Today for the first time in a while i’m thinking of stopping WOW.
I queued for an hour and a half today and couldn’t get into a single Key then decided to run my own Key, NW +10 (which btw was an 11 yesterday) took a while to get people together went in took first boss down so easy and was heading towards second boss, on a big pull people ignored affix we wiped, healer left tank left.
This group was mainly 2.5k IO score people, i play a destro lock 625 ilvl 2.4k IO score. our dps was solid and the healing was solid, What i don’t understand is when did this game turn into such a toxic place like literally these people watch two MDI videos and think they’re in a race whereas it’s a freaking +10 we died once and could have easily +2 the key because we literally had the damage for it yet people just left.
It’s been a while that i have been contemplating leaving this game but it keeps getting clearer and clearer that instead of a balanced game or a fix to the M+ and queuing system we instead get an 80 euro Mount.
i don’t recognize the game anymore and i definitely don’t have as much fun playing it as i did back in the day or even last season.
Blizzard has increased the difficulty of the content on multiple fronts (class nerfs, m+ tuning) and naturally, in response ppl now vet the applicants better and have less tolerance for failures as its more likely result in untimed runs which they might not need.
Io isnt the be all end all. Sure it can help guide you to form a group but purely basing it on that is many peoples downfall. It doesnt show you how many depletes or times they have left and people forget about that (inc myself)
You cant force people to stay but you can incentivise it. Not saying they should impliement this but something along the lines of " you can enter a m+ key if your own key is with X levels of it, the leader uses their key to activate the dungeon, the rest submit their key to start it. If chest does not get opened at the end, everyones key depletes"
Part of the problem with leavers at the first sign of a “potential” failure is that if it is not their key, they have no incentive to stay. Their own key doesnt get depleted, they dont have to get theres back up to that level again to retry. So making people put something they might care about (other than their time) on the line alongside the leader would force people to make the choice of “do i save my time and leave at the first point of failure and my key gets depleted too or do we try to get it back on track”
Your still not forced to stay, but now you share the hit the leader does
If everyone has the same thing to loose, they all have the same reasons to stay
Tbf, i think this is how current key depletes should work. Goes down 1 level on starting, if you time it great your key increases as normal. If you fail the time but still finish the run it should give you your original key level back
that’s because there is no excuse to ignore the affix. I would have left if the DPS were too lazy to switch (i’m a tank main, i’m stuck on this stupid classic char and can’t switch). It’s not good enough in a 10+.
If you think
it wasn’t if the the affix wasn’t instantly melted. It’s the nerfed version of it too.
DPS players need to start taking responsibility, the fact the tank and healer left is due to the DPS players failing in the key. Do your job.
Random people will never care about your key. You need to join m+ communities and make contacts. There are tools in-game for that. There are plenty of people who are looking for competent team players to do their weekly +10s without issues. If you are a solo dps, make friends with tanks and healers. They will enable you to play any dungeon at any time.
Improve your own game (if you feel that is necessary) so that quality players want to play with you. Very good players are very rare. If you are good, other good players will be all over you as soon as you have established yourself in a community.
Fill your friend list with quality players over time. Remember bad players and deny them entry into your groups. Don’t ever tolerate them. They had enough time to learn. They are like a disease that makes quality players (especially tanks and healers) keep at least 100yds distance from you at all times.
Communities like No Pressure EU are good to do keys in. Timed plenty of 10’s in there (failed a fair few too so bit hit and miss but people won’t leave or rage).
You are using a 3rd party tool to judge others lol… M+ is meant to be hard and should need a solid group of ppl IE a guild… like heroic and M raiding does…
Most of them are quite good. One of the few smart things I’ve heard from a streamer was:
“If you can’t learn to trust your teammates, you shouldn’t play online games.”
If you always assume you’re among bad players, you won’t get anywhere.
The choice would not be between leaving at the first sign of trouble vs trying to finish the key. The choice will become “do I even bother joining this key with this random guy” or “do I wait for my guys to do our weekly keys together”.
Your suggestion will just make the game worse for anyone “trying” to get into the +10 territory, since anyone even remotely experienced in that area (2.6k+) will just refuse to join a group with people lower than that. The key holders already have all the choice in the world for who to invite, if you give even more “power” to them, then there will be no one left that would want to join the key.
It is pretty simple to be fair. Everyone is inviting the same people. If you have all the keys on +11 (which is pretty simple), you get insta invite.
So keep that in mind when forming groups. If you want to form a group with people that can easily join a key, they expect that the key will go smoothly. For them it is just a theoretical easy weekly.
If someone wants to make a group for chill weekly no leavers, there are ways to communicate that in the group finder, and people that are willing to spend the time for that (but the key might not be timed).
Yeah, some runs are weird. Yesterday I tried to do +5, tank pulled like the whole dungeon, we wiped, he did that again, we wiped again and he left. Like what. Just before I run another +4 and we completed it with 3 stars, all while doing tiny pulls.
Some tanks are really bad… Thankfully that’s more like an exception so far.
Thus the indivudial risk of joining a pug is born. You have that choice now with 0 risk. If you sign up to a pug currently you should respect the key holder and give it your all, flasks pots food etc. (Depending on the level). Including respect for their key, they are trusting you, a complete stranger to help them reach their goal and vice versa, but they put up everything on the line while you only put up your time.
If you enter a pugs group you should expect to finish it out of general respect. If you did that with the example i gave, you would keep your key. If you truely have a valuable key, you wouldnt list it in group finder anyways so im not sure on the point here as if you did join the pug, and left. You would loose a level on your key. That was your choice to take the risk in the first place. If you aim for completion, that risk is nullified. That and aslong as you key is in the X range of your friends key you could still do it.
As for the IO arguement, yeah 2.6 would want to team up with other 2.6. Thats what is happening now, 2.2k ppl are waiting for 2.6k ppl then complaining about them leaving after a wipe. In other words, this would put people in their lane after a change similar to this would normalize.
Btw, the types of people that leave keys are often (not always) high IO players that stand to gain the least from a key, people that have groups of friends to run keys with but want a “risk free ride” to min max
The key holder is not respecting the time out of 90-95% of the people that queue. He is waiting for the people he wants to just in order to make his own life easier. The same way that the key holder is not giving a second thought to the dozens of people in the queue he is ignoring, the same is true for the players that joined the key.
Only system that can “force” people to stay and punish leavers, are those with automated queues that the game itself makes the groups. Those kind of groups are fair game to have anti leaver systems, but not groups that are player created.
Ofc, the easier it is for someone to get into a key, the easier for him it is to leave it.
This is the reason you make groups and invite low rio players that want the key for weekly because they rarely get invited.
And why is this the case exactly? Because they are the only one out of 5 that has to continue on with the punishment. So yeah they are going to cherry pick because they dont want their key depleted. They want it finished. Which circles back round to my point.
You dont force anything. Its called incentivising. You shouldnt force anyone to do anything. If you want ppl do do something you give them an incentive to do it. Carrot on a stick.
The “punishment” should be everyone or no one. Mythic plus finder wouldnt work without an MMR, even then it would be sketch
