So WOW lost a bit of their former mysteries when we actually found out about what really happened with the Titans and their plans. in Shadowlands it was revealed that the Titans did infact NOT create anything they just inherited it and put their own copyright over it. Now I don’t think they will dig up the First Ones again because it seems they are truly gone after the cosmos was actually created they only purpose is to add a new layer of things we just don’t know and that is okay. I would eat my pants saying we will eventually have to realise that the Titans, like the other cosmic forces, just want to use Azeroth for their own plans. Which might be bad.
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The titans being bad / as selfish as every other force Is pretty much a certainty now, when it comes to the first ones and the afterlife, I really wish that to have remained a complete mystery, these themes were better explored through other means, like Bwonsamdi and quests on BfA, that was absolutely epic.
As for the rest, I am hoping the story takes a much different direction than the cosmic stuff, the sense of fear and adventure is gone.
The threat is always bigger, our characters are invincible legends…
this killed immersion (to me).
We are the Champions of everything, we defeated titans and gods … but at every expansion launch we get a beating from some angry wasp.
In other hand, with this ridiculous power of friendship “uniting everyone” it’s going to be difficult to go any other direction than external threats.
It seems to me they are building up to an “Us” vs “Them” after the world soul saga, “Us” being most of the known current races and groups, like elves, trolls, humans etc … against “them”, being the Arathi Empire or some unrevealed non comical group.
It is a mystery still. From all we found out from the Brokers it is clear the First Ones are gone and won’t return. The Titans did their order stuff and that is how we stand now. And I am fine with that.
I assume we find about it in 12.2 which will tie in for Last Titan where it is revealed that the Titans are infact the bad guys(exception being Eonar). Like every other cosmic force.
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Yes, the first ones are not spoiled, but afterlife is.
Or not…if it pans out that the whole afterlife shadowlands thing we have seen isn’t the actual afterlife as it was hinted a couple of times now .
not actual afterlife I believe but TRUE death. That is what Sylvanas will discover. I think the Shadowlands were created to make sure souls of mortals and everyone else aren’t turned into eternal nothingness.
It begs the question of what happens to legendary lore character souls that are currently there, like Uther etc…
If the shadowlands turn out to be a Titan construct and we beat the titans…it’s a bit awkward to leave them hanging in there (or send them to true death)
which is why it can’t be of Titan making. As told by both the denizens of the shadowlands AND titan servants.
Everything that disproves The First Ones being the Titans as of April 1st 2026 : r/warcraftlore
the arguments here are very convincing.
I really like how this explains everything
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I can’t wait for the “ Somehow, Azeroth wasn’t the Last Titan “ announcement on the next Blizzcon!
This is a complex topic.
The First Ones were devised when Metzen was no longer on the writing team, having retired. It was a product of the writing team under Steve Danuser and the intent seems to have been to try and inject some mystery back into the Warcraft setting.
However, whilst I am sure Danuser had good intentions, I believe we have to judge his tenure a damaging failure.
Metzen came back and could not retcon what Danuser’s team had come up with. He has to work with it. And Metzen is not beyond reproach himself either, he seems to have driven the idea of the alternate timeline of Warlords of Draenor because it was cool in spite of the fact it was also nonsensical. Not to mention the recent mess over the Haranir ‘reveal’ which has now been muddied by developer comments on X to the point that I am not entirely certain what the truth is…
Regardless, Metzen had a Shadowlands problem. And whilst we all assumed the answer was to pretend Shadowlands never happened (the expansion where no matter what the choice was, Blizzard invariably chose wrong) but it clearly niggles him.
Now, the little information we have had regarding the big Shadowlands retcon comes from Sylvanas who has described it as ‘too ordered’.
That was enough to infer an entire truckload of lore.
In this telling, the Shadowlands are not the true realm of Death. Whatever the true realm of Death is, it is still unknowable to us (this is a good change, death should be a mystery).
Instead, the Shadowlands is clearly a Titan machine designed to capture souls, convert them into anima and then funnel them as fuel elsewhere. The Covenants are in place to keep the machines running.
The Eternal Ones are not a Titan level Death Pantheon, they are Titan creations probably more akin to the Keepers we met in Ulduar. This reading actually makes more sense given the robotic nature of the Eternal Ones.
In that case, I speculate the following.
There are no First Ones. It is a Titan lie. The Sepulchre and Zereth Mortis are Titan facilties for oversight of their Shadowlands mechanism. The First One lie is designed to make the Covenants believe they are the grand guardians of death, the great pattern, rather than interlopers who have broken the true cycle of death.
