not only they are 6 weeks behind but they can never catch up due to how ash is distributed.
there is no point to start playing expansion now for anyone who wonders if they should come back .
same with alts - if you didnt start your alt on week 1 you are forver behind.
And this is a fact. Not just because of soul ash but because of weekly bingo lottery which has tremendous disparity vs actual rewards from content iself.
its not even secondary spec friendly.
I cant switch suddenly to night fae with bis havoc legendary just to be a good havoc pvp player
Of course it does.
Why would someone doing challenging endgame content on their main be interested in leveling up alts to max out on renown and do world quests and pet battles? How is that alt-friendly?
BFA was alt-friendly with emissary gear rewards awarding normal raid level gear, warfronts awarding a piece of heroic raid gear once in a while etc.
This is not alt-friendly.
This expansion is less alt-friendly then bfa and legion combined.
In bfa i had no problems keeping 3 characters up to date gearwise from beginning to end.
Now we are farming endgame content like there is no tomorrow on one char with the risk of getting absolutely no upgrades.
Do your whiteknighting know any limits at all? As the guy above says: This expansion is even secondary spec unfriendly.
Same. As a unholy main, i have crafted bis raid legendary and bis pvp legendary for unholy.
I just cannot switch to blood without being severely handicapped compared with other tanks. Cant even change to frost without being severely handicapped and frost is in a bad enough state from before for anyone to wanting to play it without legos.
you can make a 210 legendary with 2000 soul ash. That takes 2 weeks. youâre not 6 weeks behind if you join today.
And besides, what do you want? To casually stroll in 4 months later than everybody and catch up in a day? Every account needs a few weeks of work. The ideal situation is to be able to change your main after 3 weeks and not be super behind. A friend of mine decided on changing main 3 weeks into the expansion and his paladinâs already ilvl 191 and he did a few mythic 7~8âs with it too. And heâs actually been quite busy with work as well, so he didnât fully dedicate himself to farming either. This wasnât doable in bfa.
oh right. This is worse than legion and BFA combined. Tell me again how alt friendly it was to farm essences in BFA again. The legendary cloak questing, farming visions and all those wonderful alt friendly stuff.
Youâre clearly someone who doesnât like this expansion, so my question is, why not just leave to prove your own point? Because it seems to me that you have no problem with over exaggerating with every single thing to justify your points anyways.
WoW isnât alt-friendly MMORPG. Iâve seen only 1 it was swtor. You even can mail gear from your main to your alts, coz main stat and secondary have the same effect on every DPS spec, even healer. Thats called alt-friendly game. If you have 1 TOP gear - you can play every alt with TOP gear.
How many hours does your day have? Mine has 24. As any adult person i have a job, but being on sick-leave + quaranteed has allowed me to spam the game and i have played the game nonstop the last weeks on one character, getting little to no upgrades.
I reccon when i start working again i will fall behind alot.
How in the seven kingdoms is that alt-friendly?
When they released echoes of nyalotha it was pretty alt-friendly, at least compared to SL. Gearing up my pala and dh alts was done quickly with m+ and echoes buying bis essences.
As i have said to you before, i have been paying and playing and staying loyal to this game through many ups and downs, but now im really considering it.
Things could change, but if they dont, im out for good and i can promise you that goes for many other people aswell.
Ask yourself if it is good game design when people start to escape from the game.
And it seems to me that you will defend anything and everything blizzard does that is opposing what the playerbase enjoys.
Tell me how an expansion that is not even friendly to change your spec could be alt-friendly?
⌠Yes they can. This statement would only be true if there were an infinite amount of legendaries and every single one would be BiS against every single type of mob in the game. But âworstâ case scenario is that you need to craft 2 or 3. That takes like 1-2 months in a 2 year expansion to craft. You are whining for the sake of whining at this point while cherrypicking what to reply to, because obviously you canât say anything about azerite armor and essences/corruption before the vendor was added.
Same nonsense statement. More alt friendly than legion? Your memory is pretty bad. Starting artifact power grind from 0 if you changed spec was not alt friendly until very late into the expansion. Same thing can be said about the legendaries that were completely rng to begin with, so we were happy if we got a good one at least for our main spec, let alone a secondary spec. And again, same thing can be said about azerite armor, essence farm, corruption farm in bfa.
Which was one year after essences were introduced to the game.
If youâre someone who has enough time to level 3 alts in bfa, you have enough time to spend an hour weekly for 2 torghast runs per character.
