OK, So yes I am very late to the expansion so this is probably old new, but it infuriated me.
I know that WOW,s story is on rails, it has to be. You as the player just deciding not to do something means that you cannot go on with the story (though Shandris’s attitude is tempting me to ignore that particular Ardenwield storyline…) because it HAS to progress in a set direction. But Revendreth’s intro was stupid.
Spoilers for Revendreth’s intro ahead
I have no problem with the player being tricked into helping the bad guys. I will get that out right now. In fact it’s fun immersion…what is not emersion however is when you are… so… obviously…working for the bad guys. The moment I landed in Revendreth and met the Chamberlin my brain went “Hello Evil Person.”
I knew immediately that the revolution where to good guys and the Court where the bad guy, because at no point where the bad guys subtle about it. Yet poor Zudai was forces to loose 90% of his cognitive function and be totally fine with killing people for the bad guys because apparently he missed the glaringly obvious “We are evil, look at our expertly twirled moustaches, Mwhahahahahahaha!” signs painted on their foreheads.
I didn’t appreciate having to feel like my boy was selectively stupid, blind and deaf.
Could this not have been a little more subtle? You can elude to people being evil, you can give me something to question, I know I can’t pick a side but at least try to make it a little less intrusive than a hammer to the face.
It’s not the first time we have been thrown into the “stupid” category either.
Anyway, rant over. Thoughts? Suggestions of how it might have been improved? Genuinely interested on peoples takes and if this annoys them too or they think it’s fine.
It’s one of those things that add up to the overall car crash, where these little lapses in immersion crack your overall ability to fully invest and suspend your disbelief. On it’s own it’s not a particularly big deal, but there comes a point, when it really adds up.
As for how to improve it there is a reason Tarantino removed Django, from the Hateful Eight, because you can’t really have intrigue, when the parties are obvious good and obvious evil. So having the player work with both parties toward shady ends they slowly see unravelling, while being unsure who actually works for Zovaal would be the best way to approach it.
to be honest the player has never had a problem working for pure evil if they pay the moral compass is pretty flexible it’s the betraying us part we generally have a problem with Teron Gorefiend is a good example of this we did some pretty shady things helping him out (TBC version that is not the au version)
Maybe they just shouldn’t try to tell stories that need that subtlety, if they have no idea how to do it. WoW regularly spoils its story with stuff like the PTR, stories outside the game (like “Afterlifes” in this case), and the Dungeon Journal. They haven’t delivered genuine twists that actually felt exiting for a long time. I mean, even without having your character with its more limited knowledge being an idiot, what could be gained by having a reveal that only reveals what the player already knew?
Now, that doesn’t mean we shouldn’t be able to do bad stuff. But that’s where choice/options are needed. If they have problems with the novel concept of including choice-specifitc text in quests (can’t fault them for not being that modern! Though they seem to have that highly sophisticated 20th century technology by now, if we think back to the BfA-Horde quests…), they can still do that through the choice of race and class the player already made. That’s why class quests always felt quite nice, and no one complained that the DK could go a bit crazy on the red dragons, if they liked.
I have no issues with us being made to do bad things. My issue is that it was so OBVIOUS that the First half was evil. I mean every 5 minuets someone was telling you “your a pawn” , “your being used” , “your being played.”
Personally even if I as the player know someone is going to turn out evil, fine, but in game give me a bit of a run around?
The characters wore their “evil” on their sleeve so blatantly that it was like it was being spelled out in large capital letters.
I always look at it compared to the “Stitches” quest in Duskwood. It’s in an early zone, you can assume that your character is young, or just wide eyed and impressionable at this stage, oh that old man needs help? Sure! He’s paying me and I get to help another person. Sure he’s a bit strange and he keeps cackling randomly but…people are odd sometimes.
Then you learn that you messed up, a town suffers for it, you grow a bit wiser and bit more mindful about who you help. The stupidness works for the level or adventurer that you are.
I think if the Characters turned down their cackling Just a bit, it would be less grating.
The Tithemaster for example could have been more manipulative in getting the second tithe from the village. “I understand, it’s terrible that you are being made to suffer further because of these rebels and their selfish hoarding of Anima. We appreciate all the sacrifice you have made, if you can please see what you can find to add to the coffers I can assure you your name with reach the Sire’s ear with great enthusiasm for such a monumental effort for the good of Revendreth.”
Still sounds like something is dodgy, and off here but also make the rebels look like they actually might be bad.
Sure, but that’s my point. “Fine, I don’t mind” is as good as it gets. That’s not exactly a cool experience. So why do this type of story at all? If the reveal can’t really have a positive effect the way they do it, and can certainly misfire in terms of player experience… maybe it should be scrapped altogether. That’s not to say that these kinds of stories can’t work in general, but for Blizzard in their development framework it seems they have nothing to gain here.
You are asking them to make the experience “less bad”. And I think our standard should rather be that they should make the experience fun. I certainly wouldn’t have had any more fun, if my character was more convincingly fooled, if I as a player wasn’t. I would just have had less reason to be annoyed.
Any kind of story is going to be like that, if it’s scuffed to the extent SL was. Even a straight forward hero’s journey can look like a mental illness, at that point…
(TBC version that is not the au version)
Though they seem to have that highly sophisticated 20th century technology by now, if we think back to the BfA-Horde quests…), they can still do that through the choice of race and class the player already made. That’s why class quests always felt quite nice, and no one complained that the DK could go a bit crazy on the red dragons, if they liked.