it wasnt obsolte. someone with it was signifiacntly more powerful then someone without them
imo all the catch up systems were always a mistake. there should have been no catch up - instead content should be tuned as if people had 0 of those upgrades and hsould be compelatable without them
al lthe AP upgrades should be turning you into little demi-god destroying everything around you . thaats how good mmorpgs should do that. and achievements like AOTC/ CE should be changed in a way that if you use them you dont obtain achievement.
Yes they do.
First it was blue items
Then epics
Then legendaries
The truth is no amount of power reward will give you a sense of progression in content which you can defeat on day 1 in green gear.
Because as you’ve said multiple times: You don’t want to be gated by challenges.
Stop applying YOUR mindset to other people.
Not everyone thinks the same and likes the same things.
I told you what I would like and want.
I speak for ME. Stop disregarding that and just accept it.
If you don’t, you’re essentially calling me a liar and I take issue with that.
I don’t think you’re lying, I think you’re not getting how a game works.
But let me make it simple:
Would YOU be OK with not being able to clear all open world content until you’ve collected most of the power upgrades you suggested, eg “world questing gear” over a course of, idk, weeks or maybe a few months? Yes or no?
Okay. So you want to be able to finish ALL world content on day 1, and then spend 5 months collecting power upgrades to make you stronger in said content while calling this “progression”.
I don’t think anything more needs to be said.
I don’t know. You can go back to check out thousands of old games made before the whole mobile phone app style “log in daily to do crap” started becoming a thing.
People still play these games to this day, or you can look at some recent games like Divinity: Original Sin. Replayability is provided by the gameplay and a lot of other factors, none of ehich force you to play it.
A game does not need mechanics like AP to force you to engage with it. That just means you are developing dependency and the moment you even think on removing it people will leave by the thousands.
You are focusing on the wrong things. Balance is a thing that is done afterwards…
When I say “hard” you can argue what hard means for you, and how flexible you want it to be. Much like Raiding has 4 difficulties, M+ has key levels…
Just imagine for a minute that the only available raid content was LFR and the only M+ content was M0 with weekly lockouts… Well open world content lives in that boring world. That is why is so stale right now.
To make great content you need A) A reward to work for, and B) a REASON to use that reward (the next level basically). C) And a challenge along the way, to feel like you are “wining”. That is how great content is made.
We can discuss if you want (B) and (C) to revitalize open world content. But not (A). A has already been proven that AP is not the answer. And we already have crests for that purpose.
I like what is there; but it’s not worthwhile to do.
The rewards stop being interesting very very quickly.
THAT is the issue with world content for me at the moment.
That is YOUR idea of great content.
Don’t apply that to everyone; because that doesn’t work.
You can leave B and C out of that equation and it can still be great content FOR ME.
And that’s where you are forcing YOUR opinion onto me.
No I will definitely discuss A because AP WAS the answer for me. I enjoyed it.
And you cannot make me change my stance on that. You are not factually right; you just have an opinion. Well, so do I. And our opinions are worth exactly the same.
It was not ‘proven’ to not be the answer.
It wasn’t the answer FOR YOU. That is something completely different.
It WAS the answer FOR ME.
And your experiences aren’t any more important and relevant than mine.
So, I suppose we’re at a stalemate.
So you want End Game rewards with out making the content “end game” ? What do you think will happen?
Maybe THIS:
So were back to BFA shenanigans. And were back to people complaining about AP farming… Its a full circle back to where we were.
Its a FACT that world quests have not changed since Legion. Like… at ALL. This is a smoking gun situation. Think…
Yes it does. That is what rated PvP, M+, and raiding have in common. Remember in SL when the rewards of a +15 (trivial content) gave Mythic level gear? People STILL played M+. It was STILL the most popular game mode. Why did so many people still push beyond a +15 key “for no real gear upgrade whatsoever”. Why is that?
Not lets look at open world content:
EMPTY. Nobody plays that.
And here is where we disagree. You have your personal opinion. OK.
And I am NOT imposing my opinion on you. I am just saying out loud an observation: 99% of the player base don’t want to play the current version of open world content. And defensively don’t like to be forced to do it.
If you dont believe me, go to the archives from BFA and look up how many posts complains about this there are. You will be amazed.
If you still don’t believe me, how many people are pushing keys beyond 20 for NO REWARD at ALL, how many people are already fully 447 geared and STILL raid?. How many people still do PvP while being full conquest?. How many people are doing world quests? NOBODY. Why is that?
So, we are discussing changing a system that affects ALL the player base, not just you.
In other words: What are we talking about here? Making a good game for ALL of us, or making a good game JUST FOR YOU?
If its the latter than GTFO.
If its the first, then I will repeat it ONCE AGAIN:
You have to admit that the MAJORITY of people do NOT like to play Open World content, because it has been the same boring thing since Legion. And adding a carrot AP system will not change the fact that its still a boring system. That is why so many people complained about it, and that is why blizz eventually removed it.
If you just sit down and understand WHY blizz removed AP, then you will understand WHY after removing AP people STILL play M+, people STILL raid… but NOBODY wants to do World Quests.
Maybe, its because World Quest (as in: kill 5 boars and report back) is boring, boring, boring. Maybe not for you. But for 99% of the player base. And that is why you are alone, sitting in whatever the main city of the new zone is (don’t even care what its called).
i love that i have nothing to do everyday with my main chars
if world quest would give anything interesting, besides useless rep/ressources/greens many ppl would do it…but its better that i can stay in valdrakken and can do nothing…i love games where i can do literally nothing and would be as good as when i would do smth
imagine crying that you can do smth for your char everyday
in my guild is the opinion, that dragonflight is worse than bfa already, because there is nothing to do besides raiding and maybe 1 m plus for an excuse to log in. There is no incentive to play the game and i dont get why ppl are defending this “nothing to do is better” idea, if you think you are forced to do “chores”, i have to ask if the most player in this forum wants famed slayer raid title or m plus title in the seasons? I have to doubt this.
The next patch is empty for the most of us, because its again another catch up for alts.
the success of classic has proven that it was him who was right. not you .
people cleared MC in first 3 hours of patch being live in greens and with multiple people not even being 60.
didnt stop those people from farming MC all the time untill TBC released.
reality is that 99 % of people - even those who do +20s dont play for chalenge. and are not interested in real chalenge. just in fast zerg of stuff and obtining shiny powerfull gear
this is something which blizzard forgot at 1 point and since then game is in constant freefall.
imagine if some form of m+ were intriducted back in cata along with lfr implementation . we could have went to 15 mln players not start dropping.
Tillers content was nice. However anything like that should be non mandatory because we dont want to have to login daily. People that want to play everyday wow should have some content like that.
No, instead they should intruduce feature we had during Fated raids “mini” season, Where you could eventualy Buy your BIS gear- Trinket, weapon etc From vendor after certain ammount of bosskills. As currently Getting BIS gear is impossible pretty much. I still Do not have Cloak From sarkareth, Stat stick trinket from experiments, Or neltharion class trinket for example. As for titanforge or warforge, Not realy a good idea. We already have better system, Gear upgrades are best feature pretty much. And Grinds like AP? Nobody liked it, not even casual players. Another Thing they could add so you can have sense of progress are Gems For every single gear slot possible like in the past, Create new Currency That drops From anything you do ingame, PVP, world stuff, PVE, Pet battles, rares, etc and you can Then buy guaranteed Sockets For your gear.