So which one are you? A full timed job person who has zero free time, or someone who in bfa btw, could farm essences, azerite, legendary cloak and everything for 3 characters simultaneously?
Besides, if youâre that busy, what do you even need alts for?
then donât be loyal. You clearly hate the direction theyâre going, and what would make a louder announcement than actually not paying them anymore? Perfect demonstration to prove your point. Thatâs what i do when i donât like playing this game.
No i donât. Like i said to you before, I find raiding at the moment useless which is a terrible thing they did. I think their focus is too much on mythic+. I think the maw is unfinished and torghast is a wasted opportunity for great content.
I donât find it difficult to bash them when justified. I just donât consider what you find an issue, an issue.
If youâre talking about covenants, Trust me. Iâve been arguing about how STUPID AND GARBAGE it is to make power a part of covenant choice. You donât have to convince me there.
But being alt friendly isnât a problem with this expansion. specially if you have friends to help you out. You can gear up and be mythic ready in two weeks time.
Still in legion you could gear up efficiently by just doing endgame content like raid and m+.
Now you can clear raid and spam m+ without getting anything all week long - And then you can open the great vault and have none items offered being actual upgrade. Happened to me.
This is RNG on steroids, and it kills any motivation to go over the same thing again with an alt, where you in addition have to grind torghast, renown, covenant ++
Therefore, this is less alt-friendly. In legion in bfa you could bare with all the borrowed power-stuff, because you knew you would be able to gear up when you started doing raid and m+ on your alts.
Now you dont know, you know that there is a chance for you to spam endgame content on one char all week long without getting one single upgrade.
I agree essences were a alt-unfriendly aspect, and i said from day one that they should be account-wide.
Even then the whiteknights defended it. Some of the same whiteknights who now are referring to that as alt-unfriendly to defend current SL design.
I think you misunderstood what I mean, because personally I donât give a damn about gear levels, as long as I can play decently and get something out of it.
My issue is that currently, to even open up every âbuildingâ at the base of my alts on level 1, and to buy basic transmogs/mounts etc that I unlock, Iâd need to basically ten times the anima Iâm currently getting.
I really hate that anima is so scarce, that instead of doing the fun stuff(ember court, the odd thorghast run, treasure hunting, or just leveling another alt) Iâd have to grind non-stop anima just to open up this gameplay.
I dont mind torghast or the other stuff. I see torghast as something both chill and rewarding to do.
But after my experiences with all the effort put in to gear my main with little to no reward, my motivation to gear up alts is dead.
I work as a paramedic, meaning i dont work regular hours, so when im off work i usually have several days to play.
Im neither more or less busy then a average adult person, i work, i go to the gym, i see friends, i travel, etc. - Still i had no problems playing three toons through most of bfa at an OK level. I only did mythic raids on my main while doing m+/hc/pvp on the others.
I do not see myself do this with more then 1 character with current design. I levelled up 2 chars to 60, my uh dk and my hpal. Pala is already behind alot because the time spent on my main was more then enough gametime - And the rewards, or more rightful said the lack of rewards, kills any motivation for doing the same on second toon.
Therefore: Alt-unfriendly.
Is it in your interest as someone who plays this game and participates in endgame content that a huge amount unsubscribes?
Will you defend the direction even tho it will lead the game into its lowest number of subs ever seen?
People, at least a vast majority of them, put in effort to get something back. Im not talking about being âRained down with lootâ - Im talking about effectively gearing up that scales well with effort put in - The level/challenge of the content and the amount of the content.
I will wait and see if they change anything before taking that decision, i have quit the game before and returned, the next time i quit the game it will be finally, i will gather all my gold and give it to the first tauren moonkin i see, then delete every char - Its a huge decision, so i wait it out and see what happens.
Well then it sounds like you are mainly focused on raiding, thats perfectly ok, but thats a vanilla/classic-mindset. It was raid or die.
M+ has been a good way of gearing up for those who of different reasons dont raid, even a good way of gearing up/pushing content for raiders aswell. M+ brought a whole new dimension to the game, its challenging and it should be rewarding to do it.
Now pvp is the safest way of gearing up. Grind conquest and upgrade it depending on your rating.
At this point i cant even offspec to blood if we need a tank cause having crafted bis leggos for raid/pvp for unholy. I feel locked to a spec, i cant just switch to frost if they decide to nerf unholy to pieces and buff frost, another horrible design atm.
