WoW Classic Era 1.14.4 PvP Ranking Update Examples

With the 1.14.4 patch to WoW Classic Era, we’ve updated how PvP ranking works, both in immediate gameplay and via weekly rank calculations. For those who wish to know the details of how this system calculates weekly ranking, we’ve put together the following overview.

Each week during the weekly reset, the system now takes the following steps:

  1. Convert the player’s total weekly honor points to Contribution Points (CP).
  2. Find the player’s “expected rank”, given this amount of CP.
  3. If the player’s “expected rank” is greater than or equal to their current rank, then for each rank above their own (up to a maximum of 4 ranks), they are awarded the difference in CP between each rank above theirs and the next below it, multiplied by the honor change factor for that rank.
  4. If the player’s expected rank falls below their current rank, they will instead decay.
    • Please note that in this new system, de-ranking is not possible due to decay that comes from the player doing no PvP in a given week. De-ranking can now only happen if the player is at the lower end of a rank and chooses to commit dishonorable kills while not earning enough positive honor to offset them.

Honor points convert to CP based at different rates between ranks 1 - 6, ranks 7 - 10, and ranks 11 - 14. Honor points are worth less CP in higher ranks.

500,000 honor points is the upper limit for a week, and 500,000 honor points equates to 65,000 CP (Rank 14). 175,000 honor points equals 40,000 CP (Rank 10), and 45,000 honor points equates to 20,000 CP (Rank 6).

Each rank has a required CP threshold and an honor change factor. For example, if a player’s final total amount of CP is 23,014, that would put them in Rank 6. We use the honor change factor to determine what percentage of CP earned should be awarded for each rank.

Rank CP Required for Rank Change factor for Rank
1 0* 1.0
2 2000 1.0
3 5000 1.0
4 10000 0.8
5 15000 0.8
6 20000 0.8
7 25000 0.7
8 30000 0.7
9 35000 0.6
10 40000 0.5
11 45000 0.5
12 50000 0.4
13 55000 0.4
14 60000 0.34

*For rank 1, you must satisfy minimum PvP requirements — at least 15 HKs.

Here are a couple of examples of calculations that take place.

Example 1
A player is currently at Rank 4 and earns 50,000 honor points.

The weekly calculation is based on the amount of honor points gained this week. 50,000 honor points equals roughly 20,769 CP.

The “expected rank” for that amount of CP is Rank 6, since 20,000 CP is the minimum threshold for Rank 6. Rank 6 is higher than their current rank, so they will gain ranking progress this week. (If players’ expected rank falls below the next rank up, they will instead decay.)

For each rank the player has qualified for — at or above their current rank, up to a maximum of 4 ranks — they are awarded CP. First, we have (Rank 5 CP - Rank 4 CP) * (Rank 5 honor change factor). Then we add (Rank 6 CP - Rank 5 CP) * (Rank 6 honor change factor). So for this week in total, the player will earn: ((15,000 - 10,000) * 0.8) + ((20,000 - 15,000) * 0.8) = 8,000 CP. This will bring the player up to Rank 5.

Example 2

A player is currently at Rank 2 and earns 500,000 honor points. 500,000 honor points equals the maximum amount of earnable CP in a week, which is 65,000.

65,000 CP is the minimum threshold for Rank 14, so the player’s “expected rank” is Rank 14.

For each rank the player has qualified for — at or above their current rank, up to a maximum of 4 ranks — they are awarded CP. First, we have (Rank 3 CP - Rank 2 CP) * (Rank 3 honor change factor). Next, add (Rank 4 CP - Rank 3 CP) * (Rank 4 honor change factor). Next, add (Rank 5 CP - Rank 4 CP) * (Rank 5 honor change factor). Finally, add (Rank 6 CP - Rank 5 CP) * (Rank 6 honor change factor). So for this week in total, the player will earn: ((5,000 - 2,000) * 1.0) + ((10,000 - 5,000) * 0.8) + ((15,000 - 10,000) * 0.8) + ((20,000 - 15,000) * 0.8) = 15,000 CP. This will bring the player up to Rank 5.

24 Likes

10 rank
40000 cp
Got 500k hp
(5 * 0.5 + 5 * 0.4 + 5 * 0.4 + 5 * 0.34 ) *1000 cp + 40k cp = 48200 cp

11.64 rank as the result

Are u kidding me?

And if we will use the “paper text” that 11.99 is better then 12.01 because you will get a 11-12 rank trash hold. Not sure what is wrong here, the trash hold or the trash explanation.

500k milestone is bad because ppl will stop playing pvp at all and bgs will be not so populated (any reason for me to grind even the max limit in 500k on rank 1? I will stop playing on 50k because this is the limit for me already). The 500 k limit is bad for a passionate player (2 days?) and a slow progression on 1-10 rank is bad for a casual player.

This is the completely lose lose situation.

2 Likes

Will you publish the math to convert honor points to CP?
So far you’ve provided 4 examples (45k honor points, 50k honor points, 175k honor points, and 500k honor points), and stated the conversion is “based on a curve which maps honor to CP”.
Sharing the formula for exact honor points to CP conversion would be helpful.

