Happens far too often. Though he might be dumb, but educating people is not your responsibility. Fixing class balance is.
ibb. co /YhkLhLQ
Remove spaces, sorry couldn’t post it any other way. if you don’t want to click it it just basically says it makes no sense for him not to take a fire mage. - the venthyr part diminishes the significance a little, but this discrimination against non-fire does happen every day .
No matter the gear, rio, achievements, etc, you get this kind of crap treatment whenever youre not playing fire. What is holding you back from giving arcane, say, a 10% damage increase? It won’t turn the world upside down, but at least it would send a message that the spec has been improved, and that should work on the community perception. Since you’re deliberately ignoring all the problems that surrounds the spec, that seems like an easy temporary fix - and don’t get me started on the covenant specific CC buff thats on PTR.
I hereby encourage all the players that face this kind of discrimination to let blizzard know about it. This is plain unexplainable that almost every spec and their mothers have received improvements while arcane has been completely ignored. Either they do not care and for them customer satisfaction is of once again zero importance, or they do not know about this problem. Let’s give the second one a try.
But i am subject to a lot of negativity aimed towards me because i don’t play fire. I don’t intend to add what happens i just want to point out to anyone that reads.
This is not isolated. It’s happening at a really broad spectrum. I hope blizzard will listen.
When both our specs (except fire) are eating dirt for a 3 month straight, because blizzards are nerfed them even before the launch of expansion - nothing can help, but great overbuff, which they will obviously not implement, because they are “care for balance” lulz
Same. Playing arcane since Legion, went through whole BFA as Arcane and I will continue playing it in Shadowlands and whatever the next expansion is.
I couldn’t care less what other people think, I hate fotm players, I hate meta slaves in any online game and I REFUSE to switch just because some dumb fire spec is at the top (again). I will keep playing my “meme” spec and I will keep doing better than most people abusing “broken” specs. Luckily for me I run my own keys so if somebody is crying about me being Arcane they can just get out and find another group.
That behaviour is completely dumb. Arcane is perfectly capable of doing +15 and even higher keys just like any other spec in the game and people saying otherwise are most likely as clueless as they can get.
The problem is Blizzard keeps “balancing” the game so every class has atleast one viable spec. Since mage class has it’s fire spec at the top, it seems that Blizz feels like mage shoudn’t have other specs viable. It’s also true for many other classes.
What they should do is TREAT EVERY SPEC AS SEPARATE CLASS. They should all be independent of each other in terms of balance. Fire is at the top? Cool but arcane is different, plays differently, hits different class fantasy and playerbase and struggles heavily at the moment. HELP IT BLIZZARD.
I’m happy for you but this is more in the direction of Arcane than frost, as frost has received some buffs lately. I still see people with “LOOKING FOR FIREMAGE
ONLY”
As if fire mages, balance druids, etc paid more for their subscription. That is not the case. Lore and Role play aside, you must treat your customers fair, as a company there is simply no excuse not to do it.
What I do not get is how giving an X% damage increase to arcane would hurt anything or anybody, what is there reason for not doing it after dozens of patches while arcane is still on the bottom of raid specs. What negative result could stem from that? I mean if differences were like 5% in performance, thats fine, but 20-30% is not.
Sry thought op was about frost for some reason. Thought Arcane did good dmg with barrage leggo? I think Arcane’s problem (outside of player perception) is that is doesn’t bring any utility that frost and fire don’t have. They bring dragons breath or constant slows, supernova baseline would be huge.
With 24 dps specs ingame… I think its literally impossible for them to make the game balanced…
For sure it should be way less broken for some classes but players will always over react to such things, you can literally see people needing a DH tank to complete a +5…
That is a community problem mostly i would say
Lol and he was probably doing a key of arround +15 right?
Its really annoying that people think that frost or arcane are trash. And its even more annoying that they think fire spec will carry their +15 key to +3 or +2.
People need to understand that every spec is capable of doing enough damage if the player has 2 important things. Experience on the content he is invited for. Experience on actually playing their class/spec. I’ve seen countless times fire mages doing a really poor job even though they have similar gear to mine. Playing a meta spec doesnt make you a good player.
And tbh, as many people stated in these forums, frost and arcane is far more forgivable on rotation mistakes than fire. So that means that a bad fire mage is more likely to do less damage than a bad frost/arcane mage.
I can only speak for Frost spec as i am a Frost mage, on AoE trash mob pull with my gear (203) we can pump up arround 11-14k dps. It just depends whether or not the tank decides to sprint arround the 4 corners of the room for no reason
On ST boss fights is where we actually doing less damage than other class/specs. But even then our dps is good enough arround 3-4k (on my gear) depending on how much movement the boss needs. If you add a second target to a boss then our dps goes arround 5-6k.
