I haven’t heard of a single top competitive pve player or guild that was interested in non world buff speedruns.
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I mean, I did speak in a more broad term, but I think competitive raiding will also be more fresh, given the content is being made harder. It will also serve as new grounds for theorycrafting new routes.
I don’t really see why would anyone be interested in doing 1hr ish bwl speedruns, and really, not a single known speedrunning guild has expressed any interest in the fresh. And I don’t see how the hp/damage buffs will affect the first clears, everything will still die on the day people hit 60.
What is so fresh about running MC again except this time the bosses have 10 % more HP? I don’t get it. We did this already. Except we had access to world buffs to make it more exciting and reduce the clear time. It’s just going to be the same thing except more boring. I have no idea how anyone could look forward to raiding the same raids except everyone in the raid is significantly weaker. That, is a mystery to me. I’d love to be proven wrong though. If anyone who is against world buffs plays this season of Classic in all phases without quitting, then I’ll be pleasantly surprised.
agreed! to each their own ofc but even the ppl i know who are happy about this, when i asked them why they didnt go without WBs in classic they said ‘cause dps is omegalul’… and now they think theyre gonna enjoy that omegalul damage on the same boss they refused to run 3 months ago, but with extra hp so its the same boring raid taking twice as long…
i think some romanticizing is at play tbh
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The content is not harder. At best it will be slower. So : worse.
enjoy your 4 hours MC lol.
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All this crowing about harder vanilla will be hilarious in Naxx. I can imagine the average raid having a really fun time dropping 500g a night on Loatheb attempts and having nothing left by week three.
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I think many things will improve for competitive play. With much longer bossfights comes a higher need for good players. More things can go wrong when the fight lasts 4 minutes instead of 2. Perhaps even some gear or class metas will change slightly. More viable hybrid classes and Mp5-focused gear becomes more relevant for example.
No it does not become relevant, no warrior meta is still a thing. No not mp5, just less potential mistakes and less pushing the limit, less chainpulling, less chances of overagro, playing less with threat-mitigation balance on tanks. Dull raidenvrironment with lowered apm.
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As someone who has played on two of the larger and more popular vanilla private servers where one had normal boss stats and the other had at least 3x (Feenix, Warsong, 2012-2015), i can tell you that things do change. And it does become a lot harder to the point where some guilds can’t do it. And that was with world buffs and less functioning boss mechanics.
Never said nothing changes, especially under those conditions. Also, harder in numbers does not equal harder in effort. You can design bosses so that they 1-shot, which makes it really ‘hard’. It is about number of actions and variability. Something which definitely decreases with rage-starved warriors. Because yes you still want 20+ warriors
Ah yes, just what we want. Harder raids. We already have TBC and Retail for that. Why must you ruin Vanilla too?
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Indeed, things will change and no-one can say for sure to what extent. But fury warriors being the class that scales the greatest with stat increases this will likely be an indirect nerf to them especially, compared to, lets say, frost mages. Particularly in the early to mid-game (raiding.)
I’m not personally hoping for very hard raids. But i think the meta of breezing through Naxx floating on all the buffs in less than one short evening is not as it should be.
??
Naxx had actually the best difficulty tuning I ever saw for a raid.
It was just hard enough so you had to take it seriously, but not hard enough that dedicated dad guilds couldn’t beat it. It took months of progress for mid-core guilds to finish it. At least half of them didn’t manage to beat it, and those who did felt like badasses. It’s the perfect difficulty.
In game design, the point of difficulty is not to stop players from beating the game. That’s bad game design if this is your goal: players aren’t your enemies. The point of difficulty is that players need effort and focus to beat the game (so they feel rewarded when they do it), but can do it without sacrificing their life to the game (or you didn’t made a game but a job). Naxx was on point. Not too difficult, but not too easy : Naxx was perfect raiding experience.
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And haven’t we allready do this before doing this? I mean we did it in 2005 beforing doing it in 2019 and despite that fact people still wanted to do it in 2019 so your point isn’t really valid if you look at it from that pov. People still want to do it in 2021 despite doing it in 2019 let them do what they want it’s a free world.
People want to do vanilla again, not retail minus.
Actually new content in vanilla’s style would surely make the most customers happy (and wanting to pay for it). We won’t have that ofc.
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There wont most will just raid for loot and never come back in the form of pug or join a random raiding guild cash out dkp and call it a day or use Gdkp to get what they want. In any case competition will just die, its not responding to competitive crowd, it just responds to minimum effort max gain crowd, ppl complain for raid logs even if they had to get wb and prepare for the next raid, now ppl will simply only jumping in 10 min b4 raid invites go out coz there wont be anythin else to do… wb made world move around, i can see 0 reason some1 go to dm/felwood/stv now, raid loggin gonna be even worse now. Its just “lets reduce-remove mandatory raid preperation so we can finally get access to a raid and get effortless loot”, those ppl totally dont care to compete.
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Guess I don’t see the appeal in doing MC again but without buffs meaning you do a lot less damage and the trash takes longer to get through etc. But of course to each their own. Ideally we’d all be able to enjoy the game in the way that we derive the most enjoyment from.
Not a single person i know from the competitive speedrunning community will play without world buff. The non world buff section of warcraft logs was dead all of classic, Nothing will change… Blizzard is alienating the whole competitive community with one stupid dumb change, Enjoy your DOA game.
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