Yet shifts uncomfortably when called out on the isle of thunder.
1 Like
True, but that could just be about his own misgivings on how he handled the matter. He might have been involved, he might not, it’s too vague to say for sure.
He did though? It states that he angrily tells off the Horde adventurers and said belf for using Dalaran’s resources to aid the Horde. He wants Dalaran to be about learning and neutrality, plain and simple.
Vixi gets the lore pretty correctly, yeah.
I know it’s popular to hate on Jaina/has been since ‘Dismantle the Horde’ happened, but I always thought that her actions make sense.
They don’t make sense from an omnipotent, omniscient environment of Us, the divine player who knows All, but they do make sense for a character stuck in a world that faces cosmic destruction once every few months.
Jaina’s arc is actually, arguably, becoming better than that of Arthas—Arthas, whose story is the the cookie-cutter story for ‘how to succeed in writing’.
4 Likes
Because there was a part that wasn’t shown during the 5.1 storyline.
He became aware of it as the Sunreavers were hauling the Divine Bell through Dalaran and then to Garrosh.
He confronts them but an orc (Iirc) told him to stay quiet or he would tell Garrosh about his supposed treason, so he chose the lesser evil (Jaina).
1 Like
Aye, but if he held to that standard then he should put all those involved before the council of six at the very least. The bell might have been gone at that point, but the people responsible for the action should still face justice and the Sunreavers should face sanctions because of it.
Though in an ideal world… maybe not ice-spike through the face style sanctions.
Honestly, I quite like Jaina as a character. I lik her BfA arc, and I used to think that her hatred for the horde made alot of sense.
It’s just that when looking into details, such as when becoming leader of the Kirin Tor, things just seem…I don’t know, weird? She goes full on murder on a guy/people for thinking they did what she did twice, despite said guy not doing it.
1 Like
It would be better if she didn’t constantly flip flop between “GRRR HATE HORDE” and “I want to make peace”.
It’s constant back and forth with her. BfA is some of the worst for it.
“I’m listening now Father.”->“If we finish off the Horde now we’re no better than the Banshee Queen.”
like, what
Her arc’s a mess of different people writing her. Worse than Garrosh ever was.
2 Likes
Agreed. I loved her coming home in BfA. It really re-contextualised her and gave her the place in WoW she direly needed. However, I still find it really regrettable that Jaina has such an amazing design and the female Kul Tirans are just… eh…
1 Like
If you’re a lore nerd like me, you’ll quickly realise that Jaina is by far not the worst in terms of inconsistent, bad writing. You are correct, of course—there are moments where characters do dumb things that seemingly make little sense compared to their original ideology (he glances at Garrosh 
)
Take Spellbreakers, for example. Little changes to lore here and there, and suddenly, their entire existence seems to make no actual, explainable sense.
1 Like
Unpopular opinion: I don’t think Arthas’ story was that great. It just stands out as a major narrative in Warcraft’s sea of “meh” writing.
With those two in particular, I see both good and bad/but it still kinda clashes.
The father bit, she sails for Kul Tiras, believing in her fathers words of not trusting the horde. Though by the time she laments about not sinking to Sylvanas level, she has gone through the whole Drust arc with her mother, and come out more determined to her original character, which is about finding peace. While still being ready to deal with consquences and hardships to reach it.
But…it also kinda screams the writer going on stage and saying “Not yet, wait until ‘X’ patch.”
1 Like
Oh I agree, compared to most lore, she is pretty good. Let’s not forget basically everything about outland as well. And Draenei.
I still remember when the black temple was in Hellfire pennisula, and Draenei was the name of the Lost Ones species, and they were native(and looked like that always) to Outland, and had no connection to the Eredar, who was just big demons.
2 Likes
Yeah, basically. I do my best to ignore these inconsistencies, considering that retcons/whatever (RTS games are far easier to ignore though, look at literally any map) but when it comes between seeing the bigger picture of a story/character development, I can make due.
