They are removing buffs and debuffs completely from the game?
No?
You can track your buffs and debuffs with the default frames just fine. Donât be ridiculous.
Problems occur when they do something weird or unintuitive.
My default frames are at the top of the screen at the right (next to the mini map). This is why we use WAâs for our procs and stuff.
Move them, then.
As to your procs, the new cooldown manager has custom proc handling. Set it up how you like.
Why do i want to move a box with 25 buffs to the middle of the screen? How am i able to find that 1 buff that i need to see?
(but to be fair, i didnt even know we were able to move the buff/debuff box)
You can move everything these days with the edit mode, itâs not as bad as it used to be. I never bothered looking at it since I was using ElvUI, but did look at it yesterday and you can do alot with it to customise it.
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Oh, I thought you were talking about party buff frames.
Yeah, they need to clean up buff icons big time.
I hope they do!
But WHY should we asses the situation? If we know already its going to fail?
I absolutely get what you say. But you dont understand what I say.
On your link. What do I see? I see a debuff that is a small icon with 2 fireballs. What in godâs name is that? And then a little circle on the top right. Are those linked? Or is it nuke+dispel?
AND⊠its a multi-colored raid frame. With multi-colored boxes. And multicolored icons. Find the important stuff there. I cant see anything!
I just grabbed ONE example online. https://ibb.co/Wp4SG77Y
You can clearly see missing health on the bars. You CLEARLY see what you can dispel (one box is colored purple). And since that is VohDoo, any debuff that you cannot dispel appears as a simple box (the same for any debuff) with a timer that includes itâs duration.
DONE. There are only TWO icons you care about. If the box turns purple, dispel. If a small icon appears, start ST healing for X seconds.
I cannot stress this enough. A raid, or a high key is NOT the place to start looking for weird icons in a multi-colored frame. ESPECIALLY when there are swirlies all over the place.
I have ALWAYS said that the problem with new players and healing is that when a new player tries healing, he is presented with that garbage raid frame UI. He cant dodge swirlies properly. He cant react to damage properly. People start dying. He gets frustrated and ditches healing.
And I swear itâs not that difficult. All Blizzard has to do is get Cell/VohDoo/Healbot UIs and implement those as they come in their default settings. Thatâs IT.
Good luck tracking tank busters and white swing timers. You will miss Plater for that.
Try healing for once. Someone getâs hit by something, and a 2s cast time of a spell == dead person.
There is this thing called âproactive healingâ that needs a healer to see things before they happen.
Right⊠do you know how many times I have wiped in the 1st pack of Priory because 2 AoE spells, that individually just chunk 50% of your HP (no big deal)⊠but happen simultaneously back to back⊠causing wipes?
You put 5 of those at the same time and you are GUARANTEED to have overlaps. Overlaps that WILL 1-shot people.
Its literally the problem we have TODAY. And healers have such power in order to overcome said overlaps. Take that power away (and WA to prepare for such events) and timing keys will become a roll of the die.
And sure. You can list a whole bunch of solutions to that problem. I have suggested my own as well. But NONE were implemented in 4 years. What makes you think they will magically solve that problem in Midnight?
No. Bosses in M+ are fine. If I wanted to do complicated bosses I would raid.
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I donât agree that we know, and I want things to change very badly. I donât like the current state of our rotations at all. I think itâs completely ruining PvP and itâs doing serious damage to PvE as well because so much of my mindshare is being spent on something thatâs monotonous.
They are linked. The icon on the top right indicates thereâs a magic buff on the target.
For me, missing health should be darker. I canât see the who I can dispel at all; I donât see the timer and I canât see simple box. I think what Iâm looking at it is⊠well, 2 players I canât even see anything about them, 6 are out of range, one of them is DC I think and so is another player. I appear to have three targets wth, and Fleshkiller is nearly dead and AFK. It looks like I have 4 targets?! No debuffs are being shown at all. And yay, I can see the mana bar of a frigginâ warrior ⊠?! Wait, no - thatâs a magic debuff timer? What does brown mean?
I hate it. xâD Absolutely detest it, I wouldnât play with that in a million years.
Whatâs weird about a blue icon to indicate a magic effect?
Boss yells or casts as theyâre about to come out.
Hopefully not in Midnight!
Still possible!
Well, they spent the last 4 years claiming there wasnât a problem but have probably been thinking there was one for 2 and are now doing a huge dump on us, idk.
