i do have Friends too, and it took them way longer to get 200+ and it´s also a difference if the 200+ was at 1k- 1.2 or 1.6-1.8
if someone is new ofc it´s hours of guide, but it´s in every game like this
when i tried to play poe, i had to watch a 1.30 hour guide, in order to be able to play the game at all
i think in every “pvp” game u have to watch a high amount of guides, especially if the game is older, and u have players there who play the game for 15 years +
also Don’t underestimate the abilities of what classes can do, and for a new player it´s kinda overwhelming, and they struggle, because they have to learn so much what class x does
when it comes to this case, wow is kinda complicated, and also a reason why many newer players give up
I think Blizz has done everything right with Legion when it comes to casual players, but it hurt the “better” players allot, because there was close to zero outplay potencial
ofc it is
just like the game itself, i mean it´s in every game, The problem is, MMO players have very high expectations, thats why not a single new studio is trying to make a mmo, they are making mobile games instead
or having the wrong mates, playing the wrong class (what isnt for them) if i would practice to play a fmage, i know, i will never hit glad with it, cuz “caster” isnt the right class for me
it´s also an high amount of information especially when u climp higher rating, i think the most problem is just,Most players are not willing to invest a lot of time into it
I think there is enough information, on the internet, like skill capped for example, and 5 Euro for a full guide is nothing
imagine I would take a guitar course what can cost hundreds of euro.
and about the new players thing, i helped some in the past, They quickly become overwhelmed and lose interest but the main issue is, because of the gap, and because of the fact, that the game is so old, and we rarely getting new players into the game, especially for arena
it´s just unfun, to get stomped by someone, who plays the game for longer than you. it´s the same in league
what should i do against a yorick in lol top lane, who plays the game since 2014 with 15k+ games played, while i play for the first time, ofc he smacks me into the ground lol, and when this happens over and over, its a gg
it´s just bad designe currently, imagine suffering for months, or having it in the last 2 weeks allot easier, (so ofc close to nobody is playing) i hope they have a idea to change the system in a better way for the next xpac
if it will be the same system, then it´s a skull angle i guess, and i hope they dont think that adding (solo que rbg is enough and will fix anything)
Do they still exist? They’re like unicorns honestly.
I’ve just taken a glance at rating distribution and you guys are right. Things are not that bad, but yes, mathematically average rating of a player from the chart below is <1800 for sure. I’d say 1600ish? Too lazy to count.
I still can see there’s crazy many characters on 1800 compared to other brackets, meaning that everyone can achieve it if they try.
https://drustvar.com/leaderboard/solo-shuffle-stats/us - for some reason can’t paste the link with EU selected.
BTW, I would like to also mention that this graph also includes random players with 25 matches on 1300, so it’s by no means accurate.
My point was that it takes 2 hours of THEORY to improve. Not gameplay. Once you dedicate some time to understanding your mistakes, it’s just a matter of time - for some people 10 arenas, for others - 100. But improvement is inevitable if you try, that’s it.
Literally this. It is literally enough to understand below to be 1800:
I press 1 with proc - 1 hit hard. No proc - me no press 1, me press 2 - 2 hit more.
Enemy press big boonga - me press big defoonga. Me smart, me alive, my turn.
My healer bleh-bleh eating grass - me kick mage, me los, me press buttons.
That’s it, no exaggeration. Is this that hard to just sit down and understand and then try to apply?
2700 players see duelists just like above. The requirements are just a higher, but everyone can improve if they want to, instead of asking for free rating.
As someone mentioned above, it’s a lifestyle, it’s not just about the game itself.
I see people getting sh*tty wages and complaining every day instead of spending $2k and 6 months to acquire some profitable skill instead. They don’t want to improve, they want world to be “Easier” (no hate, every job deserves to be respected, just for ex. purposes)
im not a sociopath, i have no feeling about someone in a online game, except it is a Lgbtq supporter, then this guy have to be purged. im also not happy when someone is feeling bad because of me, thats why i never flame in solo shuffle
They won’t do that if you could see their address, It’s still a shame that Blizzard rejected the system because of “doxing”
and what, if a 1.5 hardstuck dk with the name “deathworgen” does that, what then?