BfA’s storyline is still irredeemable, though. Had some cool points where it could shine. Blizzard didn’t take a single opportunity to make it shine. Disappoint
1 Like
I think my big issue with Wow’s writing in just a general way, is that they make it so obvious that it is all about shock value/what they think is cool. As they have stated in interviews, they don’t see a problem with going past previous lore, if it makes for a cool moment in a cinematic or quest chain.
Another big issue with Warcraft as a whole, especially with the wow writing, is that they are very quick to demystify things. WoW as a universe feels so much smaller than it used to, not just because we have seen more of it, but because they feel the need to show us/tell us so much uneeded things. There is no sense of mystery regarding the creation of the world/universe, magical powers etc etc.
Edit: I liked it when the legion was just this mysterious, lethal demon army, and we didnt know any motive beyond “we want to kill you all.”
1 Like
It’s true, yet I cannot help but believe that we all have something to do with it. We’ve all wondered about, say, the origin of the Old Gods. It’s an actual case of ‘you think you do, but you don’t’.
I don’t feel like WoW has lost it’s edge on the mystery factor, but it does require a different approach. It used to be about a world before; not it’s about a universe. If you’re used to seeing big-scale stories like that (Warhammer) then it’s not much of a problem, but the initial jump sure gave even me a scare.
I can’t help but feel somewhat optimistic for this year, though. Everyone ‘big’ says that 2019 Blizzcon will present something real big. Now whether that’s a pet battle mobile game kind of big or a new revelation towards WoW’s future remains to be seen, but it will all doubtless relate to the story.
1 Like
This is actually an element that I really disliked and pretty much deflated everything that happened afterwards up until we got 7.2. and Tomb.
The initial story seems to have been about us catching up to Gul’dan on the Broken Isles, going from zone to zone to try and find out what he was up to in each region and mend the damage he caused. In Azsuna, the Wardens area, in Val’sharah Black Rook Hold, in Highmountain the Feltotem etc.
They could’ve gone with the Alliance and Horde heading to the Broken Isles to stop Gul’dan. It would play into the themes in certain zones where the legion only has a foothold like in Highmountain and Stormheim and how we dismantle them, which makes 100% no sense when the Legion trashed us on the Broken Shore.
Then we could get the culmination of our efforts of fighting and purifying Illidan in the Nighthold, with Gul’dan getting away to the Tomb. This could be followed up with a decisive, focused assault that plays out the same way as the current Legion intro quests.
The only thing that might require a change is Varian and Vol’jin telling Sylvanas and Genn to stop fighting for at least half an hour while they attack the Broken Shore and have Tyrion die prior to the assault and at the start to a Dreadlord or some other Legion/Cult of the Damned plot back in the Plaguelands, along with other potential inconsistencies.
A failure of all we have done against the Burning Legion (ie everything we do in the zone quests on the Broken Isles and the Order Hall campaigns, artifact empowerment) would have resonated far more than the dramafilled intro followed by some rather mundane adventuring across the area. Us bouncing back by utilizing more drastic means (the order hall campaign for every class could be about more severe and trying methods ending up with our mounts as a reward) being an even better pay off.
But what do I know I don’t develop this game or write the story
Yeah, I can see and agree with that. Alot of us fans have been very demanding in the past about wanting to know stuff, and it has lead us here.
Im quite happy they are still vauge about Elune though.
And yeah, as much as Diablo Immortal was dissapointing, they did reveal some good stuff 2018, so I hope it will be all good 2019.
Literally no one is claiming that, but the implication the Alliance had no ill intentions or thoughts towards the Blood Elves is a bankrupt statement. As per Vanilla (and continued into Cata), Northwatch fired upon neutral high elves under the belief they were blood elves. Northwatch. Of all places. The only other instance of a blood elf being encountered in Vanilla was a charred skeleton in Dire Maul.
The Alliance have hardly made a case of being friendly to the Blood Elves.
Here’s a question, had the Naga actually done anything against the Alliance? We know they attacked Night Elves. But what were they actually doing on Eastern Kingdoms other than trying to recruit Kael to Illidan’s cause?
I find it odd that Garithos even knows what they are. And at that point in the story, the Nagas main goal was just to help illidan escape. And he had no quarrel with the Alliance forces unless they attacked him.