Iâm going to disagree with that. I think most of them are dreadfully boring⊠
It doesnât have to be multiphase or anything, but I think several could tolerate a bit of spice. Not so much in the start of the season I guess, but they keep nerfing them.
me ? thats not true though . since DF i have been taking extensive 2-3 months breakd from playing wow - especialy in S1 of DF i barely did KSM very very late in season because of how garbage it was . i have never taken such long breaks in past before that time .
the last time game was trully enjoyable for me was in SL - sicne then it was pure downward spiral - sprial proven by the participation ratios which are shade of it former selt from Legion - SL era .
also who was right ? i was right - look at tuning of current season compared to S1 
Are we talking about addons or rotations? We can change the subject if you want. But hey⊠dont take my word for it. Take his:
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/9lVscdgl0wo
I call BS that blizzard will be able to deliver a half-decent UI by Midnight.
Right⊠so DOUBLE the stupid information. Colors within colors, inside an instance full of colors and swirleis. With ret palas doing their disco showâŠ
No thanks. Like I said. A raid or a high key is not the place to play âfind Waldoâ with debuffs. And debuffs is just ONE thing healers have to deal with. The rest of the stuff⊠wowâŠ
My point exactly. Each and every one of us has an opinion on how we want to see our UI. Blizzard delivers just ONE garbage. Which nobody likes.
And that is what makes VohDoo and other addons so powerful. You can color things the way you want. The way that works best for YOU.
So far⊠all I have seen blizzard do is implement that GARBAGE of raid frames. With GARBAGE click-on-frame macros. With GARBAGE customization.
In fact. Its the same UI they did in DF. And in 4 YEARS they managed to do ZERO improvements. ZERO. Its embarrassing.
And in 6 months they want to do something as good as Cell? Ridiculous.
That you dont care what type it is. All you care is: âcan I dispel that or notâ.
FIRST:
The icon at the bottom left corner will appear with ANY debuff.
So for example, in a Raid. Tanks usually get some dot that sais âif you get hit again you die, so the other tank better taunt the bossâ. You see that one too.
If the tank gets that, PLUS a debuff. He will get TWO icons. So for example, the âtwo fireballâ in your picture, PLUS something else.
You have to know what is the ICON for important stuff, and irrelevant stuff. Because you have to know what to do. Dispel? Heal? Ignore? Who knows! You BETTER know the icon of every single ability that happens in a whole dungeon/raid.
And there are a lot of them. Thatâs what addon devs do. They sieve through all that mess and condense it to âwhat matters and what dosentâ.
SECOND:
Not only you got the bottom left icon. On top you got the top right icon. Which tells you what the debuff is.
In your example, it happens to be magic. What would happen if its a Disease or a bleed? Well it will ALSO show up. So now, you have 10 different icons that can appear. Each indicating something different. Dispel. ST heal. Or ignore.
And all this in a multi-colored frame. With numbers and names and stuffâŠ
I already said what a propper healer UI looks like:
Thatâs it.
Boss? I am talking about packs. Good luck with those.
You and many others. If the UI is going to be this garbage.
How exactly? Targeted Spells WA will not work. WA as an addon will not even exist anymore.
If they were that easy, nobody would be wiping to bosses in Floodgate for example. But apparently, itâs the most dangerous place in the whole dungeon.
To nitpick on a post i mostly agree with; I do want to know it is blue or purple or green or whatever. Example like on the first pack of Dawnbreaker there is blue and purple, and you have to dispell blue as fast as possible. The purples are bait for the healer.
Absolutely. But if your class cannot dispel curses it wont even appear at all.
In the base UI it shows up. As a tiny box on the bottom left and top right. Regardless of your capabilities to dispel it.
In addition. One of the things âtargeted spellsâ WA did was show the debuff of the mini-bosses.
How many times has someone died in DB in the 2nd mini-boss (the one with the orb) because the orb exploded, AND he had the ST nuke de-buff on him? That dosent show up in the base UI.
And on a +14 and above, you absolutely need to prepare for that. Some seconds prior.
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Both. Itâs a package imo.
If they mess up the UI for the new combat, itâs all broken.
If they keep the complex class rotations but remove addons, itâs all broken.
If they keep the addons but simplify the game, itâs going to be way too easy and I wonât get the gameplay I was hoping for. A lot of people will probably feel the same and quit; itâs all broken.
Their success are deeply linked, and 95% (ok made up number, but vast majority) of the complaints I see are related to people thinking they have to play their current rotations with no WeakAuras.
Obviously Blizzard are going to have to respond ASAP if the game cannot be played; and this time they canât just fall back on us to fix it for them!
I think the primary difference between our positions is I am confident in allowing them to give it a shot. Youâre not. The rest of our differences stem from that.