You mean: You can grind endgame content on your alt and hope for the best. If lucky you can be mythic ready in two weeks time, if unlucky you will barely be normal-ready.
When people say alt friendly they actualy mean main friendly. They want such drastic catch ups and skips so their alts could become their another mains.
Wrong. They want to get actual gear from doing actual content.
They dont want to spam raid and m+ just to get nothing back on another character. One is enough.
No one would go to work if it were some kind of lottery if they was to recieve salary or not.
You guys will understand poor game design when players escape the game leaving it to a private server-state.
Yea i understand that, but to be fair, that has nothing to do with things being alt friendly. Theyâre cosmetics. not an actual character progression. When they talk about alt friendly stuff, itâs about the progression.
No itâs not. But what i do believe is that people who complain about these issues are either the loud minority, or people who just want to find a reason to complain. But who knows? Maybe iâm wrong. Maybe you are the majority. And if you actually are and people leave the game because of this, then itâs a win for you. Because thereâs no way blizzard would see the massive drop in subs and be ok with it, specially when they know the reason for it.
And if youâre wrong, then great as well. One less person that complains.
Either way, itâs a win win for me.
I was at first, but then after seeing that they nerfed the drop chance to 15%, while itâs a once per week thing, most of my bis gears and trinkets coming from dungeons, and the fact that the great vault reward for mythic+ is significantly easier and better to get, I realized raiding is a waste of time, so i stopped caring about it. I just semi-casually do dungeons now. Made it to 500 rio score, so not super dedicated, but going at my own pace for now.
As for pvp, thereâs a conquest cap, so you wonât be able to gear up much with it in early weeks. And besides, the system requires a lot of pvp dedication, which i just donât enjoy doing that much. Last time i dedicated my time for pvp, it was for the old alterac valley event in anniversary, for the mount.
Thatâs always been an issue. nothing shadowlands specific. Take a look at legion for example and how you had to AP grind for the weapon you had which was spec specific.
I donât know why, but for some reason, it seems like blizzard HATES for people to play multiple specs or change talents and everything. They never give a damn about specs anyways.
But hereâs the thing. Thatâs kind of irrelevant when it comes to alt friendly nature of this expansion. There actually was even a joke around for a while about this too. That how itâs so stupid that in shadowlands, itâs easier to just play 3 death knights rather than changing the spec for one death knight.
But at least, death knights have a fairly balanced situation with covenants and thereâs no CLEAR winner per spec for them. So, theyâre actually much better doing than most classes.
Same thing was said about BFA yet it was most sucesfull expansion since WoTLK.
Also comparing rpg game what are designed around rng dice rolls since like ever to determenistic system like salary is stupid.
You are not aupostu spam few mythics a be fully geared in no time. This is not single player rpg with 28h of game time. Its mmo what will be there for more than 2y.
Im not claiming to be majority, i dont even care if i am or not. But seeing an increasingly number of threads about this subject, and more and more people with the same experience as me, makes me believe this is more then a loud minority.
Same issue in my guild/communities, people offering alot of time in high content getting nothing from it.
Its not a win for me if this continues and people leave. I as many else invested a lot of time into this game during the years, and were looking forward to SL for a long time - As im sure is the cause for you aswell.
If anything it is sad if it comes to that, im not gonna find any joy in huge bunks of the playerbase leaving with me vs me leaving with a few others.
Its the first time i have experienced putting in huge effort into endgame content without getting any rewards from it, i play the game to get rewarded and upgraded from it, its the base of the game for me as it is for many others.
I wouldnt work if it were a rng lottery deciding who on the team recieved salary that month and who not. This feels exactly like that.
Continuing like this will not be worth it - With that said, it can be changed so we will see.
If you have my bad luck in GV pvp gearing is actually faster, you grind the conquest and by the gear you want/need - And upgrade it depending on rating. Actually bought a chest item and upgraded it to 220 and now its my best piece for any content because what i had from before was a m0 chest with bad stats.
I did eight hc bosses, ten m+ dungeons (One 12 and nine 10s) and i farmed honor at 2k rating unlocking 8/9 GV slots.
No items, and i mean none, of the items offered, were upgrades.
You seriously mean that time spent on above content should give no upgrades?
Would go to work if it was to be a lottery if you got a salary or not?
Yeah and nobady on this forum will ever beliave you that after all that content you didnt get single upgrade. You are propably just one of those bad players what all they did was 1 mythic 2 sitting on 1400 raiting and have 0 raid bosses down. Feel free.to shows your main.