I reckon all the Eternal Ones have bought into the lie with one exception. The Primus. The one who was in charge of domination magic, who bound Zovaal and who was tasked with guarding the Shadowlands. I believe the Primus is well aware the Shadowlands is simply a Titan construct. His job is to keep the mechanism ticking over and to ‘deal’ with any threats foreign and domestic who may threaten the Titan’s plan. After all, there was a theory doing the rounds at one point that the Primus was the true villain and Zovaal his puppet (which would have been far more interesting than what we actually got).
The Primus to me is the Shadowlands version of Odyn. Zovaal probably figured it all out by the end, but obviously he didn’t care to tell us because he was too busy bellowing at us about how insignificant we mortals were…typical overblown bad guy nonsense.
No they aren’t. Both the titan servants and the denizens of shadowladns themselves deny this. That is just the usual cope of Titan fanboys.
He don’t. He kept the stuff in and gave it context. That is all. There is no need for large scale retcons when we have an easier solution. The Titans lied about it.
They aren’t.
The Titans’ have no need to lie about it here. If they did that thing too they would be proud of it. Like they always do about their grand ordering all the time.
Odyn literally had to gouge out his own eye to even see what the afterlife looks like. If it was a Titan creation there should have been no hindering.
I imagine they scrapped that in its whole or the first ones are something we are already aware of given a vague descriptor to throw us off balance.
What I think would be neat if they went forward: We call Azeroth and Argus the first ones, creation and destruction, what happens after creation and before destruction? existance.
The pantheon always had greek vibes to it and if you look at the greek mythology, entities like Poseidon wasn’t just the god of the sea, Poseidon was the sea, Aman’thul is time, Azeroth is creation, Argus is destruction, etc.
What I think is a viable option: The first ones are just the world souls that the Titans are formed out of, in a very surface level what came first the chicken (titan) or the egg (worldsoul/first one) question.
What likely is the best way to incorporate it without people thinking shadowlands jumpscare: The first ones is a title only known in the shadowlands and its what the titans called themselves to the natives of the original shadowlands.
the First Ones don’t matter anymore because they are most likley dead. They were added at plot device to show that the universe already existed even before Aman’thul woke up. That’s it. Not to mention everything we saw in shadowlands looked NOTHING like what the Titans usually build.
I’d be just as happy if they never mentioned them ever again I’m not a big fan of lore that basically just boils down to HEY REMEMBER SHADOWLANDS? and first ones are a part of that
But with k’aresh it seems obvious they want to salvage some parts and if they’re going that route for the first ones these would be my suggestions for it is all.
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Oh no I am not saying they should double down on it. I doubt they will show up again. Shadowlands is a closed system now and doesn’t need further explanations. That was just Blizzards way of telling us that the Titans were not always the top dogs of the cosmic forces they are now. And I am okay with that.
And you take them at face value because…?
They are clearly building to a larger revelation when they go to the bother of Sylvanas pointing out something is up with the Shadowlands on two separate occasions and make it clear she is on a mission to find out what. It isn’t going to end with ‘sorry, that turned out to be a wild goose chase’.
They are literally robots produced in a factory. We were even on the factory floor.
Admittedly this is my own speculation, but a lie that gives the Covenants a grand purpose would suit the Titans. After all, while the Eternal Ones are Titan creations in this telling, the various Covenants themselves are made up of the souls deemed useful to join them. The lie of being part of some great grand pattern would be a powerful motivator.
Remember, IF the retcon of the Shadowlands being a Titan creation is true, then they have to adjust past lore to make it work. Odyn’s eye is something that made perfect sense under the lore as Danuser wrote it but which will probably require an updated explanation should the retcon of the Shadowlands being a Titan creation prove true. Essentially, if Metzen is determined to ‘fix’ the Shadowlands, then the existing understanding of the story of Odyn’s eye isn’t going to stop him.
The existing understanding of Dark Trolls being the progenitors of the Night Elves didn’t stop him from changing that as an example.
Because it is the actual lore we have right now? “The Titans did it” is not a good cop out.
the Shadowlands were build atop of death to make sure souls just don’t disappear into eternal darkness. Them being ordered is not by default a Titan only thing.
Robots. Not constructs. Just compare them to the titanforged on Azeroth. The First One magic is build on music and geometry. the Titans use arcane and build for grandeur and showing everyone how awesome they are. That is a totally different theme/design.
And there is no need for an actual retcon of it simply because the easier way is them lying about the whole ordeal cuz they want to prevent mortals from ever thinking “Wait so maybe the Titans aren’t all powerful afterall?” That is their biggest fear. Blizzard never retconned entire expansions. And they will not start doing it now for the kicks.
We have this
Edicts of the Prime Designate, Volume 742 - Item - World of Warcraft
pretty self explanatory. What the Titans want is control and total obedience. They will do anything to keep their idea of order intact.
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do I smell numriel hair burning ? sniffs sniffs
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