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If that is what you are complaining about, the raid buff has nothing to do with it.

Raid buffs are designed to be a buff to the party you are in. Not to the shaman itself. So what you have to consider is : what is the DPS of the WHOLE raid I am in with, or without this buff.

If you are concerned about Elemental and Resto’s performance individually, then they need tuning. For example, an across the board flat % buff. THAT addresses spec tuning.

Op arguing with raiding shamans with twice the achievements :sob:

You’re comparing it to Intellect as if intellect affects everybody beneficially.

Your whole premise is just a whine with no real substance behind it.

People have posted how big it actually is, you know with facts and data and stuff. It’s far from ‘useless’. Just admit you learnt something and walk away. Or walk away.

Also you’re talking about a RAID buff, making it better for shamans (what!?) thats what class balancing is for…

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Shaman has way better group buffs or even utility than say some like rogue or hunter. Skufyry is huge, grounding is huge, self res and ressing others after wipe is huge… Too many to list honestly :sweat_smile:

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By that same rule you wouldn’t be able to talk either as you are ilvl 483 with no pvp or pve score.

Also there is no correlation between achievements, knowledge and right of speech and debate in a forum. Go back to your cave.

It affects the most important components by A LOT, the user himself and the healers, that’s why it got nerfed yesterday.

Big for who? Definitely not for the Shaman, because again, Elemental gains a miserable 1.1% or 1.5% at best if you count the random overloads.

Then again Mage pre nerf got 8%+, and Warriors, and Monks, and yare yare.

You guys are obsessed with the word “raid”. It literally doesn’t matter, it is a buff for the class itself which also happens to buff the party IF you have one.

It’s beyond stupid that the class that benefits the least from the buff is actually the user, there is no other class suffering from this crap.

I was 2nd best tank on Stormscale alliance back in wrath, and I’ve still got more achievements than you and I’ve pretty much missed two whole expansions

Yes, they saw your post and instantly nerfed it. Don’t mind that the reasoning is completely different then yours.

Seriously… a lot of people already told you that the other 2 spec is benefiting a lot more then you realize. At this point what you do is squirming or trolling and nothing more.

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I didn’t even play in Wrath, although my account is from 2008 I started playing consistently during BFA.

Congrats on getting achieves by running low level raids with a 480 character you are a true hero and you deserve a statue in Stormwind.

Oh and you’re also right about everything you tell me due to having 4-5k more achievements, good for you!

Yes and most of them are raid and dungeon achievements including the undaunted title which I can tell you couldn’t complete

Why put it in your topic title then? It’s a failure of communication from your side.

And I’ll repeat since you ignored it or missed it

Anyhoo, I’ll step out here. Kinda tired of debating balance with someone whose greatest raid achievement was dying 1 min into fyrakk.

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Balancing a class buff is part of class balancing, I don’t see the issue here but haters gonna hate.

The old reliable, when you can’t attack the argument, attack the person!

Interesting that you make fun of me dying (because healers were afk) on normal with a fresh 70 but you ignore that I got HC curve on season 3 which you haven’t even completed to this day.

I’ll tell you the same I told the other guy, go back to your cave.

I’m attacking your knowledge or lack of it.

And you died on the kill mentioned because you stood in bad, the damage you took from the dispellable dot was 900k and you received 400k healing. Again, this speaks to your credibility through knowledge (lack of) you don’t even know why you died.

What does a kill on normal Fyrakk with a fresh 70 Warlock have to do with Shaman mastery and class buff? You make no sense.

Stood in bad? there is no bad to stand on in Fyrakk :rofl: :rofl: there is an AoE which you run from and then the meteors that you drop on the ledges.

I died because healers didn’t do their job, I used my defensives and still died to a stupid dot, like I said they were afk.

How much HP do you think a fresh 70 has?

You see numbers and you don’t even know where they’re coming from, this is waste of time, just go away troll.

You are confused. Having the right of speech does not put you on par with someone with experience.

Wait a minute. You are talking about Windfury buff affecting the Shaman himself.

So what healers are you talking about ? Mages cant heal !!!

So you either talk about how Windfury affect the shaman individually, OR, we talk about how it affects the raid.

Choose your topic.

And for the reccord, Arcane Intelect was nerfed because of the effect it had in small parties (M+). Specifically how it stacks with Chaos Brand and Aug Evoker.

They are seeing the S1 meta turn into Exodia 2.0 and its thier way of avoiding that.

It has nothing to do with fairness or “balance”.

We ???

Im sorry. Who put the word “raid” in the title of this post ?

And why does Blizzard always call these type of buffs … “raid buffs” too… Let me refresh your mind :

Continuing the discussion from Feedback: Shamans:

You are really confused.

Earthliving Weapon / Flametonghe weapon is a Shaman Buff. Elemental Resistance is a Shaman Buff. Brimming with Life is a Shaman Buff.

Skyfury is not a Shaman Buff. Its a Raid buff. Its intention is 100% tuned arround the party and not the shaman itself.

There is no discussion about this.

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Napkin math: Assuming that as Resto I heal players when they’re on average at 70% hp and that 30% of my total healing is wasted as overhealing, then Skyfury is buffing my effective healing by 6% * 70% * (100%-30%) = 2.94%. The lower hp of my target and the better I am at avoiding overhealing, the more powerful it is.

Napkin math: All Mage specs get 8%+ damage from its buff pre-nerf. Ele Shaman gets 1.5% at best.

Since we’re comparing raid buffs on their own and we want to balance them, please give me some napkin math on how much Power Word: Fortitude increases our dps.

It gives 5% additional survival which in a lot of cases is even more important than damage.

Besides that, you’re comparing apples to wheels. Make a comparison damage buff vs damage buff.

A character less than ilvl470 shouldn’t be attempting M0 or above content. And at 470, a tank should easily have over 1500k.

How much more healing does Battle Shout give me?