That´s finally a good list, i have waited for that, because everyone else couldnt say “why it is, or why it isnt good to make xz”
these peoples here are saying “no mmr is fine” mmr need´s to be buffed, and call it a day
Well, I wouldn’t completely blame the players for this
The Streamer had an influence on this behavior
This Game is more of an Collecting game nowdays
Time and the mindset of the Peoples in the Game also have Changed
So the main mentality is very focused on fomo when it comes to items, with an prestige Value, because special seasonal Gladiator Mounts, or Elite Set, can only be obtained once per season
It’s literally suggested to you in streams or YouTube videos, or in shuffles, that if you don’t play a high rating you’re bad
and I don’t think anyone likes having to realize they’re not good, that just increases the pressure and frustration, especially if someone pours salt into the wound
But whats the Problem about it? thats like saying it´s a problem when u have in league of legends 4k ranks instead of 2k ranks in gold elo, because the game have more Players?
Maybe i cant see the Point but i dont know what is wrong with an Higher participation in a Game, then Add a extra Cosmetic Item, for Peoples at 2.7 and then the Elite can still feel Special?
i dont know, Many Peoples played in Mop and any kind of other xpac, i dont think ssn2 is the Main Reason, in bfa u had also Seasons with a Really bad participation even worse than dragonflight season 1 lol, i think most of the Peoples just dont play the game if it isnt Fun
and i blame Weak auras, overloaded class cd trading, andthat the game is more complex now for that. People play if they have Fun in playing the Game, but the Majority dont have fun.
i mean it´s like having 5000 Apples, but you only spend 2000 to other Peoples, and just throws the other apples in the trash
i know, that adding Inflation means, higher chance for boosters, what is a problem for new/bad players, because they are getting farmed by them BUT, they should add more inflation when we have the new expansion, because more Peoples will come back, the participation is higher etc
and sl season 2 is not an good example, because we also had other seasons, where they weren’t so inflated, but still good when it came to the mmr
Both
i mean Humans are different, some are wanting free rewards, the other ones wanting more Players to play against, and i dont know, from what i have heard, Legion, bfa or sl ssn1 glad wasnt Completely for free, but the mmr was very high that you saw on 2.2 +casuals, or new players
and high participation is all what matters for a healthy game at the end, whether in PvP or PvE
I partly agree, but the gap in Dragonflight is simply unrealistic, if they change the complexity and weak aura requirement, for sure more People will try to improve
Here an example, i know for u, it´s easy to understand, and u wont have any kind of Problem with it, but casuals, or not so experienced / talented Players do, they just should remove some stuff (ITS JUST TOO MUCH)
it´s like Math, instead of Starting with 1+1 u start instantly with stochastics, it´s just too much, and scares off many other players
I agree with you that players shouldn’t get anything for free, but it should be more realistic, in a “good world” it shouldnt be completely easy to get, but is also shouldnt feel “impossible” to get.
and if u give them nothing, they wont play, it´s a lose lose, and no i dont mean to give them stuff for free instead, but the current system does everything worse than the old one before sl ssn2, except when it comes to gearing, the current gearing system is awesome
i mean, they shouldnt handle high rewards like shop mounts, but theres are no rewards for 2.4+ player, so if u get 2.6 or 2.7 for example, or maybe 2.9 u get nothing, except a Hamburger from mc donalds, and i think they should add badass Rewards for "higher players at the 2.5-2.9 area, Maybe a Recolor of the Mount, or an extra Titel? idk just something
i wish Blizz would make a experiment to start slowely a mmr increase like 500 more spots are getting 2.1 for the enchant, as an example
Thats true, but the current situation is just bad, and i think every suggestion will have a good, and also a bad side, and you should just go for what is the healthiest solution
Players shouldn’t be as restricted as they are now, but they also shouldn’t be given a elite Mogg, 2.1 enchantment, or gladi mount like they were in Shadowlands SSN2 for free
i hope u know what i mean, like Both from our argumentation, not too much, but also not too little either
no was a good post, and i didnt suspected that, i thought u will flame me, and calling me that i have no right to post in the forum, and i should never post again
I wasn’t expecting a novel, if I’m honest with you, was a good post, with some parts i agree, with some i dont and this is fine
Sry for my Bad english, im just an russian guy, who didn’t have much English at school
ah i thought so, because close to everyone now, wants to be a youtuber, or streamer, because of easy money, The biggest wishes of children and young people is to become a You Tuber or streamer, and in my opinion this is kinda sad
The time it takes equates to your basic game knowledge + how much you play.
