I hadn’t checked the DH talent tree yet, and decided to do so yesterday because I had a suspicion they didn’t have many active spells. And boy I was right.
My mind was blown way by the amount of passive talents their tree have. I’d say DH tree is like 80% composed by passive nodes. I think this is one of their biggest issues. They have too many passive bs embedded into their attacks. It’s actually sickening.
Why do they have two or three benefits embedded into a single button? I think the issue starts here. DH should have more keybinds, and have the space to do so. Having actual separate buttons/GCD to apply stuff they do, would make them at least require a little more skill and thoughtput. Like for example, how throw glaive can have like an absurd ammount of effects (snare, soulrend, direct damage, increases the damage taken by the target from a random school, burning wound, heals the DH with fodder, and it can increase chaos damage taken by 60%) - SEVEN passive effects embedded into a single ability. SEVEN!
It’s pretty comical. Even their PVP talent choices only have two active abilities. Everything else is passive
You can also play Sigil of Flame for a bit better fury regen. Thats 10 abilities without even including bigger CDs and defensives and utility and CC.
I know people love to be mad cause they die cause spec X is strong or easier than theirs but by all means, apply some logic. DH presses a lotta buttons and even more in PvE. And Devoker, Frost DK, BM/MM/Frostmage presses even less.
I mean what would be a good amount of abilities to press? 15? 12?
You think Sub rogues press many buttons cycling Shadowstrike & Eviscerate? You think my feral is pressing many buttons cycling Shred & Bite on kill windows? The list goes on and on.
Most of shadowlands DH was C tier… Im maining DH since S4 bfa and its nice being strong for once. Also they never had many viable compositions too play with. But no DH got a few more extra buttons. example : the hunt, sigil of flame, sigil of misery, essence break. And the talent tree enable you to add throw glave , Vengeful retreat and fel rush into the mix for your damage rotation for extra buffs.
When they introduced the class they wanted a more arcade feeling playstyle. This meant less, but more impactful abilities. When they made the DF trees they stuck to the initial design - instead of adding more abilities and complicating the rotation, they added passives to the existing abilities instead.
This overall makes the class stronger for beginners and the non-MMO crowd and is perfect for everyone wanting something simple, yet strong - the healing, most of the defensives etc. are all built in.
The Momentum Build currently seems to be the highest dmg build dh has yet. And with that its actally the build with the higher skillcap for the class than the other builds you have seen for dh in the past.
ofc the class is still easy to deal dmg but no class is really hard to dish out dmg anyways.
The whole point about that one is. They actually have many active spells that fit the actual avarage abilitie amount of most classes.
Since you can snapshot dmg with initiative, momentum and demon soul on your Soulrend bleeds.
With felblade, chaosstrike, bladedance, throw glaive, eyebeam and immolation aura aswell as using retreat to reset initiavite and trigger momentum as using felrush for triggering momentum aswell. It is quite global intensive for consistant pressing abilities.
So on a neutral base and pov from outside. The statement with dont have many active spells isnt really true.
I mean, like many classes have multuple passives in the talent tree that do stuff to their main spells.
Mobility buttons. And funny enough, with damage passively embedded into them
With the possibility of having at least SEVEN passive effects embedded into it, as shown above. Apply snare, damage increase, etc. with it. This could EASILY have been broken down into separate active abilities, like applying the snare, etc.
Your actual damage rotation, four of them with medium CDs, reducing ur rotation to two buttons for 80% of the time. With immo aura being as brainless as it gets. Just use it on CD mindlessly, and profit with its passive effect.
From the Talent Trees, how many talents do you have on ACTIVE abilities, and how many talents do you have on PASSIVE ones, on the ones you’ve picked?
They’ve been designed this way since they were introducted. And funny enough, they werent the first either. Chi Torpedo, Charge, just to name two.
Why would they button bloat classes even more though? This isnt exclusive to DH btw, other specs have a lot of power into single buttons aswell.
Literally any spec boils down to 2-3 buttons. Wake up.
And yet DH is still one of the more bloated specs in the Game right now when you look at it from a PvE perspective. And again, BM presses a lot less buttons in PvP, so does MM Hunter or a Frost Mage.
There’s a difference between button bloat, and having a thousand effects embedded into a button, which remoes any thoughtput into using them. Most specs have active abilities to apply snares, for example. It would make sense, if DH was a bloated class, which is not.
First of all, I’m not talking about pve - and even if I were, if you call a list of 5 spells, with half of them being medium mindless CDs as “bloated”, I just have to laugh.
Also, as Havoc, how many active talents do you have from your talent tree, and how many passive ones?
10 abilities you must use constantly during combat. Ofc some have a slightly longer cd, but that doesn’t change the fact that you have to use them, and use them properly. Name me one class with this many abilities/buttons that are mandatory for dmg rotation. You need 10 key binds just for dmg rotation.
My reply to you is above. It’s the same reply I’ve given to the other DH.
You’re enumerating mobility abilities/gap closers, which you’ll use regardless of anything, as some kind of complex CDs you need to use or something. In fact, the fact that you say you need to use those to generate xyz, proves my point on how you have too many passives embedded into your abilities
Literally 2 abilities in that list are only above 40 second CD.
Again, proven that you are absolutely clueless! Momentum was always difficult to play extremely well at high keys / in mythic progress and that did not change for a bit!
Really? You only argue that DH has too much passives into their single abilities, how about you list some that should be changed then without massively bloating the spec when it works fine the way it does?
So… Throw Glaive shouldnt snare… and it shouldnt proc a usually 50~ seconds demon… thats… it?
Regardless of whether it’s mobility, passive this or that, generate or not, complex or not (which is an individual thing btw), you have 10 abilities>buttons>key binds that you have to press constantly to do the most possible dmg, get it?
You say that the dh needs more active buttons, and I tell you, document and now repeat that your statement is stupid and meaningless to say the least. I understand that maybe it’s too much that in one ability for example throw glaive you have slow, 2 dots and instant dmg, but any further addition of active buttons for dh will lead to too many active buttons (if that’s not already the case). I really don’t know a class that has 10 active buttons for rotation, and I repeat, if you know one, pls let me know.
