Class Tuning Incoming – 20 December

[Ellipsìs-tarren-mill]

@Maxinmus-silvermoon

To me, all 4 say “Mythic Amirdrassil”

That’s the name of the web page overall because it’s how I opened the table. They’re each filtered for their respective difficulty.

[Sacrifer-thrall (Sacrifer)]

You can also look at Mythic Volocross but including all percentiles is distorting the statistics cause a bad DH player is simply doing more dps than a bad Frost Mage for example and you have tons of bad players in all percentiles.

[Ellipsìs-tarren-mill]

@Sacrifer-thrall

You can also look at Mythic Volocross but including all percentiles is distorting the statistics cause a bad DH player is simply doing more dps than a bad Frost Mage for example and you have tons of bad players in all percentiles.

Or you can know how to read box plots. The objective of the data I chose to link wasn’t to make DH look as bad as possible.

[Maxinmus-silvermoon]

@Ellipsìs-tarren-mill

That’s the name of the web page overall because it’s how I opened the table. They’re each filtered for their respective difficulty.

Well, that’s annoying, why do they do that?

@Ellipsìs-tarren-mill

The nerfs are almost exclusively targeting the spec’s AoE talents and builds, not single target. You’re the one who went on a meaningless tangent about some DH’s in your heroic PuG doing a lot of damage compared to the rest of the group.

Look, I can only go of my own experience in these things. But the group I was in was your average PVE raid group. Warcraft metres may tell me one thing, and they do support your side. The problem is that those people are at the top of their class, and you’ll never get that with pugs or even most guilds.

This is why a real raiding experience is always superior to a simple log.

[Sacrifer-thrall (Sacrifer)]

Well, my point from the beginning was just that DH is not even near top dps at bosses like that and any AoE nerf is also affecting singletarget dps. Besides that the Imo Aura nerf(s) is/are limiting build variations further and further.

With the upcoming buffs for several classes below DH and no significant nerfs for classes above DH, blizz will have to buff DH singletarget soon.

[Ellipsìs-tarren-mill]

@Maxinmus-silvermoon

The problem is that those people are at the top of their class

I linked you the entire data set, that was every single player who has killed that boss. The average is the thin grey line in the middle of the box and even that isn’t pulling away.

[Maxinmus-silvermoon]

@Ellipsìs-tarren-mill

I linked you the entire data set, that was every single player who has killed that boss.

Tons of people don’t log their runs. I know I don’t unless I want to examine my DPS.

Again, I’m just going off my personal experience after grinding heroic raids for about 4 weeks with pugs.

[Alewín-argent-dawn]

@Kaivax

Resonating Sphere once again applies Echo to the first 5 allies it passes through (was 3).

Excellent.

But isn’t this the second time this change was made and unmade? Could we admit it breaks the spec and not fiddle again pls?

[Pufosul-twisting-nether]

@Alessathrina-argent-dawn

if you so incist on having 4 buttons and no macros.

I don’t play havoc, but I’m always down for some math:

Buttons:

1. Fel Rush
2. Sigil of Flame
3. Chaos Strike
4. Eye beam
5. Immolation Aura
6. Essence Break
7. Vengeful Retreat
8. The Hunt
9. Imprison
10. Metamorphosis
11. Throw Glaive
12. Blade Dance
13. Those are the main ones and many other utility like Sigil of Misery, Fel Eruption, Netherwalk, Darkness, Chaos Nova, Consuma Magic, Elysian Decree if you go that route.

Macros:

1. Mouse over macros on Sigils and Meta
2. Focus modifiers on Disrupt, Imprison, Fel Eruption
3. Stop channeling macro
4. Meta without moving macro.

• you need to keep track of multiple auras like Immolation Aura stacks, Soulscar duration, Inertia, Initiative, in order to do real dmg and be good.

But yeah, DH is only 4 button class and no macros.

[Alessathrina-argent-dawn]

still laughable. on my druid and rogue at least 36 keybinds.

[Falsejaina-ragnaros]

Who cares, it’s three weeks in the season, your Io should be fine. And if you rerolled dh, just because they are op, well, sorry man.

But what about classes that were horrible for three whole weeks and especially compared to your OP spec? “Time to start doing some keys in week 4”? Sounds so EXCITING

[Falsejaina-ragnaros]

I meant the people who play DH tanks, playing it poorly.

[Falsejaina-ragnaros]

I see lots of ret paladins in pugs of my husband, 26 keys

[Ishayo-tarren-mill]

@Kaivax

• Mage
• Arcane
  • Arcane Blast damage increased by 6%. Does not apply to PvP.
  • Arcane Missiles damage increased by 10%. Does not apply to PvP.
• Fire
  • Fire Blast damage increased by 12%. Does not apply to PvP.
  • Pyroblast damage increased by 5%. Does not apply to PvP.
  • Fireball damage increased by 10%. Does not apply to PvP.
  • Flamestrike damage increased by 12%
  • Intensifying Flame now increases Ignite damage by 25% (was 15%).
• Frost
  • Frostbolt damage increased by 15%. Does not apply to PvP.
  • Ice Lance damage increased by 12%. Does not apply to PvP.
  • Flurry damage increased by 10%. Does not apply to PvP.
  • Glacial Spike damage increased by 6%. Does not apply to PvP.