The longer you are stuck between 1600 and 1800, the more it means you are lacking game knowledge. Very basic one by that.
It’s not about taking hours to watch guides. The information requried for 1800 is not much. It’s a basic level of information after which you just practice
You’re mentioning other games. And I was talking about 1600 to 1800. Not 0 to 1800. Of course if you’re completely new and have no idea about anything it will take more time to get to 1800. But going from 1600 to 1800 is a complete breeze if you know what you’re supposed to do then just learning to do it.
And if those players are stuck under 1800 for 15+ years, it is likely they are not good players. No offense.
There’s no “wrong mates” for 1800. If you understand your own class to a decent level it barely matters who you are playing with to get that rating.
Now you are mentioning Glad. Stop talking so generally about everything. The difference between the 2 is like finishing 4th grade and finishing university.
We are talking about getting 1800 here, the main point of my reply.
Higher rating is not 1800. It’s casual rating for people who have basic knowledge of the game. If you don’t want to invest a few hours to learn how your class works on a basic level and want to climb RATED game modes instead of quing random BG or Skirmish, this is the player’s problem, not the game.
PvP is about PvE DMG more than ever this expansion. CC has been nerfed. So your win condition is doing maximum damage + not dying aka just pressing your defensive CDs aka looking at your health bar and the enemies you are attacking.
Once again, you want to queue a RATED game mode, you are playing against other players. If you are quing on 1600 rating and a player has played longer than you, and is on that rating, it means that player is not good either, because they’re stuck there. Which means they also don’t know most of the basics like you do.
So it all revolves around priorities.
There is nothing wrong to be a casual player. Queue up random BG.
If you queue up RATED and want RATING PROGRESSION, then you need to BECOME BETTER if you want MORE RATING. It’s that simple. Want more rating? Invest more time.
This is what people are missing. You want more rating = you have to play better. You can’t just continue playing like a 1500 player, and then get 1800, then get 2100, then get even more. People want it to be like that, just like Shuffle was in Season 1, but that’s not how it should work.
The people who are 7 time challenger or rival with an elite in DF S1 or SL S2 are complete casual players, who got a taste of the forbidden fruit, undeserved achievements.
That a trick question ? Should I care what any random internet stranger thinks of me ?
Then what ? It doesn’t change a thing. Right now the last fixed rating reward is 2400, so people complain they can’t get it easily enough. If you increase mmr dor everyone and add a reward on 2700 then many more people get the 2400 reward, and all these people who complained about the 2400 reward being too hard now complain about the 2700 one being too hard.
People who like to have it easy will always complain that they aren’t given the next thing.
Well, it will always feel impossible for some since skill level is a very wide spectrum. But I do get your meaning.
Definitely.
That’s the entire issue right, the healthiest approach isn’t the same for everybody, and no one really knows what’s best, in the end. Hence all these discussions !
Eh, I’m not really doing that.
Mmh, the thing is, it’s not as easy as it looks because the only people who get “easy money” out of it are the ones who had great success. No one remembers all the unknown ones who tried, and failed (with various degree of effort). And lets say you succeed, then you are a little bit … trapped ? Into it. That’s not really my wish.
For good players (not exceptional good) glad should be accessible via lfg, which is currently not the case.
Since BFA there were seasons, with glad being way to easy and other seasons were it was too hard.
SL S2 glad is equal to 1900 today. Those gaps should never exist.
