Survival is without doubt the best specc in 2v2
Arms loses to windwalker, outlaw and hunters normally at high rating
Enhance is prolly same tier like Fury
I don’t believe Assa is anywhere close to Survival, Outlaw, Arms and WW. Just the direct comparison between Outlaw and Assa is enough to see that one spec does belong to the highest tier for its high sustained damage, CC and many defensives, while the other pales in comparison by lack of tools. Meanwhile Sub is easily top top tier with Holy Priest. Imo Sub (with Holy) and Survival (with Rdruid) are a tier above everything else.
Can you [redacted] please stop inflating this whole thing every single time you make a new one? What is wrong with putting it as A,B,C,D… -tier? Do we need S-tier? What is the S even for? And now you want God-tier on top of it? Wasn’t the S supposed to serve that function?
I understand what you are saying, altough I feel Enhance is not as bad as you make it out to be. It might be A minus or close to be, but never C in my mind.
Arms loses to WW in a pure 1V1, but it is never a pure 1V1 in arena though.
Outlaw / Hunter are indeed very strong, but when I rate War as god tiers, it is because it has an overloaded kit with an overloaded damage capacity.
Unholy is a bit better than fury imo. Again, I’m trying to rate them in comparaison to each other, I feel I lose equally to Unholy and Frost for different reasons. Unholy has some great sustain damage but not enough burst, and frost has great burst but super predictable tho.
S tier has always been a thing on Tier lists. God tier is to make a separation between the obvious meta and specs that are obviously at a very strong state ( as much as needing nerfs.).
Survival is not a god tier spec, it is the comps that makes it god tier. While Arms can play with any healer and have great succes. ( Survival is really only GREAT with Holy/Disc Or Resto, pair it up with a shaman and it’s just a middle of the pack spec)
i would argue personal experience does not equate to real facts though.
unholy and Fury are the lowest repped in arena . enhance still almost 40% more than both
i get this is more of a personal tier list but i have to argue the facts as its disappointing no1 is talking about how bad UH dk is , particular as its my main
Yeah but you are also talking about personal experience when talking about Unholy DK’s. Do you equate Unholy ( Altough not in a great spot) on the same tier as Fury warriors, which has LESS defensive capabilities than Unholy as a whole? As Unholy, you can be very strong vs Casters, but Fury on the other hand, is paper for every class.
Enhance is like I said, an overlooked class. It doesn’t seem that bad in 2s and it’s even better in 3s.
I think Enhance suffer about the easily readable go’es, but you can always 100-0 someone if they don’t pay attention. This happends alot, a paladin trying to do his burst rotation and is back to grey screen simulator.
But hey, Tier lists are always disputed and discussed, which is in my opinion a very good thing !
I mean, It is S Tier. I explained in the video what i mean by the difference with God Tier and S tier. But I could explain it a bit here.
Arms is God tier for the simple reason that it doesn’t ask the same intensity as someone playing outlaw or Survival. As Arms, you have an overloaded kit that really, you can’t misplay except if you miss obvious spells like Spear of Bastion or blowing your cd’s for nothing.
Survival and Outlaw has such an intense gameplay, that really it is WORTH to be top 2 and 3 best specs for 2’s, but realistically, out of 100 outlaws and Survival, just a few can grasp the potential that they have.
If it’s purely a Tier list without this explanation, then I would have rated them on the same length, but felt like it’s unfair to rate Arms lower or equal to them, while the skillfloor is VASTLY different.
I mean arms is really good in 2s but its not comparable to survival / bm / outlaw that simply sh*t on every melee (tho its mostly when paired with a druid only)
It might be flashy but if you want intense gameplay you’re playing the wrong expansion.
ok now you have to stop. Please do not talk about skillfloor and hunter when talking about 2v2 Hunter has a high skill ceiling but the skill floor is really really really low
Bruh, do you compare the simplicity of an Arms warrior with a Survival / Outlaw which needs more APM than Warriors ?
We are talking about Survival hunters, It’s not a BM.
The Skillfloor is ALOT higher than what warriors need to perform, are you really going to fight me on this?
If we were talking about BM, then you are right. BUT it’s a melee tier list for 2V2.
Reminder, how many Warriors are in the Top 100 ? How many survival hunters? It’s not like Hunters are unpopular.
Gameplay wise, you really can’t fight me on this. If we were talking about raw power potential, then yes, warriors, survival and outlaws are at the same ‘‘level’’. Remember, Survival need a Holy Priest OR a Resto druid to unlock his potential ( Freezing trap into Cyclones / Fear / Stun). Warriors can play with ANY healer and be potent and reach R1.
Find me a Survival that reach R1 with a Resto shaman. It simply doesn’t happen. Because it’s not only the spec.
If we talk about COMPS, then yes, SURVIVAL / RDRUID is GOD TIER, Outlaw + Holy/disc/ RDRUID GOD TIER
But CLASS / SPEC wise, Arms are just the main offender, Let’s not even talk about 3s.
Lmao, You haven’t touch a Survival hunter and you don’t even know what you are talking about. What to Expect from a necrolord warrior that just needs to press his cd’s and press execute to have 24K executes without sweating.
Skillfloor and ceiling are def higher than ARms because Arms are litterally an EXPANSION defining SPEC, like BM is an Season defining spec ( Season 2, since season 1 we never even saw a BM )
Arms has it all.
Anyways, good conversation, just wished you gave more arguments instead of saying NAH SURVIVAL AND OUTLAW BETTER THAN MUH WARRIOR
Survival is easier than Arms? Is that what you are saying? And I am the one that should be objective?
It’s not about losing to a warrior or Survival, I frankly lose harder vs Survival or Outlaw. It’s purely that Arms is litterally an Expansion Defining Spec. They were strong from BETA to even Season 3 of Shadowlands ( which will come out and we will see everyone go Kyrian for the double lego , that’s going to be super fun, I can tell.)
Arms is the best melee, Survival has the best comp. Is it hard to understand? Survival has to be picky on his healer’s spec. War can play with ANY healer and have succes.
Anyways, Agree to disagree, you aren’t giving arguments except from saying that Hunters are ‘‘easier’’ ( Survival aint BM and isn’t MM ).
, that’s going to be super fun, I can tell.)