Why is there like only one type of female character in Shadowlands?

:rofl:

This is hilarious. Who said I was looking up to them? I just pointed out an example of what tokenism is. And used South Park as an example that accurately parodied it.

Given Mogi’s post? Yeah.

Apparently, even tokenism has a “target audience”:

In the context that has someone declaring they identify with a race whose origins are basically that of some Space Robot affected by a curse? Yeah.

I fail to see how someone could identify with one fantasy race and not with another.
Being tongue in cheek to express such does not negate the fact that I’m indeed arguing with someone that waves around the flag about equating a fictional race with a RL one.

Are you going to keep on throwing strawmans for some weird forum cookie points or are you going to start bothering reading the actual argument being made?

mate. they’re humans. you can call them whatever you want, but yes i identify with a human lmao. Are you genuinely going to argue warcraft humans are not meant to be in any way representative of human beings. as someone of carribean descent i don’t associate with trolls just cos the darkspear have carribean vibes, because they are an entirely fictional race. but yes i do identify with humans, the species that i infact am irl

also u answer ur own question right there. they are space robots, they can look like whatever the hell they want, including black. they don’t need to follow irl racial genology. you are going against your own points

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I must’ve missed it.

though you clearly missed it, too.

You seem to really want to be taken seriously while refusing to take others seriously, it’s a bit :clown_face:

You can just call the race by their name. Come on, I know you can do it. I believe in you. What’s the ‘space robot curse race’ called and why are they not allowed to be black without being from some hilariously stereotypical origin instead of just being the way they are because of space robot curse?

t. guy who memorizes south park vids to link them in an argument

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His argument in the other thread was that Makasa was intended to be viewed as “exotic” and that she came from the jungle, and that Asian humans look that way because of a facial injury. Fun fact it was this dude’s argument that encouraged me to hit up a narrative dev, who had this to say about the origins of humans: https://i.imgur.com/72zRZfv.png

He can seethe all he wants but the customization options ain’t gonna get removed because an EU player on the story forums thinks black people ruin his immersion. God forbid the next Elder Scrolls game is set in Hammerfell.

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Yeah, I fail to take seriously those willing to sacrifice narrative quality in a fictional setting for the sake of grasping at blatant tokenism as a form of inclusion.

Specially when they then proceed to try and tag those that point out its flaws as some form of “racism” for daring speak against the mishandling of a fantasy race.

The ingame race is called humans. And I never said that they were not allowed to be black.

Although I did say that in order to have certain degree of, let’s call it narrative respect, they should’ve had a consistent an elaborated background reason to exist. Something other than throwing them into the mix of a STORY solely because you want to signal on how progressive you are.

Guess that examples such as dwarves, orcs, Tauren, trolls, and the rest of ingame races may have set up a bar…
Yet, I think that it’s not that high.

I know it may be hard for some people, but in fantasy races, even humanoid races required of certain degree of consistency regarding their background. Regardless of how much they seem like RL ones.

It’s what people call narrative consistency.

If it’s to much to ask, and you are the sort of person that would sacrifice narrative quality over social messaging (even if it comes in it’s laziest and cheapest form), then I do wonder why are you posting in the story section of the game.

It certainly doesn’t speak very well of you if even made up strawman like those, still put my arguments ahead of the ones you said that equated RL black features shown in game with the result of some disease.

Black/Asian humans are not a subrace, they’re not an allied race, they are regular humans. I don’t understand why you aren’t getting that. My human character that I RP is from Drustvar, and if someone told him his ancestors were from the jungle he’d think they’re mad. Humans come from the Eastern Kingdoms exclusively, and there is no equator for melanin to naturally develop; because, as you yourself say, humans are not a natural creation. The explanation for their skin is in their own post: they are manmade, they are robots, and therefore they don’t need to follow real life conventions.

Mate the curse of flesh affected every skin colour calm down lol

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proud of you :kissing_heart:

can you explain to me how black humans existing is harming the narrative quality?

Why? They’re already ‘cursed space robots’, why do they need a narrative reason?

They didn’t have special lore at the launch of WoW, during vanilla, they don’t have special lore now. Because they don’t need it.

If that isn’t narrative consistency I don’t know what to tell you.

he’s getting so close to self awareness, so close

and yet so far

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Neither are sand, Ice, jungle or Forest trolls.
HM Tauren are still Tauren.
Dark Iron dwarves, are still dwarves.

Why do you feel like putting black/Asian humans as something beneath the rest? That’s really racist you know…

Dwarves come from Ironforge. And yet we have Dark Iron notably distinct.
Sand fury trolls were all part of the same tribe with the Gurubashi.

