I don’t know how many times i mentioned this but this is actually becoming a meme already.
Fury needs target cap adjustments asap , only spec in game hard capped at 5. Season 4 pool is all mega pull dungeons we at least need outlaw rogue treatment of 8.
I still dont understand why this is never fixed back in shadowlands when every spec got their target cap adjusted while fury remained the same.
This been going on for a long time and reached a point that needs immediate attention.
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Main problem is not that we are 5 target cap’d with meatcleaver. Far closer are that we are not the best at 5 target even with that ‘handicap’ (or specialisation). If our damage on 5 targets was so strong that we were actually the best at it, then we would be in a lot better and enjoyable spot.
Best case here for S4 - they buff the Rampage (2) damage modifier to the point where we can do high-end ST damage. That would help reinforce our 5t profile. It would give us a theme and a job in keys that we would be the best at.
If we actually did excel at 5t - I honestly believe, the problems of being capped would simply disappear.
Now, the problem then comes with Thunderous Roar being uncapped bleed damage - making our actual AoE DPS not that bad. Combine with ravager on a short CD, and our AoE overall is above decent if not actually strong.
Basically, we got the half’n’half situation. Where the devs likely don’t feel completely safe buffing our meatcleaver damage without pushing us over the top on the overall. Yet, as our pure AoE is based on roar and ravager (honorable mention, Odyn’s Fury, RIP till it gets buffed by at least 51% baseline) is keeping up on AoE alright. If they buff meatcleaver to 8targets, and that proved to be a chunky AoE damage boost, they will likely have to down meatcleaver % to keep us balanced - or worse yet, nerf our ST power to be even worse…
or the darker timeline, they give us 8t and nerf Roar, OF and ravager to keep things in line.
Specialisation, or doubling down on either or are better than expanding the room of our “niche” further.
Now, this is important to keep in mind, let us say they buffed it to 8t, then we are still losing uncapped AoE. Nothing changed. The ones who beat us at 5t still beat us. Yes, they will beat us on 8t as well. All that happened with the re-balance is that we sorta beat more mid-tier specs at that area. Pointless. If you are not the best at the thing, you will not be brought for it, simple as.
It is a question of damage profiles and what vision they got for Fury. Personally, I rather see them either reinforce our 5t profile, by increasing meatcleaver % or simply increase the damage of our ST hitters (solving our lacklustre ST performance). Giving us 1t to 5t niche that would be uncontested - that is actually valuable.
If not going for the meatcleaver route, then I would like to see them buff our AoE CD tools outside of the core rotation. Odyn’s Fury, Thunderous Roar and “Ravager (not really a CD in s4)” are all effective tuning knobs to increase our output in AoE in different ways. As Blizzard hates the thought that we actual do big burst damage, only bleeds are likely to be deemed as “acceptable” form of damage that we can get. So, from those only 2 can just be buffed by the bleed% dam modifiers in the talent tree. Still, this would be a simple fix if it is needed to increase Fury AoE.
As my main gripe is Fury having a lack of ST, that is the angle we should aim to get fixed. Bosses need to die. Overall isn’t as important as focused damage. In academy the sprouts will die from cleave - what is valuable is the damage funnelled into the boss and tree-add. Yet, the sprouts look great on DPS meters, even if they are all basically pure pad. Paders are fake value, we really should aim to bring the real deal instead. ST will increase our 5t and prio-target dam - this be the way.
If anyone are disappointed about how it is looking for S4. Remember this. Everyone that voted for S2 tier was warned - our profile would change from great priority damage and high burst, to ok ST damage and good sustained AoE. Sure - the devs kinda said they would balance it out, so we wouldn’t come out at a loss - but hey, that is water under the bridge at this point and noone believed that spiel anyhow. We traded reinforcing a niche we could be close to excel at, for one where others excel while we are great at best.
We, Fury Warriors and the fanboys, laid our bed. Now we get to lie in it for the season. Hopefully the fun “faster” gameplay proves worth it in fun factor, that something unknown shows itself and we suddenly excel to the point of being sought after.
(Also, buff Odyn’s Fury already, so it can be a viable pick)
TLDR:
- 8t or 5t Meat Cleaver doesn’t really change much
- 5t should rather be improved, rather than t-cap expanded
- 1t to 5t or AoE CD profiles are likely more effective tools to make Fury viable than 8t MC.
- As others classes do all mentioned already, just better (If we are not the best at it - being better at it hasn’t changed anything)
- Our goal should be becoming the best at something valuable (ST, priodamage and AoE burst are all viable options), instead of being only strong where others excel.
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Tbh i do agree with everything you saying
Also considering the nature of fury if we get st buff we are also getting aoe buff but problem atm is talking just about keys ( also this is mainly because of the nature of the dungeons) i thing 6 out of 8 at least requires you to mega pull. I literally dont see any reason to invite a fury rather then a ret paladin , havoc dh or bm hunter.
I did post a lot about this previously. We are just mediocre at a lot we dont have a niche. If i’m 5 target capped i should be best at 5 target but i still lose to uncapped specs at 5 target this is a big problem.
I geniunely feel like at least 8 target will do a band aid fix for now. At least we will do a bit more damage and have easier time getting into keys. Maybe with war within getting bladestorm back will fix it with slayer tree i dont know but feels like fury at least needs a partial rework.
TWW will all be about how the numbers get tuned, as currently there is more focus on how it feels. So far, slayer is getting some positive feedback and mountainthane needs a rework. Then you got the problems in the class/spec tree as well. Our niche gets watered out even further, I am not sure that is a positive thing.
If they want to bandaid us for S4 and DF, the easiest knob would be to buff the tierset (2). It directly impacts our ST and MT profiles, yet doesn’t affect warrior longterm. 5t to 8t would forever change how we work, and we would lose the chance forever to become a real 1-5t focus damage machine. The result would be a weaker cleave machine.
As I doubt we will ever be tuned to beat Havoc on uncapped AoE funnel, ret on AoE sustain or BM hunter on passive cleave - as all those 3 specialise their specs around it. We should aim to reinforce our niche. Do remember - we are always in the best spot when we shred prio targets while we do good AoE compared to other specs. Now, Ret got buffed on their ability to prio dam and AoE, so they moved into our spot. Then add that we weakened our strength to become more generic with S3 to S4 - all hope to be the best at that niche is lost.
So rather than ask for more AoE, as AoE is pad, we should ask for more effective 5t damage and more 1t funnel. If we ever reach the point where our funnel into ST becomes more than good, and even better yet, we would excel at it:
We would be brought for the MDI to delete bosses and lieutenants.
Now that is a future worth pushing for!
I agree with you, changing the target cap is a good start. People saying it’s not a problem will keep complaining about fury for an eternity and will always live in the pain of doing low damage in dungeons. Trust me, changing the cap changes things quite a bit.