Don’t worry, it’s not the mythic plus complaint post
I just wanted to ask a question.
But can tanks in mythic plus heal themselves or do they just take damage?
I remember, on Shadowlands that some classes like Dh, Dk and bear healed themselves a lot and you as a healer didn’t struggle with the heals.
Now, it seems to me the opposite. All the tanks I’ve come across in m+ take a beating, high damage and throw some defensives from time to time. Sometimes I struggle to keep them up, I don’t finish treating them when they’re already half dead.
Heck, I remember in Shadowlands they never died, they were more resilient.
I post logs of my runs, to see if I’m the problem or where I’m going wrong and need to improve, but when I read the tank’s total heals, the %il rank is gray, very often. So I’m wondering, if I always encounter bad tanks or was the tank survivability nerf a low blow for them?
That is, I was surprised. I used to see indestructible tanks. I don’t know, I don’t want to criticize any role, but the tanks I’ve met, only take beatings
I’m not sure this is much of a metric. If I get hit by magic damage on purpose, I will block some if it with Holy Shield, which will show up as healing in the form of absorption. So I will be doing more healing, but also be harder to heal.
There are differences in mitigation capabilities between tank classes, and there are, this season possibly more than before (at least how I feel) differences between individual players.
Ive ran few mid level keys with guys 20 ilvl under the average for the key, who apparently were good enough at layering/ staggering defensinves they were unkillable even after I died, and ran few keys with people of the same class (even prot warrior) who felt like they were made of wet paper.
well thats the general problem of active mitigation - really good tanks who are really good at it take very little dmg - mediocre tanks take a beating and you have to heal them a lot.
but its not so easy to answer really - it depends on a lot of factors starting with - does your group know how and what to interupt ? does your group know how to aoe silience/stun/knobckack properly etc etc . what is the dps of group - aka does the trash / boss dies before tank runs out of cds ?
maybe they dont use enchants just like you which makes them a bit more squishy ?
you woudl have to show us logs so we can tell you what exact problems are
Warriors can survive quite long but at some point you need to help. dk are even better. Also it depends if they take avoidable damage that is supposed to be lethal. frontals or missing kicks.
thats the problem with blood dk and other tnks that depend so heavily on active mitigation - vdh / brewmaster - if played by good players they are extremly strong.
when played by weak players their hp spikes like crazy .
i know its just me but imo both vdh and bdk could use some more utility buttons that for example prot warriors or prot palas have .
and ye ye i know they all have different toolkit - but m+ is unforgiving on high keys if you are not really good player playing them .
I think so, because it’s not the group’s problem, the dps manage to defend themselves well, except the hunters oh well… The problem is in the tanks, that is, as someone above says, they seem to be made of paper. They take all damage possible, all that is present in the entire dungeon. Do they do it on purpose because the healer is there to heal me anyway? For example, I met a prot warr where for the entire fight he used Ignore pain for 8% total. Which should be spammed, I know little warr prot.
Bears that aren’t bears anymore, but when pulled they have the resistance of a feral or a hamster… I mean IDK I don’t know what to say
Like yesterday for the winning pairing of the week, explosive and bursting I almost gave up hope of completing RLP+10, it was like 4 runs, two abandoned, one finished out of time and the other thank God completed on time. Just in the one completed in time, there was the blood tank, I’ve met very few. Before the run started, he says to me “don’t heal me, think about them” and I say “eh? Serious?” “yes” But I pulled some heals, I find it hard not to heal a player And he surprised me when he was the only tank among all the others not to die and take all that damage from the trash, the fire ones after the first boss. I was really happy. And it healed itself and made me remember dk blood healer
But the others…
It’s fortified week. In high keys tank need to use defensive as soon as they pulled. You probably met tanks that maybe it’s their first run of the week and they forgot how hard trash hits on fortified.