Yeah but if he have 1k + Games played and still stuck at the Rating, and cant see any Imrpovements the player quickly becomes frustrated
and the current 1.6-1.8 are not as easy at it was some Years Ago, because the Gap is smaller between the Mmr, also Players are Better, etc
i Helped in the past allot of my Friends, who were pve players because I used to be a pve player
and trust me, most of them do.
the basic level is alone to get some Addons, clear your Interface, and Imagine this guy is clicking, and dont even have Keybinds, like many Pve or new Players
i think, it took me 5 Guides, and 6 Hours to make a Interface, ofc this is an extreme example, cuz i made every Weak aura myself, + i Play with Plater
but you shouldn’t underestimate it, and About videos, the 10/12 Minute Skill capped Videos on You Tube are not enough
except u get the “private” Videos for 5 Euro, what Takes 30 min- 1 Hour if i am right
i mean ofc, when u give some “newer player” the class Warrior, Dh, Bm Hunter, it will be allot easier for him “to learn, how to dmg” but i dont think he will Make easily 1.8 atleast in this Season
when it comes to Dragonflight S1 Solo shuffle, i do agree
but 2s is currently deflated, 3s, solo shuffle even more
Was an example, because i was a “New” player in this Game
Ah this Makes Sense, 1.6 to 1.8 is doable unless the person is playing double dps, yeah the gap between 1.6 and 1.8 is pretty fine
yeah in this case, skill capped short videos are enough i think, if the guy have a basic knowledge to reach 1.6
yeah ofc, it´s kinda sad, a friend of mine calls them in league talentless people D:
i dont know how it is in Wow, cuz i dont check pvp peoples at placement games, or low mmr
so i couldnt say how big the gap between someone who only played for 2 Seasons compared to someone who plays for 15 years, so mind 10-15 seasons really is, if the player couldn’t improve
In League the Gap between Silver, Gold, platinum in eu west is really big, because u have players in low elo, who have played the game for years, and most likely over 5-15k games played (the untalented players who have gained more basic knowledge of the game over the years than someone who is just starting out)
but i think in the most cases in wow it should someone take 1-3 Seasons to go from 0 to 1.6 and if he is good in understanding maybe in the first 1-2?
ehh, for a newer player, yes they are. i played 2 Weeks ago j4f, on my Dh in 3s With an Destro Warlock, he had 1.5k Xp as an Destro, he did in those games Less dmg, than a mindbender from the Disc Priest. i had 30 Mio, while he had 750k at the end. even when i was a 1.6 Andy, in mop I had mates who weren’t carryable, i would say close to impossible, and in lower ranks it’s so much worse and also more toxic, A lot of people leave there after a lose (nightmare experience for any new player)
if you have xp and want to carry someone, then yes, otherwise if u start at 1.6, and have the same xp than a 1.6 Player, and are forced to play with mates who leave after 1-2 games, it can be rough.
if u play with a mate who have the same xp as you, but wont stick with u and leave after 1-2 loses, the nightmare continues.
And torturing yourself out of your rating is a painful exercise for a new player
i was in Mop at the start a 1.6 Hardstuck Disc priest, until i found after 2 or 3 Seasons a Feral Druid who was good, and didn’t leave the game after 2 games
2v2 EU
1800+ - 17699 (25.214 %)
1600+ - 40637 (57.892 %)
1500+ - 52820 (75.248 %)
3v3 EU
1800+ - 10163 (27.499 %)
1600+ - 20699 (56.007 %)
1500+ - 27681 (74.899 %)
i wouldnt say 1.8 is casual rating, atleast in Df not when we compare it with other xpac´s
i dont think it is just few hours, and also u rely on your mate, this game isnt a single player game
i mean yeah, was in Legion the same (even easier) in bfa in 2s too, in Sl it was too, but worse cuz of the "gear difference, a 1.8 player on 1.8 mmr had better gear, than a 1,6 player who is playing to get the 1.8 gear, but this is anyway a different story xd
i get your point, but see it like this 1.4 in Bfa/Sl is 1k now
but they also have a advantage over you, and maybe he is on that rating because of worse mates, or because of a “friend” and he´s trying to help him, (i did it in shadowlands to help a friend for example) (atleast they fixed the mmr a bit, so u cant do that to some extent anymore)
i dont know what to tell you, i can tell it to you only from a other Game pov, where I am a new player and im getting Smacked at Gold by an Yorick player
i think my last 10 game history is 2/11/1 Kda, cuz i getting Completely dominated at Top lane, by Players who have played 15/20k Games, while i have only played 50 Games overall like LMAO (and i think the same is in wow, to some Extent? in low elos?