% buffs is, in every scenario and in essence, a terrible way of balancing classes. Certain classes have weaknesses and strengths. If you’re only looking at one specific part of the game, let’s say single-target, funnel fights or cleave fights when buffing a class, you end up with classes literally breaking the game.
Take Demon hunter or frost mages as an example. You do not see neither of them in the raids, simply because their single-target damage is absolutely horrendous. That being said, frost - at the moment - has the BEST funnel damage in the game. Demon hunter has some of the best, if not the best, on-demand AoE in the game.
If you buff them by a specific % in an attempt to fix their weaknesses, which might be major, they will suddenly break the game in the content or on fights on which their strengths lie.
Imagine a raid where first 3 bosses are single-target fights. That 10 % or 5 % buff might increase their damage to the point at which they’re competative on these single-target fights.
Then comes the 4th fight which is a funnel fight and all of a sudden, frost mage does 30 % more damage than every other class on said fight.
5th boss is a cleave fight and now the DH players are pulling on avg. 30 % more dps than the rest of the classes.
Balance classes with % buffs or ability tweaking on SPECIFIC abilities impacting the part of the game at which the class is TOO weak.
Exactly. Auras is THE terrible way of balancing dps classes. Frost mages in particular, they dont even need a damage buff.
They just need for Fingers of Frost procs to not consume Brain Freeze procs. It is THAT simple. That way AoE damage will be untouched, and ST damage will go up significantly.
Every time a FoF proc overlaps a BF proc we are losing 5-8k damage depending on gear lvl. And that kind overlapping happens every 2 seconds when Frozen Orb is up. And due to how Blizzard spell reduces the CD of Frozen Orb, we get alot of uptime with frozen orb.
The problem is Arcane Barrage legendary doesn’t do anything if the target is above 35% HP and the other one is kinda clunky to use cause it requires you to spam some Arcane Missiles to stack it every time before using Arcane Barrage and even if we meet these requirements we still get outdamaged by many specs. I wish we had some legendary which gave us more damage without some strange requirements. Expanded Potential which grants us free procs sounds pretty fun and cool but it’s proc rate is so low it’s simply bad.
Slow + Chrono Shift makes Arcane able to compete with Frost in slowing. Agree that Supernova should be baseline. I don’t understand why is Fire even allowed to be the only mage spec with instant AOE cc while having instant casts and many other advantages.
The real problem with Arcane is the fact that it’s the only one that actually uses mana as a resource AND is the most immobile one and all that while not even doing more damage than Frost or Fire.
I seriously don’t get it, Arcane has to stand still while casting and is the only one that has to burn it’s mana only to have it’s abilities still do less damage than other mage specs. Please somebody tell me how does that make sense?
This is the main reason why I don’t play frost. The other (not really game-breaking) is the lego setup. As fire I don’t need to choose in my setup for aoe or st - I can do both extremely well. As frost I have to choose between mediocracy or excellence but I can’t have a setup for both.
Fevered Incantation increases your crit damage in general after each consecutive crit and personaly i beleive that Blizzard didnt have AoE in mind when they designed that Legendary power. And this is one of the reasons why fire mage’s AoE damage is so high.
Tbh, i wouldnt be surprised if they redisign that power in 9.1 making it work only while combustion is active. Pretty much similar to how Slick Ice works.
Back in the day, you could define the 3 mage specs like this.
Frost - The most skillful spec to play given you have a certain rotation you have to follow to build up some incredible strong dps. It didn’t useually have much mobillity but it was compensated for with it’s “Progression” being saved for a few seconds so you could relocate and continue casting.
Fire - The most mobile spec, with the most consistent damage, (Maintained with the DOT, ignite) good in high mobility fights and had a good burst when lined up correctly with a combustion but not a super impressive burst.
Arcane - BIG BANGING BURST no to low mobility hard to manage with ressources and very fluctuating dps. Very low, to almost no consistent dps outside of it’s burst window.
As it is right now, Fire have taken the aspects of the arcane talent tree, with a big massive burst whilst still being able to move, meaning that arcane have nothing special going on.
I remember the days where arcane mages could deal damage to a crystal that then exploded for an x % of the damage done to the crystal. I didn’t play back then but i still see those day’s as the most defining days with arcane mage. Big burst, no consistency and still being welcomed because they could burst at key moments when it was needed.
That’s is it rotation, it’s resource management, allows you to have big burn windows… in theory. I do think this is the reason it’s undertuned this patch though, because of this and m+ pride buff. They were a bit scared of what Arcane could do with unlimited mana.
Na, outside of combustion it’s bad on aoe. If it hits 5 targets at the same time and one doesn’t crit you get no stacks. Inside combustion its an extra 15% dmg but thats the same as ST.
