This might just be it lol. Sadly, lfd is here to stay. Just look at the qq posts when blizzard released, operation: mechagon, mythic only. Blizzard created this “rush” culture and now they are struggling to deal with it.
Yeah - they’ve dug themselves into a hole, because making existing content harder than it was before creates a sense of futility - the notion that you’re doing something that would’ve been easier and more rewarding had you done it earlier.
There is only one solution: Reset the whole thing and start again. Therefore Classic. It hurts but it’s true.
I agree that being kicked when you’re actually playing and doing your role is bad and wrong and should not flag you with deserter buff. On the other hand, people who afk in dungeons and are kicked should get the debuff so it’s a tricky one to work around IMO.
I guess im the devils advocate because i dont even partially agree with the OP.
You didnt explain yourself and people who go afk in dungeons should be kicked. You are wasting other peoples time. Okay you forgot something and had they looked they might have understood what you meant, but is that their fault? Not really.
The deserter debuff is also a time out for players who are either behaving poorly or are playing sufficiently bad no one actually wants then in their group. Bit of a “get your $!#@ together” time out. You are saying this should be removed altogether because it inconvenienced you on this occasion, where it even seems to be at least equal part your fault you were kicked. So, no, your reasoning is poorly thought out and very self absorbed.
If it’s just a temprary thing like taking a leak or a 5 minute absence to deal with rl stuff (the dog wet the carpet) then they shouldn’t be removed. You’d lose more time looking for a replacement anyways. Just communicate your reason, and if it’s a good one then most people are understanding.
Violet Hold was another one people didn’t like and yes I remember those issues too.
Nah, I abuse the hell out of it nowadays. Sign island expedition with my brother, stand afk at the start. If the random complains or goes afk too, we kick him and he gets deserter.
Without the deserter there is more abuse. There is no perfect system. But the current system is the lesser of two evils. You also can’t endlessly kick. The system limits you.
Islands are a pain because there are only three people and if two are together there is very little you can do.
Lmao, yeah, right. I’ve never not been able to kick someone.
In an Island Expedition it is hard to imagine you would be in a position to repeatedly kick different people continuously. They don’t last that long. There is a system in place so that you can’t continue to instigate vote kicks.
However all your victims have to do is put you on their ignore list and they wont be paired with you again.
Even in dungeons it doesn’t happen. We kicked like 6 people from a shrine of the storm before we finished it. We had another random with us and we told him “Kick everyone we initiate vote kicks on or we won’t finish this instance” and he just went along with it and we kicked everyone else that joined. This system is just broken and needs fixing.
I wonder how many times this happened to a lowley dps. He or she probably accepted the 30 min ban, done some questing or farming to pass the time and then just queued again, but GOD FORBID! This happens to a tank or healer…of to the forums!
I actually don’t believe you.
Then don’t. The system is broken and that you don’t see this is ridiculous.
Are you sure. I remember getting the message: this person cant be kicked for another x minutes or seconds. Weird…
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Same. There is also a you can’t initiate another vote kick yet kind of message.
I would be very surprised if they removed that system.
I think you are in denial, the problem is not LFD but dungeon design to accomodate the mythic+ esports. There is toxicity in every dungeon group manual or automatic, i dare say that my experience the last few days that i chain rain hcs has been very positive. In most runs people were polite and helpful even offering to trade gear.
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It’s both. Dungeons have been terrible since WotLK. This is where the whole mantra of making dungeons this 3-5 boss experience thing originated, and then making dungeons completely irrelevant for further progress once you’d stepped into raids. Late in WotLK the dungeon finder was added.
Then in Cataclysm they tried to make dungeons hard again, but the LFD system is incompatible with it, and mass QQ ensued.
The M+ is a system that easily bolts itself onto a short dungeon that is designed to scale to 3+ different difficulty levels, so M+ is simply a system that takes advantage of the damage that’s already been done. It doesn’t make the problem worse really, but it does cement it.
Megadungeons where I think WoW dungeon design should be headed. Now they just need to add optional bosses, like they did with Karazhan’s Nightbane encounter, and we’re all set.
Opinions. I liked WotLK dungeons even though until LFD was added I had only seen a couple of them. It is thanks to LFD that i could discover what an amazing game WoW is and I was so excited when i saw all dungeons while leveling my second character.
If you played back then you would know that the problem with Cataclysm dungeons was the fact that people who didn’t raid were still running around in blues since they had no way to get gear. As a result the dungeons were heavily overtuned for the majority of the players since with LFD you couldn’t choose only your raider friends to run them with.
The worst part of mythic+ system is the timer. It breeds the gogogo - skip mentality which in turn brings toxicity.Players who are not familiar with this play style are often bullied even in hcs.
I totally disagree. Mechadungeons exclude the majority of the players, take a look at statistics 2 months after operation mechagon opened only 10% of players has experienced it. What wow needs is meaningful content for more not only for selected few like it is since WoD.
At the end of the day, it’s a matter of perspective you might dream of a version of WoW accessible by few while for me it’s quite the opposite.
I hate to tell you this but you could actually explore them all along. You just chose not to.
Well, they couldn’t overgear it, but that’s not really an issue for a coordinated group that are in it together and want to work through problems.
It is a problem when it’s a group of strangers with no patience.
True, but keep in mind that the go-go-go mentality existed before M+ anyway. M+ just cements it.
I don’t dream of a WoW “accessable to very few”, what in the heck are you on about?
I’m not talking about the difficulty of Mechagon. It is a little on the high side, I’ll admit, and most dungeons shouldn’t be that hard. However I’m glad a difficult dungeon does exist - there should be a variety of difficulties, right from the very easy to the very hard.
I mean the layout. The amount of bosses, the optional objectives, the static difficulty level with no scaling, and so on. I want dungeons like this in all sorts of difficulty levels, just as Classic had its Scholomance to its Blackrock Depths. Both huge dungeons, but very, very different difficulty level.
I actually think BfA dungeons were a step back from the Legion dungeons. The Legion dungeons actually have some hidden rooms and extra quest objectives and even some extra bosses, which is really cool. Unfortunately, M+ does not afford this because who would want to do optional bosses when you’re trying to speedrun, right?
So Blizzard decided to design the dungeons around M+, which is a great shame in my view, because it took away all those cool extra hidden rooms that the Legion dungeons had.
What I’m talking about is if Vault of Wardens was still Vault of Wardens, but it was 3 times bigger, and nobody expected you to clear the entire thing in one sitting, because many of bosses would be hidden away behind quests or attunements and would be way harder than the other ones - but one day you could get in there. Apply to all dungeons and remove M+ and difficulty levels.