I find it funny how you switch back and forth from “humans are representations of RL ones” to “they are fictional”.

I honestly don’t need to move one bit in order to expose why throwing about distinct physical features for the race without an explanation, is a mishandling of the setting.
Let alone how obvious it is, that this is but a lazy PR move and a blatant form of tokenism.

So…you are doubling down on the fact that Black features, destined to represent RL features and inclusion, are nothing but a disease!!! Woooow…

Let’s see if I can get my point across in a way that allows my to quote it for any future time when you feel like throwing, again, a distortion of it…

Got it. Here:

The way these features were included cheapens narrative quality because of the reasoning used behind their inclusion, the praxis used to include them, and the circumstances that surround the rest of the races in said environment.

Pushing them for the sake of diversity but not bothering giving them any notable development. Doing so not because of ingame reasons, but because of some meta ones.
And failing to give enough background that would allow them to even compare with the rest of races that explain how their distinct groups came to be.

???

Silly me.
Why would any story element need a narrative reason?!
Why would this obvious distinct groups need the same background as the rest of distinct groups the other races have??

:rofl:

Honestly, sometimes can’t tell if people are serious.

https://eu.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/new-update-for-stormwinds-guards-black-and-asian-skins-to-the-npcs-positive-or-lore-breaking/165145/199?u=mogi-argent-dawn

“Are asian-themed humans some Vrykul that somehow took a hit to the face that slanted their eyes?”

Cmon man

Are u ok

they are not a distinct race. they are humans. they are humans. how many times man. humans. in the context of azeroth they are not asian or black, they are humans, like how some orcs are yellow and some are teal. your argument has 0 weight because blizzard has never stated that the diversity in humans is intended to be distinct.

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But they already existed in vanilla. They precede all these races you use as examples.

So cursed space robots becoming white is obvious, but them becoming black or asian is… silly? Unnatural?

Interesting perspective.

You know you can just say “Yeah I’m racist” and make this conversation a lot shorter right?

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:joy:

Oh boy. If you want to make a point with out of context bits…do not quote the context!!

I mean, in that post above you tried to argue how the curse itself facilitated distinct features.
I’d probably be a bit more worried about whatever I took that day, if it weren’t for the tongue in cheek tone of said bit, that was thrown in the context that had YOU short of saying that black people are but robots with an extra dose of skin cancer.

Not really.
Allowing obvious distinct features, that required distinct backgrounds or events, for both RL and other ingame races, is.

Specially if you include said for the sake of virtue signalling, through obvious tokenism and expect people to be grateful for it.

Wouldn’t call it silly though. Narratively harmful? Hamfisted? Insulting even for those that feel identified with said features or care about the consistency? Maybe.

In vanilla we had other ton of hand waved lore travesties. If you want to signal how you care, and then throw this kind of tokenism, it really does not count for much.

Ps: It’s funny how the arguments simply get on flying by, and how you repeatedly REQUIRE to build up distortions of the point made in order to have anything resembling an argument.

I also wondered such when you downright stated that storytelling came second to messaging. In a story section. Of a fantasy game. :laughing:

okay so in 2020 being black is

but in 2004 it is

Your mask is slipping

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Glad we agree!

So now black humans in WoW are a travesty

uh, okay king, you have a nice day now I’m just gonna report and carry on with my day.

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do you know how much tehya and i both complain about stuff in the story. like me and them disagree 50% of the time on story stuff. we are literally roleplayers.

we just don’t think black ppl existing is a lore travesty

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:rofl:

Good to see you keeping up with the strawmen.
In case your reading comprehension is that of a 10 year old, ill spell it for you:
No, I wasn’t talking about the black or asian humans of Classic, I was talking about plenty other ingame incongruent stuff that came by at a time when Blizzard wasn’t really all that focused on a detailed or tied representation of their universe, and let slip stuff like Starcraft cameos, or half formed story bits that didn’t hold water from any angle.

Good. That makes two of us.

Guess the only difference left is the fact that I’m not as willing as you to let Blizzard come by with cheap lip service and virtue signalling.
Guess my standards are set a tad higher than settling with bare tokenism as a form of valid inclusion.

You can go now. Don’t worry, you’ll sure have your representation with that chick that acted as protagonist of the introductory experience and whose name you don’t even know without googling it.

honestly i spend so much time complaining about the story i should get paid for it.

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these are ur words. that’s how the quote function works. you do realise that when you type something that people will (unfortunately) read it.

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My bad. Guess I’m new to this forum.

:clown_face:

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