even this nerfed version is still leagues ahead of raid when it comes to drops.
So no. It proportionally is fine.
When you’re at a stage that heroic or mythic raid or weekly mythic+ vault is your only upgrade, don’t expect to just be doing one of the three and getting all the gears left and right asap. Farm all 3.
How can you know its ahead if you havent done any m+ yet at all. M+ was designed as separate gearing path with which you could be fully geared doing only dungeons. Somehow people still did plenty of raids in Legion and BfA, despite m+ giving better rewards.
because this isn’t my main? My main’s a death knight 207 ilvl.
As for legion and bfa, the drop chances weren’t this ridiculously low and you had a coin to reroll. Neither of those two exist in shadowlands.
Sorry, but you dont even have +10 achievement, so i really doubt you opinion, unless for some reason you have 2 accounts.
M+ should have upgradeable gear with currency or have weekly loot lockout, but with far better end of dungeon loot. Currently the loot of it is quite worthless.
the thing is, certain speccs (for example SV) HAVE to do all 3 game modes on a high level to get decent gear. It’s absolutly ridiculous.
Why do I have to do PvE to do PvP? Why do I have to do PvP to do PvP?
And yes I HAVE to, if I want to perform on the same level as other classes do with only pve stuff/only pvp stuff in their respective brackets.
Edit:
This account is 1 month old and has the m+10 achievement. Maybe double check, bruv. But this isnt my main, the amory still shows this char at lvl 20 aswell, weirdly
Capped 210 is a bit too low for key pushers 
And yes then it is all about the vault…
If all players in your group are 210 equipped you can easily complete all level 15 keys in time .
Pushing for much higher keys usually requires specific classes that are doing well depending on each patch.
I got to timing +22’s with a bear tank, ret pala, arms warrior, bm hunter, holy paladin in s4 bfa. I am pretty sure when we are used to the new SL dungeons we can get higher than +15’s too. With this same comp.
Outside from underperforming exception classes, people exagerate the meta on non meta classes.
The thing is , corruption made it possible for underperforming classes to be viable for +20 keys up to a point.
I hope it works out for you guys , but I don’t think there will be the same rate of success as the classes are right now.
Currently at +15 lvl and above there is almost no class and spec diversity apart for fire mage, mm hunter, balance druid and vengeance dh. It is far harder than ever before for non meta specs.
Sure meta classes help. But it is not really relevant for a loot/reward discussion 
Non meta’s are also allowed to push keys. Even when the potential is lower than a full meta group.
Agree , balance is a bit out the window when it comes to certain classes. I don’t really expect any major changes until the next raid tier.
After managing to find the time to do a couple of raids this weekend, I find myself totally underwhelmed at the loot. Apart from a couple of quite useless off spec legendary runes I got precisely 2 useable drops. One of which wasn’t actually any good for me.
Just doesn’t feel like a decent use of my time at all. Now waiting on the Vault and hoping I get a decent thing from that.
It’s not even worth running CN again to help other people try and gear- waste more hours and they might not even get anything!
M+, it’s just wait for rng Vault each week as actually doing the run usually gets nothing.
Twisting- finished on one toon, totally zero point in repeating on any other as it gives nothing. If it even gave anima it would be better than now.
You’re not wrong, but you’re not right either.
Right now, getting one single piece a week( wich is what i am having, one MABY two pieces, ) is bull and boring.
Doing the exact same dungeons OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER Again and not getting any loot, no wait, NOT GETTING ANYTHING is boring. I like the challenge, i like getting challenged. But why should i seek a challenge if there is no reason to?
I do ONE M+10 a week, its not something i do for fun.
I do one heroic raid per week, and soon mythic progression.
i know the vault will give me ONE piece of loot and i pray thats an upgrade. Thats it, thats my loot for the week.
With the story line now concluded, i willplay my main on Wednesday,
I will do Torghast, I will do the weekly
and not touch him untill its raid time,
There is no reason to play my main since there is no loot.
So you are not right, but you are not wrong.
I wouldnt mind having one MAJOR upgrade a week and a few minors everyweek or everyday
but now i have nothing
You are not wrong, But neither is the OP.
We need a middle ground, and there isnt one right now
Its not. Thats exactly.how it was back when game was most popular. This patch will last another 6-7 months so 1 or 2 items per week is more than enough. Players are just toon spoiled and entiltes becouse of BFA and Legion.
I rest my case.
There is nothing to do, there is no story, no questline, no other raids or events there is nothing.
M+ has no point
and raid has a lockout,
What feel of progression do you mean because there is NONE right now. Run 20 dungeons and get nothing for it so you wait 6 days for something that MIGHT be good? RNG has never been worse because at least a 2% increase from a crappy piece is better than 0 from nothing. There is no progression in being deliberately stalled by piss poor game design.
This is incorrect. It is hyperbolic. The chance of this happening is vanishingly low, especially for low gear levels.
If the argument is that M+ is bad because it rewards too much up-front and therefore stalls soon thereafter, this is identical to the BfA system. In fact it was worse.
If the argument is that the item levels are too low, then that was the case in BfA as well once you get past its set item level, and you’re not gonna be in full Heroic mode raid gear yet because that doesn’t give insane amounts of loot any more either.
Tbf I have curve and hate Mythics but m15+ is harder than HC nathria.
How about the leggo recipe’s? Those should suffer the same %3 drop rate?
Ive got 8 runs in Halls since i started counting yesterday. Nothing to show for it.
How many runs do you think i should be doign then?
20? 30? 50?
At what point do players start saying to themselves screw this and i am not playing roulette in las vegas anymore? At what point? After 20 runs? I am thinking this way after 8 runs - only the ones i counted. I did others before i started counting.
There is getting loot and there is getting timegated loot for lack of content and for sake of players metrics.