Allow twisting Seal of Command with Seal of Martyrdom

that rune is already there and is called divine storm … SoM and divine storm take the same place on the equipement so why gatekeeping those who want to use twisting ? It’s not like if players would be able to use them both at the same time …

people who want to seal twist will use Som and those who don’t will choose divine storm, what’s wrong with that jeez …


True ret enjoyers are in Wrath right now probably. You are just a cult member of bug and latency abusers.

I have several 100s parses as wotlk ret, yet i find the wotlk rotation is made for dumb people with slow reaction. You can change the lowest prio abilities in sim higher, and set highest abilities lower and sim will lose 5% dps at max. This is ridiculous.

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So I prefer the Seal Twisting playstyle and I’m currently have been doing it in endgame SoD content. Theres some major problems with it currently which is the same weaknesses as TBC with no AoE and Cleave which is meaning Divine Storm is becomes the only viable choice.

Right now im Twisting Seal of Martyrdom with Seal of Righteousness (Rank 3) which works. Seal of Command doesn’t work anymore. I have found in a pure single target scenario Seal Twisting is slightly beating Divine Storm though its very close and as soon as theres 2 targets Divine Storm HARD wins, which is pretty much every dungeon and trash pack and most bosses too.

Theres 2 things Blizzard could do to really fix this problem and I think the best solution would be to give Seal of Martyrdom its cleave back. If its too strong reduce it to 15% cleave or something but Seal of Martyrdom needs some sort of cleave to keep up with Divine Storm. Giving us Seal of Command Twisting would mean Seal Twistings Single Target DPS would become further ahead than Divine Storm but wouldn’t Fix its weakness of no Cleave/AoE so I think giving us back Command Twisting is the wrong direction and giving Martyrdom its Cleave again is the right direction.

I’d personally prefer the solution I said above but on a GAMEPLAY LEVEL Seal Twisting with Seal of Martyrdom SHOULD NOT have near to equal DPS as Divine Storm SINGLE TARGET. An AoE Rune SHOULD NOT be equal DPS to a single target DPS Rune on ONE TARGET or it means the AoE Rune is too strong or the Single Target Rune is too weak. This would mean Seal of Martyrdom should have massive damage buffs to keep it stronger in its niche of single target to keep it a viable Rune. This is also a solution but I would prefer Seal of Martyrdom to get its cleaving again so Retribution players can choose what playstyle they like of either Seal Twisting or Divine Storm and for both playstyles to remain more equal and both competitive options which right now Divine Storm is too good compared to Seal of Martyrdom.

My build in SoD is Holy Tree: 5/5 Divine Strength, 5/5 Improved Seal of Righeousness, 1 Consecration (For some AoE). Retribution Tree: 5/5 Benedicition (For Reduced Mana on Twisting). I Seal Twist Seal of Martyrdom and Seal of Righteousness, its not as competitve as Divine Storm but I the reason I leveled in SoD is for Seal Twisting to rotation as I have a love for it ever since TBC.


Post it from your main with a link to log or consider yourself a troll.

I absolutely agree with this post. Seal twisting is one of the main reasons I’m so excited with SoD and its the exact reason why I quit playing Paladin in Wrath.
For me it is exactly as the OP said - engaging, not clunky and I would add rhythmic (with a rhythm that changes based on your weapon speed). For me, the right mix between RnG (when used with Command) and skill.

Whilst DS is cool and all it is only a button you press on cooldown, without thinking, no matter what - that’s not engaging for me.

I have the feeling that Blizzard has more in store for us seal twisters in the next phases. I’m extremely curious if the “Augmented Seals” rune that was visible in their latest video is something related to this or just a meme.

Has anyone tried twisting SoM or SoR into SoC instead of the other way around?


I don’t care what 0-10% parse junk considers about me.


Oh wow, you looked my alt’s log that I brought for summon on second account. That’s so sweet that you payed her attention. Now back to your 100s parces claim

Going wright from your paladin of what?

What is the point of this conversation? You have stated your opinion, quite harshly, that you are not a seal twister enjoyer. That’s fine. Noted. Move on with your life or bring some constructive criticism.

I told it in the other thread that seal twisting is representation of bug, that had been made a feature in TBCC. This is RPG not (Looter) shooter. Here GCD and other mechanics exist to allow people with slightly less that ideal ping to play. Seal twisting is entirely ping dependant feature and benefits thouse who live closer to server physical location moreabd have more stable connection, thus creating advantage for specific groups of players. Before you mention it I live in Eastern Europenia country that is EU member, but even here mine ping didn’t allowed me to execute twisting at least 90% reliably.

Sitting idle waiting for that 0.4 sec to spam few keys is far from smooth gameplay that Wrath or even Cata offer for Rets. Ret paladins were a meme in Vanilla, Bug abusers made official in TBC and finally being addressed in Wrath.

Yes, blizz please - let’s twist again!!!


Yea, I played on ptr each phase and you would get used to the delay.

People are blaming their inability to twist on their ms, but It’s actually just them.

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  1. If you don’t want to play seal twisting, that’s fine, there are other runes to use.
  2. I played a lot of TBC test servers with 200ms+ ping and twisting worked fine.

i just hit lvl 20 and was skipping gleefully to fight some mobs and try out twisting and before i got to the try it i found this post.
RiP twisting. you were a fun mechanic


It’s still quite fun to twist SoR into SoM, you should give it a try. And you dont need to spec ret for that. I’m speccing holy for consecration and then I can tank, heal and DPS on demand :))

Twisting …

Never tried this twisting thing but coming from warrior i miss some complexity in our rotation, go for it

Reactions like this are normal in subject that people don’t understand. Classic to all the way through TBC, Retribution has been defined by this mechanic. I certainly didn’t feel stupid for learning how to do Seal Twisting and actually felt quite rewarded when I could pull off 20k Crits with Appolyon in Sunwell.

We have tanking Warlocks, Rogues, Healing Mages and Melee Hunters! Surely they can go and add a Seal Twisting Spec for us Hardcore Retribution lovers. We have stuck by this Spec even when it was gutter trash and completely unviable. Do you think we deserve a bit more respect on our opinions? Most people who are playing Ret are “Flavour of the Month” enjoyers". Most Seal Twisters are Hardcore longterm Ret lovers who has stuck with the Spec with loyalty throughout the good and bad. Throwing your original fanbase under the bus is a really bad move in any genre/media.

not reading that

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