It’s naive to presume other players are there to act as NPCs. The deserter buff was even changed in response to player feedback.
Unless you go into a follower dungeon you are committing to completing that group task. Whilst you are free to desert the other players prematurely, you are not free of the consequences of those actions.
TW raids are PuGs not auto queue contents.
And even more so we need punishment systems to make people do the “right thing”.
Same as in real life. There are are plenty of people who wont do a specific action or crime not because “thats not a nice thing to do” but because the consequences for it “demotivates” them.
Exactly the system incentivizes staying and doing the dungeon.
Except the system is not working as intended.
How its not working as intended? You leave the dungeon, you get deserter. Either leave or get kicked. Doesnt matter. Its already been explained multiple times why the debuff applies to kicks as well.
If you are going to use the “but there are innocent kicks as well” argument.
No justice system is absolutely 100% fool proof. Even in real life innocent people can get jailed…if not worse. While the risks are low…its not impossible. Yet nobody is asking for the law system to be torn down and let full anarchy reign supreme.
If you can design a punishment system where its 100% foolproof and mistake free and will always punish the guilty party with 100% certainty. Then don’t stop at video game forums. Go with your design and ideas to a Nobel’s committee in Law(if there is such a thing).
The only reason people take this debuff at this point in the season is down to a vote kick or a real life issue (DC etc). The vote kick system is abused by troll groups, that is not intended. There is no method in place to report this in game. Once kicked, you have a 30 minute debuff just for being the right person at the right time.
There will be no one who will join a HC for loot from early bosses. And this was the primary aim of the 30 minute debuff. It was to stop people farming early bosses. So again the system is moot and not working as intended.
It does work for people who are not behaving as the group wants them to in a dungeon. But then this is a very subjective view point. More so their culprit concerned may have genuine issues that is preventing them performing as they should. And again this is HC level dungeon. Why care so much over such trivial content.
The flip side is what do you loose by removing this pathetic fiasco of an idea: little to nothing. So it is a bad system that is about as effective as an ash tray on a motorbike, and all it creates as grief. When you implement something that only creates grief for your paying customers, then again it is not working as intended.
“Ofc. its always the 4 other guys who had a problem. Not me though. I am the innocent angel and victim who only wants peace and love to all.”
Look. Every “omgez I got votekicked unjustly” topic, people will complain that they where the good guys and the 4 other people where the evil devils. And some have been caught red-handed when a person who was also in that group. posts pictures on the OPs behaviour.
Same as I wont assume that every kick is just. Dont assume that every kick is unjust either…
And the argument “trivial content” ok. So the ToS applies only to raids and m+? Feel free to be a 
in normals and heroic dungeons. Its trivial content anyway 
Gives a 30 min respite from the trolls who actually get a just kick. To begin with…
I never for one moment said that there were no unjust vote kicks. My point has always been that the 30 minute debuff solves nothing. You can kick as many as you want to, just do not apply the debuff to all who leave a dungeon. The only reason I mention the vote kick system is because it is part of the issue, as trolls use it to push a penalty on victims of their choice. My problem is with the debuff system itself not the vote kick system.
The 30 minute debuff would have absolutely zero effect on me. I have about 20 alts to just log over to. And tbf I cannot remember the last I received a vote kick from a dungeon.
The system is abused by the trolls. The only respite I see in complaints on this forum is when the innocent party are outside the dungeon waiting for a 30 minute debuff to expire.
I will always smile when I recall that time a mechagnome in my group got kicked soon after the start of a TW dungeon with a reason given “uh, mechagnome :/”
On the contrary, it’s working well
You will never solve a problem unless you recognise it is one.
Or you see a problem where there aren’t any.
Personal dislike doesn’t mean that there is a problem…
The problem was leavers so they resolved that with people penalties. And this expansion made them even harsher in response to player feedback.
You can personally dislike it. That’s fine. But it served a purpose.
That’s a good idea to think of, but if they’re in a premade and they get to know you are the one kicking them, they will be kicking you 100%. 
I remember from long ago (more then 10 years) i vote kicked someone of a premade group. In the reason tab i putted my own name. And right after the person got kicked xD. They kicked their own friend. They thought it was me that got kicked.
And a few days ago i did love is in the air dungeon. I joined as a healer because faster queue. (And yes, i play the healer role as intended) but the tank let us wait, and we couldn’t kick for 2 minutes. So he must be punished. When the dungeon was done i still wanted the tank getting punished for the time we had to wait. The tank was offline and some other player declined my vote kick 2 times. But after 2x decline i vote kicked the other person and he instantly got kicked because the tank was offline. Then i kicked the tank and then i left the dungeon. Normally i am a friendly player but ppl dont must waste my time. Or doing bad to me. We were the last 3 ones left. I didnt abuse. Also i dont know if there is still a deserter when the dungeon is finished.
And there is the problem some players are jerks no matter what. This as I only found out doing time walking dungeons on multiple characters over the last 6 weeks. To fix a problem I have never encounter since the dungeon finder existed. (I joined the game between patch 2.2 and 2.3). I had 2 characters kicked for no reason last week. Both times I had fallen behind because 1/ I wasn’t familiar with the quick route in a Vanilla dungeon 2/ the 2nd boss in Azjol-Nerub caused an almost wipe, so 2 dead I release and run back in, other gets ressed! Anyway just as I get to the end boss which they had pulled they kick me. So explain how that is my fault and I have to do what for 30 minutes as a punishment for others being jerks. They were jerks they waited until mid end fight to kick of the last boss!!! Even though this was twice in 100 runs I just wish follower dungeons existed for every instance. Problem solved!!!
I can’t say I’ve had that experience, I levelled all my non pala alts recently. Most of which I can’t play well and do appalling dps, combined with the scaling kicking in and making your dps terrible compared to others. Never got kicked. Got the odd question which was fair enough.
Nobody cares are the rate you plough through the TW dungeons. They are just speed run, often it’s just the tanks running at great speed. I have had to release and still be running back and they have already started on the last boss.
Yes you can get unlucky but it’s still far preferable a system to having nothing. I can still count on one hand how many times I’ve been unfairly kicked from a dungeon in all the years I’ve been playing.
While I wouldn’t have kicked you, releasing was obviously a mistake in hindsight considering you haven’t caught up before the last boss. You can always target the healer to see if they’re mass ressing or not.
In the end you can always minimize your chances to be kicked by doing your best to stay with the group. A lot of people have no situational awareness and they don’t see people are running back. They see you have no damage and are behind and assume you’re afk or slacking.
I rarely play pve but the 1 time this month i did timewalking they wanted to votekick me twice for 0 reason (my bf tanked, i did by far most dps and nothing went anywhere wrong. What can even go wrong in Timewalking?). First of all its Timewalking, not something serious. Why kick someone? Having a player less, or sometimes even 2, u barely even notice it. Might as well leave them in. If something or someone rly bothers you can also just leave yourself instead? But option 1 would for me always be communication, helping ppl out if needed.
So we asked Why he wanted to votekick? Two times. No response.
I get this game is 0 social nowadays in pve. Surely this votekicking is not helping to improve this.
It needs stop to abuse votekick and it has gone too far so please do something about it, Blizzard! It is time to act it now!