rogue and other stuff like that. All three rogues specs have always been distinct to me. This one is even more focused on shadow damage than the current one, making it even less true to the original spec design and class concept as a whole than the current one (which itself has issues with it). Sub does shadow damage because it does damage from the shadows, from stealth, not because it can magically summon shadows. The whole shadow summoning theme has already gone too far.

That said, I still want my deadly throw back.

P.S.: something like that could probably work as a new class though

It’s a cool idea in terms of visual language and theme.
But I would not want rogue becoming a pet class.
So the clones should behave more as a projectile or range increase or temporary damage-over-time effect.

It could be similar to unholy dk in Midnight. They were changed to summon ghouls that basically act like stylish dots. Or like feral druids, which summon short lived clones that mimic attacks on multiple targets.