2 Likes

Hi, I’m having trouble understanding your examples.

  1. You say that Honor to CP Conversion Rate is different for each rank, giving 4 rough data points as an example:
    R4 Conversion Rate = 20769CP / 50000H = 0,41
    R6 Conversion Rate = 20000CP / 45000H = 0,44
    R10 Conversion Rate = 40000CP / 175000H = 0,23
    R14 Conversion Rate = 65000CP / 500000H = 0,13
  2. You said that the lower the rank, the higher the conversion Rate.

But the R4 Conversion Rate does not represent that, as the rate is lower than at R6.

Where is the error?

this i am struggling with as well. a hard cap of 500k sounds like a bad idea if the conversion to contribution points is fixed.

In no-weekend times it is hard to reach and in AV WEs it is realtively doable. That may mean you cant get the 60k required in non-AV times and hover in R11 - R13 forever.

I guess AV farming might become the new “meta” for ranking. i dont see a solo or casual player consistently gettting 250k+ each week otherwise

update edit:
looks like mark honor is doubled as well. So there is now a huge incentive for fast win games. this may completely crowd out casuals and solo players from WSG. Already 2 Arathi games up.

love when i spend a week farming bgs and i get 0 honor for that, new system started great for me

love the new menu too, nevermind that i knew the other one better than a family member and the new one looks horrible, great change ! !

1 Like

there was a big announcement on that last week. hard to miss tbh. it was clear that the honor from that week would be lost

absolutely my fault sure, i dont really follow these kind of things, this is the first time i check the classic forums to begin with

I’ll take two minutes and say the new pvp system is there so everyone can get to rank14 without actually committing to the grind and it’s casual af
Dont get me wrong, i am hardly a skilled or dedicated pvper, but this new system is made to ensure even the most casual player will get obviously not casual rewards given enough time

personally 3/10 change but i’ll get cool weapons so it’s “good”

I havent made up my mind on that . 500k a week is not casual in the old world. And the way I understand it is that if you fail to get 60k contribution point in any week, you move backwards. We dont know how far yet but it can mean many weeks of grinding out those 500k

We may now end up with a farm-AV around the clock meta, which would then confirm your concern. In that case i wont stick around as well.

But we have to wait and see. atm 10 WSG open and 3 AB. thats not a bad result for most players i think

It feels a bit like we are missing what happens with the CP gained from 60k to 65k, going from 435k honor to to 500k if we allow ourselves to extrapolate linearly from 40k to 65k CP?
From the examples given it sounds like you only gain CP from whole ranks, or am I misunderstanding? Like in Example 1, should something be happening with the extra 769 CP into rank 6, since progress from 6 to 7 would still be within 4 ranks from rank 4?
I am just struggling to see why 500k is supposed to relate to 65k CP (top of 14) when it looks like you only benefit from honor that takes you up to 60k CP (beginning of 14) to get the last (Rank 14 CP - Rank 13 CP) * (Rank 14 honor change factor) added to your CP…
If that last 60k-65k CP actually does anything for you, are we then missing a “rank 15” honor change factor? Or does it just not do anything?
Or is the 500k actually just 60k CP all along?

Hi. May be some one write rank calculator?
I have now 9 rank, and how many honor i need for next weak get 100% 10 rank?

Given the examples above, take 2 players:

Player A is Rank 6, 90% (24500 CP)
Player B is Rank 7, 0% (25000 CP)

Player A only benefits from honor farmed up to Rank 10 minimum (175k honor)
This will have him end up at 24500 + 3500*2 + 3000 + 2500 = 37000 CP (Rank 9, 40%)

Meanwhile Player B is in rank 7 so he benefits from honor farmed up to Rank 11 minimum (at least 240k honor?). If he farms that full honor he will end up at 25000 + 3500 + 3000 + 2500*2 = 36500 (Rank 9, 30%)

Is this actually how this system works? That Player B in this case has to farm way more honor to end up in a lower rank than Player A, who started at a lower rank?

Edit: To expand on this, if Player B would farm the same amount of honor as player A, the 175k, he would then end up at 25000 + 3500 + 3000 + 2500 = 34000 (Rank 8, 80%)

Is this correct? 2 guys farm the same amount of honor and one goes from rank 6 to rank 9 and the other one from rank 7 to 8?

Another edit: I assume we have to be missing something where if you are already partially in a rank the first CP you gain goes into completing your progression in that rank at that rank’s change factor? And that the 4 ranks you can progress to must be in that case from 6, 90% to 10, 90%? That again brings up the question of what happens between 60k CP and 65k CP…

I was unsure about the percentage aswell and have omitted that in my calculations, because it did not match up with the examples given by blizz. But the example in itself are flawed either way, so idk what to think

The maths is not properly explained (which is probably not their intention anyway), but the way that it’s currently explained and as I interpret it, I have a few problems.

The first problem is highlighted perfectly by Snapcaster above me: being barely above the rank cut-off points makes it very difficult for you to progress. In fact, someone who is barely below the same cut-off point as you, will progress faster with the same amount of honor.