You what?

I don’t think I’ve ever felt so much “all three specs are balanced with each other and it’s fun and viable at the top” as I do about the current mage.

Why are you fiddling with it? For once in this game’s life you actually managed to balance something perfectly. Just stop fiddling with everything for the love of God.

Yes, mages are bad for a single tier in raids due to single target damage. Oh no, the tragedy.

Can’t you just wait for TWW? I don’t wanna feel forced to play fire again.

[Chronormi-outland]

Ever since Temporal Anomaly’s rework in 10.0.5 Resonating Sphere started with 6 targets, then went down to 4, then up to 5, down to 3, and now up to 5 again.

If they want to nerf it I rather they nerf the percentage of the Echo applied rather than the number of players it applies to.

[Rt-ravenholdt]

@Kaivax

Mage

No man, I’m tired of seeing mages in M+.
I rather play with a edgy DH than a mage…

[Alewín-argent-dawn]

@Chronormi-outland

Ever since Temporal Anomaly’s rework in 10.0.5 Resonating Sphere started with 6 targets, then went down to 4, then up to 5, down to 3, and now up to 5 again.

Ah, thank you. I knew they had fiddled it somewhere along the lines but couldn’t remember where!

[Souldefiler-blades-edge (Souldefíler)]

@Shuì-draenor

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/79/66/db/7966db659e720b25bbe1053e3b8cc621.gif

Once again nothing for dks, please just announce a complete rework for them already.

Hahahahaha… HAHAHAHAHAHA…

Imagine thinking Blizzard gives a monkeys about DK’s…

@Dralkharn-draenor

No reworks until TWW, they confirmed it

Hahahahahaha… HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA…
Meanwhile. back in the real world.
Blizzard laughs at DK players and asks them why they aren’t playing the other classes.

@Moistswamp-frostmane

https://i.imgflip.com/89k31c.jpg

No I think this is more accurate, Blizzard on the left be like to Dk players on the right

“Aww sweetie… Next time. We promise…”

[Illexa-gehennas]

With this buff and nerfs im pretty sure that the patch writers dont even play the game or they have no idea whats going on in the game .
i dont know but every single game listens to players feedback except WOW , its been more than a month and whats we get as buff and nerfs .
Why are you so scared to do big buff and nerfs ? give us a big patches like who changes meta thats what makes the game alive

[Gloomfox-silvermoon]

You conveniently used “all percentile” statistics the give skewed numbers. You should use 80 or 90th percentile stats which would actually reflect the more serious end of players progressing in HC and Mythic.
90th percentile HC DH is the rank 5 and in Mythic 90th percentile its the 4. after the 3 rogue specs.
If you filter y 80th percentile everything stays the same except for enha shaman moving above DH in HC raid to the 5. place and DH is right there barely behind them on the 6. place and after that you can see a drop in dps to balance druid on the 7. spot and another drop to Fury warrior.

90th percentile HC the last 3 spec is Ret paladin WW monk and Aug evoker. Lets take out the last for now because augment suppose to be the new “support style” spec which suppose to be bad at dps.
If you compare DH to Ret paladin DH has 12.25% more dps
If you compare DH to WW monk DH has 14.3% more dps

If you compare the top 1 dps spec - Assa rogue -
Assa rogue has 19.91% more dps than ret paladin
Assa rogue has 22.1% more dps than Assa rogue

And you think this is okay?

Thank God WW monk will get some decent buffs which we can estimate it will push them to somewhere the 7th-8th spot probably well aligned with the pack there.
Ret paladin 3% aura buff if laughable and will keep them at the bottom especially when others get significant buffs and most of the nerfs are minor nerfs.

I wont even get into the M+ numbers …DH with these small nerfs will be still on the top especially in M+
But even if a spec would “fall” to the 13.-14. dps spot it would be perfectly fine in the middle of the pack of the top ~4 spec if not ahead with ~10-15% of the middle specs.
Beating others on the bottom with 15-20% is unacceptable.

Also this is few weeks into a new season and you mostly see tuning for season of discovery like retail player dont even matter anymore. Last reset there was 0 class tuning and this patch note is laughale for the most part.
Also not all mage spec is bad, arcane is at a good spot if you look at the 80th percentile+ players. Frost and Fire needs those buffs and WW needs it even more.
Ret paladins will stay at the bottom. I dont know why anyone still playing that spec because every single tier they are at the bottom or in the mid at best around the 14.-15. place. And this been going on since Legion. They are like the unwanted abandoned child of Blizzard devs that no one wants to look at and treat nice for some reason.
If you main ret you should just quit the game for a few months as a protest maybe Blizzard will start to care when a still popular dps spec suddenly drops in numbers.