i mean ofc, it´s true, but i want to add a objective opinion from friends who are not so good at the game^^
and why they “have quit, or dont try it anymore”
Theres are such TOO ← many barriers
Button bload, Addons, not many new players in pvp especially in Arena, That means the competition is much bigger, so u have to be waaaay better, than some years ago if u want the rewards now.
ngl i can understand why no new players, or pve players are trying to play pvp to get their set^^
Didnt know that Full Myth, M+ 25-28 gamers are Casuals
That´s not a Problem, Once you’re in the gaming scene, everything is fine but the barier to enter the Scene is, idk
like i said, it have a reason why most of the players avoid Arena^^
i dont know, i would be a friend, of an “Ai” System in the future, for Peoples who wants to play (practice) in Arena
Like an Extra Arena mode, Where you don’t get any rewards, but you can simulate with bots up to a simulated 2k mmr level, I also know players who don’t try arena because they don’t want to bring anyone down, they know they’re not good, and in a Skirmish, u dont Learn anything. and Bg is also “too” casual
and i Mean, if we can practice against, Schübert bot´s it would be Helpful for newer/ pve players or no?
The player becomes frustrated because he is not looking to improve his gameplay
The player thinks his rating will automatically go up if he just plays 10000 games with the same information and gameplay
False.
Basic level of Information . Aka understanding your own class and the other classes. on a basic level. People clicking and not having keybinds is something they need to fix much earlier, even before they start PvP in general.
Once again, I am talking about 1600-1800 which you initially talked about.
Almost every spec guide on YouTube is around 15 minutes for PvP.
My point exactly.
Play simpler comps in 3v3 on low rating. Caster players on low rating require more time to learn to play. There is definitely a large difference between a low rated melee and a low rated caster. The thing with casters is, they are harder to master but more rewarding once you do. A Warlock main on high rating controls the game, same goes for Mages, Moonkins, etc.
This is because of the influx of players in Solo Shuffle. Most of the casual players play Solo Shuffle. It’s more boring of course, way worse for learning etc, but they do because most people don’t feel like interacting with others to play 2v2 and 3v3.
A great majority of those 1600 or under people you see in 3v3 or 2v2 have already done 1800 for the season, in Shuffle, which requires less brain function by default.
Yes. But there needs to be a spot between “getting rewards and ratings for basically free” and “needing 50000 things to even start playing”. It’s neither right now, but the UI barriers and requirement for 3rd party things is the biggest realistic barrier.
Where did I mentioned dungeons or raids here? The point is that those seasons ratings were meaningless and not even close to reality. It’s literally comedy to see people stuck on 1700 for years suddenly on 2400 rating because of the unrealistic inflation. And the reality comes back down like a popped baloon the next season when those same players are back on 1700, but now write “2400xp” and have an ego created from that bloated season.
i dont know how u can say false, if it is mathematically correct, if there were more players back then, especially that MMR was more inflated, like in Legion
It’s logical that it’s more difficult than it was a few years ago
i mean yeah, but I think most people who are starting out or are new don’t know this
but wait, solo shuffle is more deflated than normal 3v3
If i think correctly, that means that the community is even more divided, so u have most of the casuals in solo shuffle, and not in 2v2/3v3 anymore, and they dont play anything except shuffle, + sod was a also huge factor or no?
and the "normal players are playing most likely 2s/3s and barely solo shuffle, or no shuffle ?
i agree on that
i know peoples with the 7time challenger, or rival and they are not “casuals” I think we have a different definition of casual
i mean if we take only pvp, i wouldnt say casual either, theres some peoples with 1500-1400 wins and loses, and i wouldnt say they are casuals, there are glads that are also casual
I would just say that they are talentless when it comes to PVP or just take longer, i just know peoples who are doing Myth m+ 25/28 but struggle in pvp at 1.6+ : d
they are still not casual for me, when they are playing the game many hours per day
hm, i noticed it only on the us forum, and us playerbase, with the ego thing, happend to me, but tbh im not that much in solo shuffle, or lfg around currently
yeah i mean the ego 2.4 xp is not new if im be honest with u, it wasnt that extreme since ssn2 before, but it was still there
because of the tbc-cata glads, some peoples with 1.6 max rating got the tbc or wotlk glad drake, because they played on a rp or pve server
they are really on 1.7? i thought they are on 2k or something
i mean i dont care about the rating from the other players anyway, except some sl ssn2 ego peoples are flaming me or 1,7 players who have a Dunning Kruger effect
https://imgur.com/a/HglYKwb i mean if i see players like this, i just feel bad for them man
I like a lot your point of view is something I say all the time. The multi main-alt easy lvl - gear. You play against same players in very rating. And what’s the point of rating? One example I can give is you can see one comp “x” with “x” players playing at 2700 log out log in at 2500,2100,1800 Cr-mmr.