The second problem is that farming anything above 435k honor is pointless. Even though they state that 500k is the maximum ‘useful’ honor, the calculations actually make 435k the maximum. Let me explain. In the highest bracket (R11-14) we know that 175k honor = 40k CP and 500k honor = 65k CP. Extrapolating linearly between those two points, we find that 60k CP matches 435k honor. This means that anything at or above 435k will yield expected rank 14. That means there is no point farming beyond 435k honor anyway, because your expected rank can’t get any higher than rank 14. It is of course possible they phrased it wrong, and they meant that 500k honor matches 60k CP, or perhaps there is a virtual rank 15 that is taken into account in the calculation…

The third problem is also highlighted before, there is no point to grind 500k honor early in your grind, and later on in your grind you must grind 500k (or 435k?) every week for 4-5 weeks. This makes the system fall into a weird spot where the hardcore players don’t need to go all out in order to achieve maximum ranking gains in early ranks.

The fourth problem is that the fastest possible way to rank takes 8 weeks, which is longer than it’s currently (6 weeks I think?).

Lastly, we know nothing about decay yet. Does decay only happen upon getting DKs? Does decay happen if you gain too little honor this week? If so, how is it possible then that people who don’t participate at all won’t decay as claimed in the blue post? Do you only become ‘eligible’ for decay if you get more than 15 HKs? How quick does decay happen (especially in the higher ranks)?

I’d like to add as well that I think the system might also take your current progress into your rank into account, which isn’t highlighted by the examples. E.g.: if you’re at rank 5 (80%) = 19000 CP and gain an expected 20000 CP from your honor farming, then the CP you will gain is only (20000 - 19000) * 0.8 = 800, as opposed to (20000 - 15000) * 0.8 = 4000 as the blue post seems to suggest.

Another addition: because of how the system seems to work, it only makes sense to farm honor in amounts slightly above the CP conversion cut-offs: people will farm 4500, 11250, 22500, 33750, 45000, 77500, 110k, 142.5k, 175k, 240k, 305k, 370k or 435k honor, nothing else, which is kinda weird and almost begs the question why honor still exists in the first place.

4 Likes

You’re gonna have to clarify. Will 500k honor give you 60k CP or 65k CP? Your table is not consistent with the text. Table says 60k required for r14, however text says 500k honor = 65k CP, and states this is the minimum for r14. If it’s actually 65k that’s required, that changes the conversion rate to even lower and ads several extra ranking weeks.

putting the examples into numbers, the CP_R (CP for “expected Rank” as per text) to Honor function CP_R = Delta_R * Honor might look smth like this:

Delta_R = 0.44 for R in 1 to 6
Delta_R = 0.23 for R in 7 to 10
Delta_R = 0.13 for R in 11 to 14

based on

it doesnt actually say “constant” in these brackets, so that is an assumption. Then there is some ambiguity of whether 60k or 65k is the starting point. I read it that 60k is where it starts and 65k is the maximim. That then gives you the following table for “expected rank” for any particular Honor in that week

|expected rank|CP_R|Delta_R|HP|

|1|1| 0.44 |n/a|
|2|2000| 0.44 | 4,500 |
|3|5000| 0.44 | 11,250 |
|4|10000| 0.44 | 22,500 |
|5|15000| 0.44 | 33,750 |
|6|20000| 0.44 | 45,000 |
|7|25000| 0.23 | 109,375 |
|8|30000| 0.23 | 131,250 |
|9|35000| 0.23 | 153,125 |
|10|40000| 0.23 | 175,000 |
|11|45000| 0.13 | 346,154 |
|12|50000| 0.13 | 384,615 |
|13|55000| 0.13 | 423,077 |
|14|60000| 0.13 | 461,538 |
||65000|0.13| 500,000 |

so if you get 155k honor in a week, your “expected rank” would be 9 and then the CP progression (or reduction) sets in as per their table. I.e. if you are below 9 your CPs increase, if you are above 9 your CPs reduce (to a minimum of 35k, as you cant lose rank)

let me know if i didnt get this right

What we do know are five conversion rates and the four key points to making progress.
Let’s start at Rank 10, since the ones who have time and are serious about ranking will most likely get to this rank.

Example 1 - You’re Rank 10 - what is the maximum honor you need to farm to guarantee Rank 11?

Answer: You’ll need to farm around 450k+/honor in the week. Using Blizzard’s formula this nets you 8200 CP. Add this to your current baseline Rank 10 CP gives you 48 200 CP. This is above Rank 11 (45 000 CP) but below rank 12 (50 000 CP).

Example 2 - You’re Rank 10, when do you not make progress?

This is based on point 4 of Blizzard four point rule.
Earning 175k honor/week represents expected rank 10.
Earning less than this a week should mean you would decay since this represents an “expected rank” which is lower than 10.

What’s the fix for this? Tie the system to lifetime honor rather than weekly honor.

I lost between 197 and 198 thousand honorable kills with your marvelous update.
Any remedy to that?

How would you calculate the amount of time that would take me to get back again?

Was looking for this, thank you!