If you play Evoker just throw them a time dilation on every pull (1 minute cool-down) to pick up their slack. They will be fine after 10 seconds, specially DKs and DHs
and all even semi mediocre tanks are doing 16 and higher.
you are stuck with people’s 5th alts and in general weaker players.
so ofc they are squishy when they dont manage active mitigation properly .
i would blame greatly here game for it - there is no clear way to have it super visible when the active mititgation is up if you dont use weakauras for it. which is ultra bizzarre imo . but blizzard UI was always horrible
also it doesnt help that normal dungeons are so easy that you dont need to use defensives there, and if you use you can pretty much pull all mobs from boss to boss. So people dont really learn tanking until higher keys.
Some kind of renewed proving grounds could be good
Not necessarily. There’s a lot of magic damage in the current dungeon rotation. If casts directed at the tank aren’t getting kicked, it will be the tank who takes the damage, not the dps. As a tank, you can really feel the difference between a group that uses its interrupts and stuns and one that doesn’t.
And honestly, at the level you’re doing, half the players don’t seem to have even heard of an interrupt.
Bears are squishy at the moment. Even the latest buffs haven’t really helped.
Yes I know. But the point is that they take the blows (on the trash) even in the week of tyrannic. I know this week is tough for them, the problem is every week.
I always use it on cooldowns on tanks, sometimes on hunters when they have a magic buff on them.
Yes, I think so too, because it’s really impossible that tanks are so weak…
Unfortunately I started my adventure on this expansion late so I have to be satisfied with what I find.
The kick problem is forever, even in a 16/18 they don’t know what it is
Start using focus kick macros and you have 2 stops with wings.
If you want to push high keys unfortunately as a healer you need to work a lot harder, most DPS players are monkeys with 0 awareness, I play with some DD that don’t even know when they take damage, it’s literally like they don’t have their party/raid frames enabled. But the good thing is as an Evoker you actually have a lot of agency compared to most healers
I play a bear. Magical damage destroys me. Physical damage not at all. I wish it was more balanced. Right now we have one class in its own league being great at both. The rest not so much it seems.
Here’s the thing. With the start of DF the player HP has increased by 40% and the damage the mobs do also increased by 40%. This is not noticeable in low M+ but one thing you need to take in consideration: HP is defined by gear and has its cap, mob damage scales with the key level.
This is one of the reasons you see that crazy HP spikes.
One thing everybody needs to consider now is that the mitigation and defensives for tanks haven’t been changed, meaning their cds are still ranging between 1 to 4/5 minutes. And remember those mobs hits harder.
Another thing nobody considers is HP is higher, mobs hit harder, but healing is still the same unbuffed, meaning healers now have to heal more having the same power.
DK healing scales with his strength so it’s natural you’ll see topping the HP meter sometimes even doubling the healer but he’s very fragile. Mobs hit very hard and what healers don’t understand is that DK needs healing before the pull not during. He goes without defensive, healer pump heals which have a cast time, DK gets pummelled, dies and gets flamed for being a bad tank.
Do you want to be a very good healer? Learn how tanks work first.
But yeah, TLDR: mobs hit harder, HP has a cap with ilvl, defensives cds unchanged, hard times for tanks.
If you run “details”, you will see on the healing tab, how much healing each player has done. Overall, first should be you (healer) and second should be the tank. On many fights, the tank does more healing than the healer.
Overall, a tank does more damage + healing than a passive (non attacking) healer. Up to +12 which is my experience.
I just started tanking as prot warr.
What I can say is that in recent 15s i was 3rd or 4th on the heal’s targets and I selfhealed around 4-5x that amount. Mostly ignore pain, very little active healing
Generally DKs, DHs rotationally selfheal
Druids, pallys can weave selfheal into their rota
Warrs absorb a crapton with ignore pain and selfheal very little constantly by spending rage with one actual selfheal available every ~30sec
Monks absorb some, selfheal based on their crit some and randomly spawn some selfheal orbs
oh well… The problem is in the tanks, that is, as someone above says, they seem to be made of paper. They take all damage possible, all that is present in the entire dungeon. Do they do it on purpose because the healer is there to heal me anyway? For example, I met a prot warr where for the entire fight he used Ignore pain for 8% total. Which should be spammed, I know little warr prot.
And he surprised me when he was the only tank among all the others not to die and take all that damage from the trash, the fire ones after the first boss. I was really happy. And it healed itself and made me remember dk blood healer 