Even though I should know better, I can’t help but comment on some of these things.
In my opinion, this is not a compelling consequence. Boosting and “coaching” are phenomena that appear when there is something to be gained that is worthwhile.
But let’s assume that it is worthwhile: they are phenomena that have always existed and increase proportionally with participation.
In other words, a perceptual effect that you will always have if participation is high enough.
On the one hand, I think that inflation regulates itself according to participation. In an active season, it is not necessary to pump a massive amount of additional MMR into the system, as the system will need it automatically anyways to place every player properly accordingly to their “skill level”.
But let’s assume that you are right about both negative points. What is the alternative? Do nothing and lose more and more players? How exactly does it help participation if players leave in droves because they can’t achieve their goals? If they can’t get the achievements no matter how hard they try and how much time they invest?
With some people I get the impression that the game is their life, but I if I may quote myself from another thread:
People won’t buy and play A GAME that is more frustrating than fun!
These are at least my thoughts about it, so personally I prefer a MMR buff, if that helps the participation.
It is true. But the easier you make it to perform, the more of it you will see (for the same participation, of course).
Yes, when Blizzard doesn’t mess with it. If people play more, inflation happens and this is good, I’d be the biggest supporter of that sort of inflation, because it’s inflation coming from the fact that the game is played by many. It shouldn’t be the other way around, in my opinion, else people play less and less when not given their “free” extra rating (you know, with the knowledge that it will happen so no need to sweat etc).
I do not have an ideal solution that would fix every issue to offer you (if I did, I’d have said so and most likely people who are paid to think about it would have thought about it), but it shouldn’t take a PhD to understand the long-term implications of massive MMR injection on the average playerbase. Every single season, earlier and earlier the same complains are going to arise, asking for it yet again because it will be the new norm for every person who cannot achieve anything without it and doesn’t want to put effort in the competitive part of the game. If you feed an animal everytime it is hungry, it won’t go hunting all of a sudden, it will expect food from you and demand it more and more. The human brain works the exact same way, our species isn’t above some very basic principles.
2 hours of learning? Maybe to setup addons?
I dont know even where to start - all spec offensive, defensive skills have to learn so can react properly ect.ect. Its may take 2 hours to make a list what have to learn.
WoW pvp aint easy. Obviously for players with 1000k+ hours played its may be easy.
Well, it also shouldn’t take a PhD to understand the positive part about it and everything that helps participation is currently welcome.
Not that I wouldn’t take a better solution, make the game more fun again beginning with class design, but until then we need every help we can get to keep the player base we have.
Maybe I am the only one seeing it, but from my point of view PvP is just a stone’s throw away from the fatal stab. From the point of no return, where you could fix all issue and make it the ultimate fun, but nobody is left to play it.
They did the same to solo shuffle to pseudo boost popularity of regular arena and they achieved the same there. People don’t play because they don’t see any improvement to their rating. When they play they mostly risk losing cr because you need basically a 70% winratio to push. At some point, you can’t even push any higher because the mmr is indirectly capped!
We should avoid that with any cost and mmr injection would help with that. I mean, even the awc winner say so. Raiku, Lontar, Cdew and so on, when I recently watched their streams, they all said to their chat that they would love to see a mmr buff.
That could be true, but still better than nobody complaining because there is nobody left playing the game!
A bit, yes. And it’s not only that not anybody is left, it’s also that the mindset has changed. I firmly believe that what happened in BfA, starting with the Gladiator cutoff change, then S4 with inflation, then SL S1 and S2 ha profondly changed the way people view the ladder, and now expect a lot when it comes to rewards because for a time they’ve been led to believe that it was their “skill level mark” when in truth it was just a system change into huge inflation.
