Dear Blizzard

I’m making this post to address an issue with end game M+ I know that doesn’t concern 99.99% of the playerbase but it’s something that can improve the game a lot for future seasons and future expansions in the form of providing different comps for end game keys. Right now doing end game keys 30-33 requires you to have a specific comp (because of the buffs the classes provide). Theres many possible solutions to this either balance out the buffs between classes to be worth the same value because for example druid and priest buff are too strong compared to everything available. Or enable all buffs when players are doing m+ so we can see some more different comps viable for end game and not what u had during S2 of Dragonflight where everyone played the same comp.


That is one solution. I have been advocating for that type of homogenization for a long time. But the issue will still remain. The issue with such top keys is that even a 0.001% advantage is enough to cement the meta.

Take racials for example. They can be completely ignored in all forms of content. Except high end where people deliberately (or so I heard) race change for specific dungeons.

It would require fundamental changes to the game. Hence, unlikely we will ever see it.

However, there are things that can be done. One solution is to reward those who play an off-meta class more. One very effective way is tying the 0.1% title per spec. Not overall.

That way, its orders of magnitude easier to get the title. In my case for example, I am MILES away from the overall title. I cant compete.

However… from the Raider IO data. If I were to do it by spec, im top 0.11%. That is 3 28s and I qualify. And a 28 is not that difficult.

So it would reward your effort. And the stronger the meta is, the more rewarded you are. :slight_smile:

Another solution is tying MDI and other forms of competitive content to off-meta classes only. People copy what they see apparently. And Blizz can set the rules in their own turf. So I would do just that. Force the pros to play off meta, so everyone can see that in reality there are more than 1 comp (more than the FOTM comp).

There will always be a meta. But also, there is always more than 1 good comp.

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True story

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I mean it is basically just night elf and dwarfs/DI dwarfs.

The easiest to do would be just disable racials in M+ dungeons and rated pvp.
It cannot be balanced anyways.

I don’t think buffs are the only reason certain specs are invited.
we are in a survival meta, not in a dps meta.
Yes stamina is nice and dandy but it is better to have specs that are natural tanky and/or have high hp pools and nice def cds.

in bfa we basically had scrolls for every buff. It was weaker than its original but it didn’t change meta. You still took only certain classes.

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But why? Its only really relevant when you do +32s…

And I was not refering to the racials themselves. I was refering to the fact that I heard that top players race-change to a specific race (from dwarf to nelf) for specific dungeons.

So if they do Fall, they all race change to Nelf. If they do BRH they all race change to dwarf. Stuff along those lines.

Thing is, those players will find some absurd crazy thing to min-max that extra 0.001% edge.

Its racials today. It will be something else tomorrow.


Stamina buff is op 10% increase with the stat scaling atm is crazy it just lets you survive one shots that’s the purpose behind it

yes if there are dungeons that feature stupid stuff like crazy bleeds your that you can skip dangerous stuff with nelf, the top of the top is doing that just to be #1 on the RIO page.

regardless of the player level, Dwarf is very much the best race to play in m+ by a very large margin.
Next season with got uldaman again where dwarf is once again considered necessary for very high keys

yes for sure, but you can always stay close and close the gaps for this stuff.
Then again blizzard is happy if there are players throwing hundreds of $$ in their face for stupid stuff.

Why Dwarf? Because of the snake boss? Sure, dispelling the bleed once every 2 min is nice, but not game changer.

What I think is even more outrageous is the fact that Evokers (particularly Augs) can dispel bleeds. They should have never been able to. Bleeds were supposed to be the “nobody can dispel this” category.

And speaking of Uldaman, in S2 the elemental boss will be much more of a pain now that Priests are not meta, and have MD to a 2 min CD. That boss was trivialized because of MD. With out it, its gonna truck HARD…

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it is kinda bonkers if you have 4-5 dwarfs and classes like mage, evoker on top of it, making basically no bleed go out till the boss is dead.

besides it is also useful for the last boss and also for the fire boss now since the crapped mass dispel.

so yes, you said it yourself, a dwarf group in uldaman is SOOO valueable. Of course in pugging you will have almost never any dwarfs, so it doesn’t matter, but the potential is there and for TGP event you will also see 5 dwarfs again and of course live pushing will feature mostly dwarfs for that dungeon as well.

Meh… Uldaman will eventually get nerfed. I presume that it wasent because Exodia existed. But still. This time they wont have excuses.

As for the racials: For me its not a biggie. I will never do 30s and such because im too stubborn to rerol FOTM. And meta specs have a greater impact than racials.

wouldn’t hold my horses but it certainly is my most hated and least played dungeon and will continue in S4 as well ;/

yea, but I have 6 shamans, so I just choose the dwarf one to play it a bit higher.
Although i always forget that I have my racial and basically never use it lol

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You got the dedication I dont have… :smiley:

For me esthetics are important. And I get attached to particular toons. I only have 2 toons: Warrior and Shaman. Both FOrc.

I play FOrc since 2005. Back when it was the ugliest thing ever. Unlike today where everyone and their grandma has a FOrc.

I pay the price by playing maybe 1 key level under what I could. But its life. :slight_smile:

Well… I know blizzard will eventually do something about it. Unfortunately, if they do the same as in S3 with DOTI (nerf it 3 months into the season) then its frustrating to say the least.

If they behave like they did in S1, where the nerfs rolled in with just 1 or 2 weeks delay then… OK.

Stam buff is 5%.

The current meta has little to do with class buffs.

You’re essentially saying “please make all classes equally viable at the 0,01% range” (far above the 0,1% cut off range) which is just laughable. If you want to play at that level you move to whatever is best, you can’t reasonably expect the developer to make everything equal to the best.



and you know why ? because this time around 3rd affix dont kick in till +10 (old +20 ) .

this means you can get full mythic upgraded gear before even attempting teleports dungons with 3rd affix.

and anythign what happend above +20 is meaningless anyway .

nobody cares about tryharders - and its a good thing.

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For you maybe. Not for other people.

Also, you said it yourself. Nobody cares because there is nothing to gain from doing 20 and above. Other than enjoying the chalange.

If they change that (which they defenetly SHOULD) then its another story.

Also: This whole post is about keys >20. Look at what the OP said:

We were talking about endgame here. Including my comments about changing to Nelf. Your in the wrong post. :slight_smile:

endgame is lfr-mythic raiding and m+ 2-20 .

anything higher is by definition tryharding.

there will be lways mathematicly supperior meta there and there is nothing blizz can do to prevent it.

As if Mythic is not tryharding…

Because you say so. But OK.

If you would have read some comments above you would have seen that by changing the incentives you can make “less mathematically superior” comps more attractive.

You know what? I’ve changed my mind about the homogenization of BL and CR. I’ve been trying to get into mage lately because my group won’t have BL next season otherwise and it’s HARD. Give my ret pala BL as well as CR and I’ll be so happy. I can be a virtually unkillable, AOE pumping, CRing, BLing GOD. Screw all those weaker and more difficult to play classes. Just give me BL.

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But dont forget. Everyone else will have them too. :slight_smile:

So now, you dont need to look for a mage. Look for whatever spec best suits your comp. All melee? Works. All ranged and you as ret? Also.

You pick.

AND it will make balancing the “un-killable” part of Rets a bit easier on blizz. Knowing that they dont have to compensate for CR or BL or whatever…

They don’t anyway. Ret being tanky has only been a thing for a short time. It hasn’t had BL forever.