The secondary difference is that you want the game to continue solving things like working out whether to dispel or not, or predict what is about to happen so you can respond in time. I think it shouldnât. I think you should learn the abilities, learn the mechanics, figure out what to look for and dispel accordingly. Thatâs part of learning the mechanics.
So⊠why donât you just quit? I see you constantly on the forums whining about stuff. You obviously donât like the game anymore, only thing you seem to enjoy are your «dvelves» pugged with a full group so you can get it over with asap (the same delves you claimed would be dead after 1st week of expansion until you noticed m+ was too hard for you).
If you canât let it go, what makes you think most players will let it go due to these changes? Most players probably donât even use addons or do endgame pve above LFR and heroic dungeons anyways.
Anyways, this is off-topic. Ofcourse some people will quit over these things, Iâm one of them if it turns out bad. But most of them? Nah, most of players will continue feeding into their fomo and addictions and adapt to the changes.
I am not talking about playing our rotations with WA. Its not the topic of conversation.
I am talking about tracking encounter events with WA. They are critical to a proper healer gameplay. So basically, a healer executes a rotation (simple, or complex, dosent matter) as a result of the encounter.
And yes. They have been talking about simplifying encounters so they dont need WA to be played optimally. However⊠there are some things that simply cannot be nerfed further.
You cannot simply nerf dispels for example. If they hit too hard and cant track them, its bad design. If they hit too little, then they are not a mechanic at all!
Plus. As I said before, they are only talking about raids for the moment. M+ has been forgotten. And its INEVITABLE to have 1-shots in M+. Unless⊠they turn the whole dungeon into some sort of Vanilla âwailing cavernsâ with only white hits.
They could also nerf the damage. OK sure. But then we are back to SL healers and and 4 DD partiesâŠwhere healers were a burden more than anything else.
So I have a feeling that when it comes to healing, they are getting themselves into a corner they cannot escape.
I might actually play feral in midnight with the way things look now, adaptive swarm is finally gone and bloodtalons is gone too.
Especially with adaptive swarm gone. God, I hate that ability.
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Just need to kill Convoke now and Iâm in heaven.
Well, then track it. You have to understand that part of the idea here is that the addon IS NOT going to do it. The âcrappy UI that doesnât give me the info the way I want itâ problem is the point. We want you, and everybody else, to stop looking at Grid or VuhDo as your one stop shop to figuring out literally everything, and if that makes healer gameplay too hard, make the encounters easier for healers by reducing incoming damage relative to health pools.
Thatâs a load of nonsense; especially in a game where your output comes from burning mana quickly and not from CDâs, as will be the case. (Well, assuming they do what they say theyâll do - thatâs always the assumption here isnât it)
Thatâs not true either, unless we consider that theoretical +23 where it does anyway cause it just scaled that far - and you know what I donât? I donât give a damn.
We cannot design the whole game around the top 0.5% of players. Everybody else goes insane.
SL healing was great, but DPS had too much selfhealing.
There was already a healer shortage galore, wonder if this will make it even worse
Stop being so stubborn. Play a healer for once in your life because you keep thinking that a healer is a DD. It is NOT.
What is the job of a healer: Heath bar goes down. Do something to get it back up. Literally THAT. Its our main job.
And there are nuances. WHOâS bar goes down. Its also important. You need to know the target of your heal.
Hence⊠the party-frame mini-game healers play.
You are asking us to stop focusing on our main JOB, the main area of gameplay and look at what mobs are doing? WHO they are targeting and with WHAT?
Because that is the alternative we have today with the default Blizzard UI. Itâs simply not acceptable.
Please play a healer. And stop pretending like we are a DD with resources we spend like Rage or whatever.
The point is to burn the least amount of mana possible. Ideally, zero. If you can dispel something, and someone takes zero damage. It means you save mana. And a good healer should do that.
And if everyone is at 100% and nothing is happening⊠you just stand there and wait. You cannot heal someone above a 100% HP. So itâs irrelevant how complex your rotation is. If you stand there doing nothing, you press nothing.
Who said 0.5% of players? People wipe on Priory 1st pack on a +10 because of an overlap between Thunder Clap and ONE âSmiteâ or âShootâ from some random dude.
A +23 is impossible because the thunderclap 1-shots you. But everything else bellow it, its a matter of kicking the right thing at the right time. And people dying to combo-wombos because they fail to counter those things.
So its not the 0.5%. Its the 99.5% im talking about.
SL was boring. In low keys a moronic dog with half a leg could heal in low keys. And in high keys all your attention was focused on maximizing your DPS.
And no. DDs did not have self-healing. The reality is that damage in keys was too low.
That was not healing. That was a perversion.