Now, if you made the game perfect many people would still manage to be like “wtf, mmr is bugged I’m a 2600 player and I struggle on 2200 today” when the guy was 2600 as DH in BfA S4 and then 2600 as DH in SL S2.
True, so we need to adapt to it. The damage is done, trying to ignore it and hope it will fix itself isn’t working!
You blame the players and their expectations, but maybe look at it this way. When you would play a class and comp that isn’t good per design anymore, so you are losing to people you used to win against and you can’t push any higher with that class/comp anymore, then you won’t have fun and ask for buffs or swap to another class. You do anything to have fun again and in the worst case, you quit the game and play something else that is fun!
It is the same for people with mmr. They don’t have fun currently. The class design often is unfun, the meta often enough is unfun for the majority while only a minority enjoy it. When they can’t push rating on top of it, because the participation and therefore the mmr is so low and capped, what will happen?
I also don’t see the issue when people play at 2600 and being happy instead of 2200 and being mad. What exactly is the issue?
Right now (as of writing this post) there’s a total of 2578 characters in EU in Solo Shuffle at 2400 rating or more
Right now there’s a total of 1491 characters in EU in 3v3 at 2400 rating or more
Right now there’s a total of 402 characters in EU in 2v2 at 2400 rating or more
This is all public info, just go to checkpvp to see for yourself.
For 1800 it would take me longer to go through countless pages, which I can’t be asked to do, but it’s the same trend overall with even more difference in numbers.
No, they are casuals. Challenger is the second lowest rank in the game. This is like being Silver in some other games when the ranks would be Bronze > Silver > Gold > Platinum > Diamond > Master / whatever > 1 more rank if it exists
So for example in another game (which doesn’t really happen), if you see a guy who has been Silver for years, suddenly Diamond rank, going back to Silver again, you would assume some suspicious things are going on and that the one time much-higher rank isn’t very real
This is normal. PvE is infinitely easier than PvP. Which is why it’s more popular by a huge margin. In PvE, you’re doing the exact same thing, over and over and over again. You know exactly what is going to happen every single time.
Funnily enough, PvP on higher rating is very similar to this in that regard. If you know how an enemy class or team comp works, there’s very little things you can be surprised about. E.g PvP on higher rating is very scripted. On lower rating you don’t know what to expect, because a good majority of the players there don’t know what they’re supposed to be doing.
Example 1 of a more PvE-dmg oriented comp: You’re a melee facing DH / Destro warlock / Resto Shaman on high rating. You trinketed for pressure and uptime. The enemy team is training your caster teammate all game. The Dh / Destro / Resto shaman team knows you don’t have trinket. You’re pushing in on the enemy warlock + shaman healer. If the players are good, they perform the extremely scripted play of using 5 second Lightning Lasso stun on you, their DH coming back and you getting deleted in 1 stun.
The above is a scripted play that is being done by nearly every Resto Shaman team that has a melee + caster on good rating. It literally won some AWC final games. So the moment you do trinket offensively, you can expect this to happen, similar to a PvE mechanic. So should your team and cover you so you don’t die.
Example 2 of a setup comp (even more obvious and scripted): You’re playing against Ret paladin / any Hunter spec / Priest on high rating (even mid rating). Every single game, every like 20-25 seconds, your healer will get Freezing trapped, and the kill target of your team will get stunned by the Ret paladin and both will burst your team’s kill target DPS player. So your team has to approriately kite, trade cds or pre-use something or avoid the traps somehow.
So PvP is also very, very scripted. Everybody on decent to high rating does the same thing, the same DPS rotation, usually the same CC rotation and usually hit the same kill target spec. It’s just more situations and more things you have to learn, and the problem is there is no obvious way in the game to learn them except by playing and watching others play.
Which already means that it is more deflated because shuffle has more than double as many players than regular arena.
You can also see it when you compare the average rating of the top 50/100/200 players of each ladder. For example is #1 in shuffle 2835, #50 of shuffle is 2758, the average somewhere around 2780-2790. In 3s even #50 is above 2800.
So ya, shuffle is definitely more deflated than regular arena.
They’re like unicorns honestly.